Goodplaya: Wenger chants smear everything United say they stand for rant.
As Mike Dean and his assistant will well know, for 13 years Arsene Wenger has had to endure thousands upon thousands of people sing at him “sit down you paedophile” every time he stands up at Old Trafford. Presumably even the majority of Spurs and Chelsea fans think it beyond the pale because despite the tune being around for years, the only place you ever heard it song with any great gusto is Old Trafford. And we’re not talking about a small minority of the fans. We’re not even talking about only United’s vocal away following. It is thousands upon thousands of them. It is a vile, inhumnan [sic] chant when aimed at anyone.
Gunnerblog: “Sit down you paedophile. Just not there.”
It is remarkable that the press seem to have collectively decided to gloss over the abuse dished out by the Old Trafford crowd. It turns my stomach.
Which is weird because the press don’t gloss over Arsenal’s bad behaviour. They constantly criticise them for their homophobic behaviour towards their former player and youth team product, Ashley Cole. Oh no wait, it’s completely glossed over.
If you Google “Arsenal fans homophobic” there are the usual ten results on the first page. You will see an article written in The Mirror in response to the abuse Wenger received at our recent meeting, a couple of unrelated articles from an Arsenal blog, then several articles from gay websites and one broadsheet newspaper from three years ago! On the second and third pages there are no articles from any of the well known papers. Essentially, there is no coverage from the past three years and virtually none at all since Cole joined Chelsea.
Even more disturbing though is the media’s refusal to respond to the Munich chants, which occur both home and away when we play City, as well as when we face Liverpool. A couple of years ago, the Munich song started up from Liverpool’s end seconds before Rio Ferdinand rifled the ball in to the top corner (before doing his whole embarrassing ‘brap’ routine). Surely that was a perfect opportunity for the media to pick up on their behaviour, given that karma paid them back for it instantly!
Nine months after the Munich memorial game, where the City fans were quiet for a whole minute, we went to Wastelands and the songs and aeroplane arms were back. Did the media rip them apart for it? Course not. I didn’t see it get a mention and there were certainly no articles outlining the hypocrisy of these fans, who wanted pats on the back for respecting the minute’s silence earlier that year. This Arsenal idea that United fans are being protected by the media is bollocks, because City and Liverpool fans are in regards to their Munich songs, just as Arsenal are with their abusive chants for Cole. In fact, it only seems to be Spurs fans who the papers really go to town on, for their abuse of Sol Campbell, but I wouldn’t ever suggest this was something to do with the Arsenal biased London press.
Arsenal fans take their homophobic chants far and wide, singing them at home, singing them away, singing them in Europe, singing them on public transport. There were loads of Arsenal fans in Milan singing about Ashley Cole shagging men, Arsenal fans rising to their feet for the climatic ‘ten men went to bed, CUNTS’, the song is sung at Craven Cottage, and obviously at Stamford Bridge, the Emirates, they sing it on the night-bus home and on the tube. These just the first few examples I found on YouTube, so you’d imagine that in reality this is done on a much larger scale!
Still, their homophobic chants don’t get in the way of them taking the moral high ground in regards to United chants about Wenger being a paedophile. It’s not OK to call a father a paedophile, agreed, but apparently it is OK to call a married man gay. Got it. We’re not talking about a small minority of the fans. We’re not even talking about only Arsenal’s away following. It is thousands upon thousands of them.
It’s not just about whether he is gay or not, rather associating a person they hate with being gay, as if being gay is this disgusting and humiliating thing, and mockingly singing about all the men he’s shagged. The fact is, the bloke has a wife and to be jeering gay insults his direction is out of line.
So, in the aftermath of their cruel defeat, whereby one of their own players scored the winning goal for us, their fans went on the rampage. Not keen to take out their defeat on the people that cost them the game, Almunia and Diaby, they turned their attention to Amazon. Someone called ‘Fat Willy’ was selling United songs to download off Amazon, one of which being the Wenger paedo chant.
This blog wasn’t happy, neither was this one, or this one, or this one, you get the idea. How disgusting! I mean, no Arsenal fans would ‘do a Fat Willy’ and put abusive songs on the internet available to buy! Oh no wait, of course they would.
Let me introduce you to ‘The Away Boyz‘ who have spent time in the recording studio to produce their CD “AFC4U”. Their CD was being sold on match days and includes a song called “Ashley Cole is a Chelsea Batty Boy”.
I’ll give you a little taster of some of their lyrics:
Now you’re at Chelsea, you’ve got something to say, the whole of England knows you’re gay, because you walk that way.
Ashley you’re a Chelsea fag.
Ashley Cole is a Chelsea batty boy, he’s a Chelsea batty boy, he’s a Chelsea batty boy.
Whenever we see you, you know we’re gonna give you stick cos you’re a little Chelsea prick and you do suck dick.
You’re a fag, you’re a dick, you’re a knob, you’re a prick, and Mourinho’s crap, I bet you swallowed it.
These songs are easily downloadable on the internet, would you believe, and will set you back £1.50. Don’t get me wrong, I’m no fan of Ashley Cole. He’s a cunt and the fact he has Cheryl as a wife proves there is no God. But this homophobic attitude that radiates from Arsenal fans merely because they hate him isn’t on.
