A couple of weeks ago I gave readers of RoM the opportunity to pose questions for an Aon representative. Whilst wanting to get in to the nitty gritty, I was also mindful that any sponsor will be wary of what they can say about our owners. The fans want the Glazers out of the club and have made the club sponsors a target for boycott, putting pressure on them to pull out of deals with Manchester United, to encourage the Glazers to go, or face the negative reactions from reds towards them.
David Prosperi, the VP of Global Public Relations at Aon Coporation, has given us a few moments of his time to try and shed light on some of the fans’ concerns and without mentioning the “G” word, has talked about our debt, our fans and the ‘brand value’.
RoM: What will Aon be bringing into the club as an active sponsor rather than just a sponsor in name?
David Prosperi: Well, we want Aon to be seen as more than just a name on the shirt to the fans and supporters of Manchester United, and one of the ways we hope to do that is by supporting the tremendous community work that is done globally by Manchester United and the Manchester United Foundation. That is why we are kicking off our four-year sponsorship with a charity event at Old Trafford on June 1st, the first official day of our sponsorship. We will have about 150 representatives from Aon’s Manchester office and their families participating in a Penalty Kick Challenge with the proceeds going to The Christie charity in Manchester, a children’s cancer treatment facility in Manchester that has been supported previously by our Aon colleagues there as well as by the Manchester United Foundation. That same day, our 36,000 Aon colleagues who work in over 500 offices in more than 120 countries will be participating in what we are calling “Aon United REDy Day,” where they will contribute to a local charity or volunteer at a local event all for the chance to wear their Manchester United shirt or red clothing. We hope to engage in similar activities around the world over the course of our sponsorship.
RoM: Do you think season ticket holders should get more benefits from the sponsors? e.g. Aon give discounted insurance.
DP: We are exploring such possibilities but I do not have any details to offer at this time.
RoM: After the 4 year sponsorship deal, what do you expect to have achieved during the time with the club? Also do you see yourself staying longer than just the contracted 4 years?
DP: We have set four objectives that we hope to achieve as a result of our partnership with Manchester United: 1) We want to be able to use our sponsorship as an ‘amplifier’ to unite our firm worldwide; 2) We want to strengthen the power of Aon’s global brand; 3) We want to be able to grow our business in parts of the world where the Manchester United brand is very strong, such as Asia and Latin America; and, 4) We hope to achieve a more efficient, effective and globally coordinated global brand strategy as a result of our partnership. As to whether we see ourselves staying longer than just the current sponsorship, I do not have a crystal ball, but I think it is safe to say that we plan to do everything in our power to earn consideration from the club for such an opportunity.
RoM: Your company is now associated with a club against whose owners thousands of fans protest against each week. What’s that doing for your ‘brand value’?
DP: We think the passion of the Manchester United fans is part of what makes the brand so strong. What other team has such a large fan base outside of its own country? What other team sells more shirts than the entire 32 teams in the U.S. National Football League? What other team has aided brand awareness of 100 percent in Korea, 90 percent in China and 80 percent in Japan? What other team has over 60 million web page impressions per month? We think the brand value of Manchester United is of high quality and remains quite strong, and that its continued strength will allow Aon to grow our brand in a more powerful way than if we did it ourselves.
RoM: As fans we’re obviously concerned with the amount of debt the club is taking, rumoured from to be anywhere from £300m to £700m. As an insurance and risk management specialist does Aon see any opportunity to possibly restructure or free the club from the debt by any way possible?
DP: One of the things that attracted us to pursue the sponsorship opportunity is the passion of fans of Manchester United; the passion they have for the players and for the team to succeed and win. We also greatly admire the club’s desire for wining and for excellence, along with the fact that they have built a powerful brand with tremendous global reach. We think that the work that David Gill and his team are doing is great, and we do not see ourselves as being in a position to offer advice on financing or how to manage the club.
RoM: In the past Manchester United supporters’ groups have publicly criticised he club’s commercial partners. Are you in favour of this free speech?
DP: Aon is all about free speech and all about transparency. We believe in transparency in all of our dealings with our clients and we are all about providing them with the highest value for price. The reason we reached out to The Republik of Mancunia is that we want its readers to get a little better understanding of Aon, what we do as a firm and what we hope to accomplish as the shirt sponsor of Manchester United. We hope that dialogue can continue over the course of the sponsorship. We understand that there will always be differences of opinion and we respect the rights of the fans of Manchester United to voice their opinions. That is where their passion comes from. As long as free speech is based on the facts, then we can always agree to disagree on certain issues.
Aon made this investment in Manchester United because we felt we could not find a better partner who shares our values of leadership, teamwork and a passion for excellence. We think that the quote by Sir Matt Busby truly captures the spirit of our partnership with Manchester United: “At United, we strive for perfection. And if we fail, then we might just have to settle for excellence.” I hope that over the course of our partnership the followers of The Republik of Mancunia will come to agree with us.
Man Utd News 24/7
When is the new shirt coming out?
Also, have you read what Gill has said about the “visible minority” of fans protesting!
Good interview.Good to see that they are straight forward AND not saying any unnecessary things .
Hope we win many trophies with this sponsorship.
UNITED FOREVER.
Thanks Scott an interesting read .
pure politician answers
keep everyone sweet
top interview thou
Reading Gill ‘s statements on Green and Gold protests one wonders why does he have this urge to alienate himself from fans. Can’t he be a little more diplomatic. This should make us even more determined not only to get rid of Glazers but him as well!
WHOEVER SUPPORTS MANCHESTER UNITED AND SIR ALEX FERGUSON, HAVE MY CONFIDENCE. NO DOUBT!!!
as a public relations professional, i can tell u this is nothing but sanitized corporate speak…
he says “One of the things that attracted us to pursue the sponsorship opportunity is the passion of fans of Manchester United; the passion they have for the players and for the team to succeed and win.”
pure jargon…its all about the brand recall and revenues they can draw from this association. not that they shudnt have a commercial angle, after all its a business they are running. at least he’s done his homework and used Sir Matt Busby’s quote, helps to connect with the fans im sure
wow never read that quote before
“At United, we strive for perfection. And if we fail, then we might just have to settle for excellence.”
great read!
@Xyth yeah i agree with you. Gill used to be opposing the Glazer ownership so much
I know it’s a sign of the times but does he really have to refer to Utd as a “brand”? We’re not a brand like Nike, Adidas, Maccy Ds etc, we’re a f**kin’ FOOTBALL CLUB with passionate fans who live and breath for the team. Just PR bollocks if you ask me….
I don’t understand the critisism aimed at Gill this time. The Green and Gold is in the minority. For all you watching at home SKY (under the bitter Murdoch) zooms in on portions of fans with the Green and Gold atire. If you go to the games you’d see its very much in the minority. ALSO Red is a dire colour, it blends in with lots of other muted colours and of course all the other red shirts. When flashes of yellow and green are amongst it it shows out more clearly and looks to be more prominent than it actually is, a bit like a speck on a turd or a skidmark on a white sheet. The minority certainly shows up.
On a more interesting note I’d like to know what NIKE are going to do about the copying of their shirt by the Green and Gold campaign (same as home shirt with Green and Gold). That certainly must be taken as copyright infringement. If NIKE don’t take it up then I think United should consider NIKEs possition as Uniteds shirt maker very seriously.
Sorry Scott, I do appologise – good article – good read your the only one (blog) who goes that little bit deeper and considers the club as a whole.
@exiledred
whether you want to accept it or not, Man Utd is a powerful brand and there is no better way for Aon to gain visibility in the emerging markets like Asia and Latin America than be associated with our brand. Just look at the experience of Sharp after its association with