Interesting and somewhat related article by an Arsenal fan
So, what’s my point? Arsenal fans are worse than United fans? No, course not. But football fans can be wankers. They can be racist, they can be homophobic, they can mock the dead, they can wish death on players, and they can call people paedophiles. I’m not preaching or telling people what they should or shouldn’t sing about. Some songs are closer to the bone than others and people will make their own mind up on what they think is OK or not. I can give my opinion but I’m not here to be self-righteous or prescriptive. But given the disproportionate reaction to our Wenger songs and Amazon, you would think they were saints. In reality, their fans sing homophobic songs at a volume that they can be heard on telly and there are videos all over YouTube. I’m not saying all Arsenal fans are homophobic but equally, not all United fans sing the paedo song. Start a campaign to sort out your own fans’ behaviour! But the hypocrisy amongst all clubs’ fans will rage on…
artical read copy pasted and sent to talkback@the-sun.co.uk
Lost for words.
been gay (?) might not be the only reason they dont like a cole
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5CV9nwgnmaE
Tiny Tears – are you insinuating that it was a racist chant? Do me a favor please? It was so racist that the guy on the phone was laughing about it when he got off the phone. Must have been really horrible….
They were saying ‘you won the league in the 60’s in Black and White…’ – sounds really racist….
lol Scott,did you have to look for the photo of Cheryl?Did you just want us all to see it?
Great article.
I was talking to a Gooner mate the other day after the game and the obvious Paedophile chant came up.
I think it is totally out of order and unacceptable on such a big scale. I don’t think calling a man a Paedophile is the issue, it’s just name calling. It isn’t as nice on the people at the game who could have suffered at the hands of paedophiles though, which is where the problem starts and ends.
Comparing name calling and something that as actually happened such as Munich or Hillsborough, is again things on totally different levels. It is not on to compare name calling and a disaster such as the two mentioned.
The press only work in phases, if the buzz word for September is “Homophobic” then that’s all they will worry about. The fact that Lewis Hamilton’s reception in Spain was blown way out of proportion by the press in relation to their own standards, it is clear to see that certain prejudice is acceptable and some is not. Depending if it is fashionable or not.
The press are the scum. The fans are all as biased as each other and every team has the fans who are realistic and well balanced.
This article is good, in the way it doesn’t go out to drag any one down, it uses facts to allow us to laugh in their faces and for them to hang their heads.
Begeegs
im just posting what the guy who recorded it wrote in his discription that the targeted him because he was black,
nothing to do with me its not my video
Waiting for response, I bet you it won’t take up to 30 replies till this thread descends into “ha ha, United are in debt and Arsenal have good young players”, because that’s what they do best.
What does a’moral high ground’ mean. Holier than thou? I see no evidence of that in the links you gave. The paedophile chant cannot be excused by ‘you lot have worse chants against one of your former plyers’.
Bad logic, actually.
I don’t think it’s about seizing a moral high ground and I think it’s a shame that this issue has been reduced to an issue of the rivalry between the two clubs. I like to think that most right minded Arsenal fans would recognise the problem with the chants you pointed out, and the away boyz nonsense, just as most United fans would recognise the problem with the paedophile chant. I just see it as an issue of decency.
am sick of this media shit!!! they want insult to be thrown at us and we remain the good guys??
just a single chant that has been sang for over a decade start making headlines now we have beaten them??
I also think it’s a bit hard to claim hypocrisy when those crying foul over the paedophile abuse – those blog writers you mentioned, for instance – may have nothing to do with the chants you’ve mentioned. Perhaps you have a point in that we should turn our own blogs towards our own fans but our fans have had a go at our own fans before, notably that legal example in the Marina Hyde blog in the guardian on the matter, and the subsequent anonymous texting of stewards initiative.
Lads,
Politicaly correctness is in the spotlight. All supporters have insulting songs. For me insulting songs have a place in the sport!
To be honest, you want to do all you can to unsettle the other teams star players!
For me unsettleing Terry for Rooney to nip in and score a winner is iceing on the cake!
unsettleing Van Persie so he isnt playing to his full potential or normal standard is job done by the fans.
Dont get me wrong i know there are lines that shouldnt be crossed but its been part of footballfor years!
I for one would like some chants not sung although i really dont want them to take the passion out of the game. Politicaly correctness ruins the sport..
What i mean.
Players Getting booked for taking their shirts off when celebrating.. Come on! I want to see the moment of emotion when they are going nuts whilst we are celebrating too
Players jumping in the crowd when they score…. What harm does that do…..
Managers showing their emotion and kicking a bottle down the pitch not directed at anyone…. (WEnger sending off!)…. Its fantastic to watch.. Why stop it.. Id love to see that every week!
Lets just clean it up a little! But please dont take the passion away!
The people that have commented so far seems to have(very unsurprisigly) missed another point in the article, whether or not the media gloss over the United chants.
that is a long one
ashley cole is a wanker though
Couple of things really,
First of all, when news broke regarding Ashley Cole possibly taking part in homosexual acts it was a Man Utd fan that first started the name calling.
Secondly, Arsenal fans dislike for A. Cole is born of the fact that he met secretly with Chelsea and agreed a deal while still under contract at his boyhood club. The £20 notes baring Coles image are much more prevelant than any homophobic chants from gooners.
Say if Rooney met secretly with Mark Hughes to engineer a move for next season now, would you as fans appreciate that show of respect, or lack there of. Would you start calling him a granny f*****?
DM – Nobody is questioning the reasons behind your dislike of Cole. Christ, you don’t have to be an Arsenal fan to think he’s a complete cunt. But can I tell you all the reasons why I don’t like Wenger and then you can tell me it’s alright for me to chant at him that he’s a paedophile? I have a strong dislike for Drogba and I can tell you plenty of reasons why, would it then be OK for me to racially abuse him?
no one can claim the moral high ground because there will always be a proportion of fans willing to sing offensive songs; from old trafford, to anfield, to moss rose!
The media were writing in ANTICIPATION of chants by arsenal fans directed at Ashley Cole. The point these blogs were making is that the media have NEVER reported on the chants against Wenger despite them going on for over 10 years now. Ferguson saw fit to complain about security at emirates two seasons ago and it was well reported- I think the fact that wenger was ridiculously sent to the stands among the united fans who had been abusing him throughout the game was seen for its irony and this helped to focus on the chants much more than any media ‘campaign’ by arsenal fans.
Scott you obviously put alot of work into this article well done but don’t agree- we all feel the media are against us so it comes and goes
Writing as one of the Arsenal blogs who has highlighted the Wenger chants (and is quoted above):
Nobody denies the Cole chants exist and I don’t for a second argue our supporters are perfect. And of course I am biased, as are you.
But there is a clear difference between the Cole and Wenger chants and to say: “We’re not talking about a small minority of the fans. We’re not even talking about only Arsenal’s away following. It is thousands upon thousands of them” is simply untrue.
For example, the YouTube clip underlined “Emirates” reveals all of around 50 people singing it.
It is true that Ashley Cole will get thousands upon thousands of Arsenal fans singing he is a f*****g a******e. I think that’s fair comment.
The homophobic chants are the preserve of a couple of thousand (at most) travelling fans. At home you don’t hear it anywhere other than the one or two blocks where the majority of those travelling fans sit.
As it happens, there was a huge hu-ha in the press at the time of the first Chelsea v Arsenal game where Cole was a blue. The Times, Independent, Guardian, Mail, Mirror, Star and others all covered the story and Arsene Wenger’s repeated call for the songs not to be sung.
Furthermore, police announced Arsenal fans would actually be searched for homophobic materials on their way into Stamford Bridge. And quite right too.
So the argument that is ignored just does not stand up.
It should also be said that even on his second visit to the Emirates as a blue, the homophobic chants were dying out and with luck, before long, they will have vanished completely. The reality is the vast majority of fans don’t go for them.
By contrast, Wenger has had to put up with those chants for 13 odd years at Old Trafford. Either SKY’s microphones greatly exaggerate the sound or else the reality is that is is many, many thousands who sing the song and far more than taunt Cole with homophobic abuse.
Equally, time seems to have done nothing to diminish the popularity of the Wenger chants.
The reality is that until this week, press coverage was almost entirely non-existent. In fact the only time it got any was ironically when Fergie complained last year about a handful of fans behind the dugout at the Emirates giving him stick.
To my mind neither homophobic abuse or calling someone a paedophile is acceptable and I wouldn’t indulge in either. But it is one thing to question a man’s credentials as a husband and another to accuse him of a crime reviled almost above any other. That he has a daughter who must now be approaching the age where she knows exactly what these things mean hardly helps.
And by the way, inhuman is a word, so don’t put (sic) after it!
What exactly in the article don’t you agree with?
so essentially DM
you’ve reduced this to a matter of ”you started it” and hypotheticals
i see maturity has won the day yet again
plus comparing ROONEY to ashley cole? ludicrous
ill give you a minute to formulate a response shall i
@OTRed
Does the media Gloss over united chants?
The media are not stupid. Why would they pick a single club and pick out one of their abusive songs and slate them for it?
If you are saying that It is only United who have an abusive song that is sung then i would say.. Why havent the media slated them!
The media and all football fans know that their are songs that are sung at most football stadiums which are over the line!!
Absolutely spot on Scott. Getting fucking sick of these smug Arsenal cunts taking the moral high ground. STILL bitter after last weeks defeat. Calling the radio in droves this morning asking for Rooney to be “vilified” by the media for his “dive” yesterday. Even Citeh fans were sticking up for him. The fact that NOTHING is ever done about the Munich chants is a disgrace. When it happens again on the 20th really hope someone can get footage or Sky camera’s pan to them to finally show people what these scum cunts are about. Won’t happen though just like when they were all singing “Carlos Tevez is a blue he hates Munichs” outside Wastelands. The Sky reporter just said “Well the tunes familiar but we can’t make out what they are singing”. Course you fucking can.
Tom F – “The press only work in phases”"
“Depending if it is fashionable or not.”
Spot on pal.
I really think that some songs “survive” the test of time because they are easy to sing more than anything else.
I dont think the fans who sing “sit down you paedophile” really think it is clever or topical or even winding him up but it is just very sing-a-long friendly.
I wish it were not so but it will be around for a while yet.
I personnally think it would have been acceptable to sing this song to Wenger for half a dozen games when it was still relevant; specifically when the news story ran (by mistake and very briefly) that he was a pedo.
It was funny to make fun of how serious a mistake this was and would rightly help to laugh off the stigma and awfulness of such a flase accusation.
Unfortunately for Wenger its such a bloody catchy tune.
He would be well advised just to stay sat down.
I think the Cole chants are in bad taste, and do not support them in the slightest. There was a tabloid story about what he may or may not have recorded himself doing with in a three some that included another bloke which was the root of the comments about his sexuality, and while this does not justify homophobic remarks, these are not creations of the Emirates faithful.
There is no such link to AW.
The chants which were onsale on amazon were being sung by a significant proportion of old traford, the only one which is sung about ashley with the same level of volume is the one that suggests he is an F@#~ing arsehole, nowhere near as offensive as the nonsense that is on that dodgey CD you have quoted from, which is simply some dodgey geezer trying to make a living out of hate.
Fuck em…we will sing whatever we like ans so will they….talking about will not do any good
Scott i think its pathetic that you are actualy trying to justify such a disgusting chant. Arsenal also have a few bad apples, they are a disgrace to our club and ill never try to justify the things they do. I condemn hooliganism in our club, you should be doing the same. Dont encourage them to continue b/c fans from other clubs do it too. But then again youre a manc, i shouldnt be expecting you to have any class.
Big Goon – What the fuck are you on? Where are EARTH have I tried to justify the chant? Where have I encouraged it?
Clearly someone couldn’t be arsed to read the article so thought they would get on their high horse (odd behaviour from an Arsenal fan!) and make a twat out of themselves. Well done!
Goodplaya – if it’s not ignored, where are all these articles in all the papers you’ve just mentioned? They’re not showing up on Google.
If it’s not ignored, I imagine you’ve written an article on your own website to complain about the “vile and inhumane” chants sung at Cole? No?
Just because one video clip on YouTube at the Emirates (the first one I came across, I’m not going to spend all day browsing through YouTube for homophobic chants) shows 50 people singing it, it doesn’t mean it isn’t sung widely at your stadium. I’ve heard it on the telly at the Emirates when you’ve played Chelsea so at least be honest eh?
Regardless, the press ignore Munich chants and they’ve been going on for FAR loner than 13 years. The papers all praised City fans for not mocking the dead during the memorial game, as if becoming part of the human race for a day is something that deserves a pat on the back – but then all ignored the Munich chants that came 9 months later. I personally feel more sorry for the families of the 23 people who died in Munich than I do Wenger’s daughter, but that’s just my opinion. But don’t delude yourself in to feeling this is any special case where the press are concerned.
But we’re getting down to what is worse, eh? Is it worse to call someone a paedophile than it is to call someone a nigger? Is it worse to say a married footballer sucks cock than it is to say a single footballer takes it up the arse? Seriously. You’re trying to fit homophobic chants on to a scale of what is more vile and that’s pathetic. I wonder whether you’d feel the same way if United fans were chanting homophobic chants at one of your players? Lol OBVIOUSLY not.
“Inhuman” is a word, yes, “inhumnan” is not.
Scott – it seems bullethead had got you a few days ago, u seem to b trying to deny everything he accused u off in ur recent posts, has he touched a nerve?
Who is bullethead…?
Scott – Bullethead is exactly that , a “bullethead”. He claimed that the likes of gotta hate and Costas hang on your every word. Think he has been on before a while back under a different identity.
Oh right, lol, no idea who he is, cheers KE.
So no, he didn’t touch a nerve. I don’t recall ever reading one of his comments but if I have done, it clearly didn’t have much of an impact on me.
HAHAHA! Goodplaya was owned with the (sic) thing.Correct yourself before you correct others.
http://therepublikofmancunia.com/city-are-totally-hypocritical-but-i-hope-we-listen/
There you go,Scott.Look for bullethead.Was just reading the comments there.
No worries Scott, by the way some great posts on here today, particularly the last one to “goodplaya”.
Boogeyman – cheers. I had only read his first comment, didn’t see the rest of it. It’s a shame when people have their heads up their own arses like him. When I say “I hope our fans don’t racially abuse someone” he reads that as me saying “I am the voice of all United fans. Do what I say otherwise you won’t be a ‘top red’ like me!”
Sad little man.
Scott,great article.the gooners are still bitter about the result.You make a very valid point.its more disgusting thinking of the munich chants rather then the wenger ones.Also i m sure the gooners too must be abusing us and the players when we go to the emirates.just because AW was sent to the stands a big issue is being made of this now.it also gives the arsenal fans something to moan about.
No problem,Scott.
He did have a point tho, some of ur posts are condesending towards fellow fans, and some of the followers of this sight must b thinking of u while playin with their balls sy night, they love u so much.
U make a lot if good points and run a good blog, but surely if u lap up the praise heaped on you, you also have to respect someones opinion who is also a fellow red but doesn’t agree with u,
Barab – I said I don’t think we should racially abuse a player. If you and your friend bullethead find that condescending or disrespectful, then that’s your look out I’m afraid. If you disagree and think it IS acceptable to racially abuse other players, then I’m not going to respect that opinion. I’m not going to tell you to do otherwise, that’s up to you, but I’m not going to respect you for being racist.
Enough of this though. Feel free to e-mail me if you have any other point to make but let’s get back on topic.
Although i now think the wenger one is actually in bad taste on reflection, I have to admit that i have chuckled at some of the other wenger songs i have heard over the years in passing and in pubs…. just like i laughed when i heard the ashley cole ‘gay’ songs. Maybe i’m a bad/sick person or maybe i’ve gown a thick skin from hearing and seeing a lot worse following utd (especially from opposing fans). I think most utd fans know that wenger isn’t a paedophile and i guess most arsenal fans would say that ashley cole isn’t gay (as his wife is FAF) but like scott says, there is a ‘take it or leave it’ type humour in football that may or may not offend you.
The press haven’t glossed over it because its united. Like trevor has said, it happens everywhere (including the emirates) and they probably realise that it would be unfair if they singled one club out. I agree a line is perhaps crossed when thousands of people are calling someone a paedophile, and a laidback attitude to it might be a contributing factor to the uglier side of the game, but i do perhaps think arsenal fans might have glossed over the chanting themselves had they come away from old T with 3 points
andy dunn is in the news of the world today slagging off our fans for the wenger chant, another case of the abu media,
I think that there are sections of supporters from every club who sing chants that the majority of supporters do not agree with. Other than education and not joining in with these chants will they slowly but surely go away.
Personally I don’t think that saying Adebayors dad washes elephants is not a racist chant. But I don’t sing it because I think its a shite chant.
Again I do believe that saying Wenger is a padophile chant crosses that line. I choose not to sing it.
But what is the line? If we say chanting about “Adebayors dad washing elephants” is a racist chant. Isn’t saying “Park eats dogs in his home country” racist? Or saying “you scouse bastard!” Or perhaps even saying to the Geordies “We only speak fuckin English!” Where do we stop?
Manchester United are a global brand and is supported the world over.
We have foreign players of every colour and race.
I have been going to Old Trafford for a few years now and I have never heard chanting I have felt is of a racist nature. But I have heard chanting that I personally wouldn’t join in with.
We’ve all got thick fans who think its funny or clever to sing these kind of chants, and no fans can claim any kind of high ground. There’s hypocrisy in every aspect of football and debates like this will go on forever because no one can accept that everyone is to blame. Arsenal fans will call Cashley a fucking arsehole, a minority will call him gay. The non-homophobic abuse dished out to him at the Emirates is fair game in my opinion.
Lets see…
Jokingly singing a chant about a mistaken newspaper headline that mistakenly stated that a man was a paedophile – Yeah not great, but it is sung as a joke, nobody really believes the man is a paedophile. This isnt a defence of the song, merely me stating why the song is sung.
Singing that a trophy was win, and that your fans have never killed anybody in a football related incident. To borrow a line from Benitez, this song is based on facts.
SInging about the dead as though it was a great thing to happen. Mocking the dead is disgusting. The people who sing it are happy that innocent people, including one of their own, and the incident was a joyous occasion.
Singing about the colour of somebodys skin in a negative way. Pathetic, bottom of the barrel .
Singing a chant about a footballers sexuality because they left your club. The kind of chant you would expect a 12 year old to create. No offence to any 12 year olds.
well, points are made, well done Scott. Keep on with this, at least you are making a move.
In all honesty, its a bit sad that Arsenal fans have spent the week chasing all media and trying to get the issue highlighted. If anything, it will propbably increase the chants further, as Utd fans will know it gets to you.
The chants had died down over recent seasons and I dont recall hearing it sung at either champions league game last season or the last game at Old Trafford, the reason it was sung last week, was because Arsen was acting an idiot on the touchline.
Why do Arsenal fans still singa bout winning the league in Manchester? Do they think it bothers us? Given the times we have won it since, I dont give two hoots.
@Scottthered
As I’ve said, I fully understand that every club have a section of their support who sing things which I wouldn’t touch with a barge poll. There are a minority of Liverpool fans who sing about Munich, a minority of Chelsea fans who sing about Jews and a minority of Arsenal fans who sing about Cole. And also a minority of United fans who sing about Heysel and Hillsborough.
I think it wrong but I recognise that in those cases it is a minority, usually away from home whose attitudes are deeply entrenched and that to tar the club (whether it be United, Liverpool or Arsenal) and the vast majority of their fans with that brush would be unfair.
I wrote what I did because to my mind Arsene Wenger is not targeted by that very hard to police minority that every club has. He is abused by a quantity of Manchester United fans that amounts to a frankly very hefty slice of the home support.
If you want to argue the abuse at Old Trafford is on as wide a scale as the homophobic chanting directed towards Cole at the Emirates, I simply can’t accept that as being true. To accuse be of being dishonest is ridiculous. I also believe the anti-Cole homophobic abuse to be thankfully dying out as the vast majority of the crowd refuse to join in.
What I argued is that it is about time that happened at Old Trafford. About time what went on was acknowledged and that after 13 years of abuse it was acknowledged the situation shows little sign of improvement.
I do not claim a moral high ground, you are the only one speaking of such a thing. I’ll also add I can’t speak as an expert on the Munich chants, although personally the fact they exist has not escaped my notice.
As for players getting gay taunts, I remind you we had Freddie Ljungberg and Sol Campbell.
I’m unlikely to write any more here after this post because frankly we’ve both got better things to do than spiral into a fight for who can have the last word and I respect your view, even if I don’t agree with it.
But I’ll finish by going back to our main points. Mine is that the abuse Arsene Wenger suffers is disgusting and on a near unprecedented scale. I stand by that, don’t think I have been proved wrong and am disappointed you couldn’t just say: “Yes, it’s not on.”
Your main point was that homophobic abuse of Ashley Cole by Arsenal fans is ignored. The reality is the police took action at the very first game after he left. The reality is the club emailed supporters going to that game. And the reality is Arsene Wenger specifically pleaded for calm from Arsenal fans.
And the final reality is that it was covered by the ‘biased’ London press.
Here are just a few of those articles you couldn’t find.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/football/premier_league/arsenal/article665182.ece
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/top-stories/2006/12/09/cool-it-or-someone-could-die-115875-18235756/
http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/premier-league/police-called-in-to-prevent-arsenal-fans-abusing-cole-427684.html
https://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/1608/You-can%27t-taunt-Cole/
http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2006/sep/19/newsstory.sport3
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-421451/Dont-bash-Ash-plead-Arsenal.html
They cling onto 2002 like a used dildo – and then they accuse Ashley Cole of being gay!
Article 1 – December 9th, 2006
Article 2 – December 9th, 2006
Article 3 – December 9th, 2006
Article 4 – December 9th, 2006.
Article 5 – September 19th, 2006
Article 6 – December 8th (9.15pm), 2006
So you’ve got two days worth of articles referring to your homophobic chants when the song has been sung over a period of years? What do you think that proves exactly?
I’ll refer you back to what I said in my article: Essentially, there is no coverage from the past three years and virtually none at all since Cole joined Chelsea.
Your articles support that. Thank you.
Im not defending the peadophile chant, but its ot racist and its not homophobic.
How much different is it from singing “sit down pinochio”?
OK, am I the only one who doesn’t think it’s THAT bad??
First of all, everyone knows (including those who sing it) that AW ic CLEARLY NOT a pedophile.
The song is supposed to be about how AW buys a lot of young players, hence he’s a pedophile. Supposed to be a joke (not really funny).
But the fact that AW has been so successful with younger players, isn’t the joke more on the United fans who sing them rather than on AW himself??
I think Arsenal fans who are upset this are being a little ridiculous. OF course being accused of being a pedophile is terrible because it could ruins a man’s reputations, but NO ONE takes the chants of some drunken fans seriously (unless their morons.) I really don’t believe AW gets upset either, he knows what fans are like and it’s not as if they are something true..they are saying something so completely outrageous that it’s obviously BULLSHIT!
Personally I think the Ashley Cole gay chants are way more hurtful, because THEY COULD ACTUALLY BE TRUE. I seriously think the guy is in the closet, and to be constantly confronted with your secret is probably way devastating then some stupid, humourless United chant.
Scott, this is absolutley amazing! im out of words! what a good read!
@Scott : Bullethead is a twat and the comments by him clearly state he is jealous of you and your blog.
Get on with the game!
If there is something racist, the referee has the power to stop the match!
what abt when Spurs siing abt Berba:
Dimitarrrrrrr ooooh,
Dimitarrrrrrr ooooh,
Your dad washes windscreens,
On the North Circularrrrrrrrrr…
Londonieessss suck!
Think that everyone should just lighten the fuck up and stop being so politically correct. Noone is singing it maliciously or actually believes it, its just a catchy tune that gives people a chance to have a dig at the opposition. Whats the difference in singing “sit down you paedophile” to Wenger, or “you fat bastard” to Rooney? Do you think Rooney goes home crying to Coleen that the crowd thinks he’s overweight? Nope, and I seriously doubt that Wenger cares that fans are calling him a paedo either.
Sticks and stones.
well… at least our players dont head the ball into our own net…we dont need to chant about Wenger… Arsenal makes fun of themselves
Scott, terrific article yet again. But I fear there is absolutely no possibility of getting through to these arsenal “fans”. You gooners should read the “article” before actually commenting on the “article”. Scott’s points are undeniably valid. He is not trying to say United fans are better than you lot, he’s just trying to prove that you lot are absolutely delusional accusing us of being abusive when you lot are equally or even more abusive than we are.
And regarding “bullshithead”, if any individual agrees with him you need to run into a speeding semi truck. If you think calling for humane decency is the same as being a dictator, than you’re saying Martin Luther King is Hitler.
My opinion, taking the piss about someone being gay, child-lovers, or money grabbers is peanuts compared to taking the piss about someone’s father, brother, or son who have passed.
Wayne Rooney’s hair Said,
We used to have a player who made a habit of shooting at the wrong goal, but the arse’s gladly took him on board. For that I’m truly thankful.
Just reading onemanunited.wordpress.com’s comment, I’m curious is there really a mentality that Londoners see themselves as being untouchable or superior?
We have that here in Laos where we get a lot of butt jokes from our “neighbour country”. Its funny in a way, but its also sick.
I really hate political correctness with a passion. Its a pile of wank and double standards.
This issue is not about political correctness. Here’s why I think what you said was a load of bollocks.
Many people still make fun of gays but being gay is accepted in the majority of developed nations worldwide these days so calling someone gay is not really an offense as it was once. We all throw around that word casually and if you say otherwise, you’re just lying. This just falls under banter.
Let’s take the Munich and Hillsboro chants. They are deeply offensive to the dead but the fact remains that these people are dead and you can’t really hurt them in any way whatsoever. You can still offend their relatives, friends and family which is why I consider them as offensive and they don’t belong in football.
Now let’s move on to the paedophile chants. Being a pedo is a serious crime, being a gay isn’t. Being a pedo can get you sentenced to life probably in most cases. It ain’t a joke. There’s nothing to joke about here when you’re talking about someone molesting children. Wrongfully accusing someone of being a pedo will end you up in jail with a hefty fine, anywhere outside the ground. It can damage a person’s reputation for a lifetime. It can destroy and scar a person for a lifetime. And for thousands and thousands of your fans to sing it out loud like that, that’s a bloody disgrace. You can’t deny that. No sane person would deny that. Imagine what it must be like for his family to be a ground when they sing that.
@Scott
thanks for that mate..what a shot in the arm on a boring monday morning!!
“I’ll refer you back to what I said in my article: Essentially, there is no coverage from the past three years and virtually none at all since Cole joined Chelsea.
Your articles support that. Thank you.”
Hahahahahaha..I think Goodplaya just got served!!!!!
Good morning by the way..
liked the way CROoney has modified Bullethead15’s post though
Cole is arsenal business i have no say in that.. but our fans should not indulge in paedo chants PERIOD.
Hello there,
in fact on my blog I have openly criticised the Ashley Cole homphobic chants, I do not join in, they are pathetic and they are sung by a tiny minority of idiots which is thankfully reducing in numbers because most people are seeing the stupidity of their ways,
obviously that arsenal song above is beneath contempt,
however as goodplaya points out, the chants directed at wenger are sung by a much larger proportion of fans, it booms around the stadium, the ashley cole song never does, you can barely hear it when in the noisiest bit of the stadium,
i am sure you’ll deny this and claim the numbers are even, obviously i have no hard statistics to back this up, it just obvious to anyone who has heard both chants live,
either way your point broadly holds, there is some hypocrisy here, is try to avoid it and sometimes maybe i do become a bit of a hypocrite,
however the best thing we can do is criticise the morons amongst us who sing these pathetic songs,
so rather then entitle your piece about arsenal fans, i would prefer to see you concentrate more on the poor behaviour of a large proportion of your own fans,
i know the munich chants are indefensible, however if there weren’t so many rather unpleasant manu fans around then they would hardly ever be sung i reckon,
tit for tat will never make things better, you need to criticise your own and improve your own behaviour first, then others will follow
that’s what the high ground is all about
@1979gooner
tit for tat? i just think that the crowd was having some fun cos not every day do they get to see arsene standing in front of them..some of the chants were really bad but i think any other manager in arsene’s position would’ve gotten some stick as well..
guys, what is all this Pogba controversy??
I’ve been directed here by a post on Gunnerblog, and I’m sorry, but you’re scraping the barrel there. Calling someone queer and calling someone a paedophile are two totally different things. Being gay is not breaking the law. Being a paedophile is vile and punishable by imprisonment. I’m an Arsenal fan but have to say that Utd fans are generally well-behaved, as are Gooners. And furthermore, it’s not just Utd who sing that chant – Spurs have been singing it at every game for about the past 10 years (but that’s what you expect from Spurs fans, anyway). To be honest, I really don’t think Wenger gives a shit. What’s said at football games is a load of spur-of-the-moment nonsense – Wenger knows that, and so do the papers. I actually thought that considering Wenger was only a few feet away from hundreds of fans, the Utd supporters were pretty well-behaved and didn’t throw anything at our manager. However, you can’t put chants about being gay and chants about molesting children on the same spectrum. As well as the reasons stated above, you also have to consider that Ashely Cole is an awful human being whereas Wenger is actually a nice, principled guy. Plus, Ashely Cole DID get caught with a mobile phone in his pants – his wife even said so!
@dakota
hi.Le havre have accused us of tapping up pogba and offering his parents money so that he will join United and not le havre.like chelsea they want us to be punished and now have complained to fifa.here’s the article
http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2009/sep/07/paul-pogba-manchester-united
@ Big Goon
“But then again youre a manc, i shouldnt be expecting you to have any class.”
What a fantastic response. Well thought out, articulate (with good punctuation to boot) and not the slightest hint of bigotry.
By the way, what class are you talking about? The kind of class that encourages Arsenal fans to bombard every media outlet in the known universe with these ridiculous claims Rooney dived last week when the entire footballing world (that doesn’t include you lot, you tend to prefer ballet) knows it was a clear-cut pen? Or the kind of class asking for Rooney to be vilified because of what happened in the England game (asking the press to vilify someone, classy)? Maybe the kind of class is takes to throw pizzas after a defeat, No? What about the kind of class it takes to kick and punch an opponent after he missed a penalty? Spitting at a Hull coach, that type of class? Please enlighten us.
What a valuable contribution to the discussion about the ongoing problem of people singing these disgusting songs and the distress and shame it causes real supporters.
But then again, you’re a gooner, I shouldn’t expect you to know anything about singing songs at football matches or real supporters.
first of all i would certainly say that AW is not a Peado but a victim of the media who like to sell papers by writing stuff about wenger and writing stuff about Arsenal fans singing about cashley and united fans singing about wenger, the press are good at winding us all up for their financial game, i dont know about others but after my season ticket comes out i cant be arsed being touted for cash by a rag,
up in the stetford i admit there are alot of people who sing about Wenger, but each one sings it with a smile on their face having a laugh, i dont think that 1 single fan up there believes there is truth n the rumour.
as i said it is all sang in jest as a wind up, winding up the opposition is part of the fun/banter etc. i dont see united fans singing these songs with the pure hatred in their eyes/faces that you see liverpool or Citeh sing munich, the arsenal fans sing in jest at cashley, again no frothing saliva that i can see, Arsenal fans and united fans get let out at the same time at the end of the game to mix on the forecourt. i personally think the press are just winding things up and i am a little biased that some of the press are ABU’s and so i think that as we won by the skin of our teeth this would obviously annoy some journo’s so they obviously hit is in another way.
What a fucking bullshit headline.
Arsenal fans claiming moral high ground? Yeah there have been a few sad officious twats who write Arsenal blogs that have brought this up and the case of ‘Fat Willy’ has also been brought up.
I’ve said this before and I’ll say it again, every club has an percentage of moronic fans. Just because I support Arsenal it does not mean that I endorse and follow the behaviour all my fellow supporters, I’m sure the same applies to you following United. I go to a game and I will always see some kind of prick that follows the same team as me.
If I was to hear the Munich song at a ground I would appalled and upset not because I’m a United fan but because I can recognise the bad taste in mocking a tragedy. Same goes for hearing anti semetic or racist songs and the song sung about Wenger. The song about Wenger isn’t worse because I’m an Arsenal fan, I find it insulting because it so so moronic, and that’s what most of these songs are.
Either way that this has become a news story annoys me in itself. Wenger has never brought it up, probably because he realises the futility of it and it is water off a ducks back to him. That’s what most chants are to people who are in the game. I thought what Wenger did last week standing in front of the fans was pretty funny and your fans thought also.
p.s Tiny Tears, That video you posted of Arsenal fans abusing a black man? Total bullshit!! It was a chant being aimed at him and fellow ‘Spurs’ fans, and it all looked in pretty good humour to me.
@ Paul The Red
Yes mate, your spot. Yes songs do get sung about Ashley Cole and his mobile fone and when I saw your fans when Wenger was in front of them last week they were smiling they were not filled with hate ( maybe cos you had just fluked a 2-1 over us). Banter is part of the game, the media is an evil evil thing
i have no finger nails after last saturday, and sometimes the songs can be a little tension release
Its no wonder The Emirates is the most sterile, atmosphere lacking ground in the whole league, given the moral high ground and numptyness some of these Arsenal fans are taking.
@aig
thanks mate.
The kid anyway wants to come. So whats the big deal!
@Tufty
There are various reasons why Emirates is lacking atmosphere.
Yes Arsenal fans can be quite touchy but that can also be explained by the various backgrounds so many Arsenal fans come from.
Something also rarely discussed is the large number of fans from OTHER clubs that regulary attend our games, these include Man Utd fans. At one game I attended recently with five mates, I was the only Arsenal fan. The rest was made up of one Spurs, one Villa, two United and forget the other. I know loads of people who despite not being Gooners still manage to get tickets for games from mates who are etc. I’m sure this goes on at Old Trafford too, but this is bound to affect the atmosphere.
i don’t know about the emirates but at Old Trafford it all depends on where you sit….. or stand in my case
Simple solution…. Tell Wenger to stop touching kids.
That’s a joke! All football clubs’ fans chant horrible things and it is bound to upset people. I for one don’t give a flying fuck what the papers report on. I just don’t sing the songs that I feel are ‘distasteful’ and pitty those who think it’s clever too; be they United or Arsenal or any other team for that matter.
When I was 18 I dated a 16 year old for a month or so. Entirely legal but my mates still called me a paedo in jest, was I deeply offended at such a wild and slanderous accusation? No! As I knew it wasn’t true, I knew that they knew it wasn’t true, and it was all done with a bit of fun.
Its the same with the Wenger chant. Its not as if we’re calling the fucking police or mobbing his house accusing him of being a paedo and trying to villify him.
Arsenal fans call Ferguson an alcoholic as a joke. Alcoholism is a serious issue that can destroy lives, do we kick up a big fuss? No because its all a joke.
We call Scousers bin dippers, when the likelyhood is that most Scousers don’t actually eat out of bins. They call us Dirty Mancs, when the majority of Mancunians are infact quite cleanly folk who shower regularly. It’s all a bit of banter and a laugh and is part and parcel of being a football fan.
Every football team has chants which are bound to be slightly distasteful to some, but bloody hell its getting to the point where soon you’ll all be saying that we shouldn’t be swearing at footy games.
When you are mocking the dead, you are taking it too far. When you chant about players’ families, you are taking it too far. Taking the piss out of a player/manager by calling them a paedo, or gay, or fat, or ginger, or an alcoholic, its all for a bit of a laugh and done in jest, so lighten up and stop jumping on the media bandwagon.
While in no way advocating this type of chanting i cant help but notice other peculiarities. the wastelands lot have met with united officials to curb the chanting of the adebayor song, which i dont think is remotely racist as his father actually does work with elephants yet during the 50th anniversary of the munich air disaster city applied for the minutes silence to be made a minutes applause because of their “saints” which they call fans. Three of citys own died in that crash lest we remind ourselves. this will happen all over the country and were joking ourselves if we think that stadiums of 30000 plus will conform to sanctioned lyrics for 2 hours every weekend. i also notice how milwalls facist fans dont come up in these debates and yet again its the top clubs such as united and arsenal that are put in the spotlight. Whats worse incriminating chants or fans being stabbed outside pubs for the colour of jersey they wear?
This entire article is based on specious reasoning. You give your article an incorrect title by claiming arsenal fans are speaking from a moral high ground but yet you fail to prove how they do so.
I have read the majority of the blogs you reference and they were not claiming a moral high ground at all. Goodplaya and Gunnerblog were simply pointing out that the actions of people calling someone a paedophile who isn’t is wrong and shouldn’t happen. Just because other people call Ashley Cole gay or makes jokes about Munich does not make it acceptable to call Arsene a paedophile. You are mis-leading in your argument and not validating your point at all. I also think it is interesting that you use the example of things Liverpool, Spurs and Chelsea fans are doing to somehow prove that Arsenal fans are claiming this mythical high ground.
What do the Arsenal Away Boyz a group created for fans by fans have to do with a legtimate profit earning company such as Amazon.com? Once again you are comparing apples and oranges.
If you wanted to say that Arsenal fans shouldn’t complain about Arsense’s treatment because this is something that is happening at all clubs then your article might have made more sense.
Also for those people claiming Goodplaya “got served” or whatever term you feel the need to use-again you are incorrect. Scott asked for msdia examples and Playa gave him some. As we know the media’s interest in things last a day maybe a few days if the topic sells well. In the minds of the media the ashely cole chants have been covered there is nothing more to say. Goodplaya’s point was there has NEVER been coverage of the Wenger chants untill now.
If you want to tear other fans down, mock other bloggers or tell people they’ve gotten served you should probable make sure that you do it correctly. Your weak arguments and so called valid points may hold up with people who follow you blindly because you’re a man U fan but for those who exam your argument closely will realize all you are doing is pointing the finger at those who are simply pointing out the bad behaviour of your fellow fans. Perhaps I would have been more impressed if you had called your fellow fans out on the behaviour and got off your soap box.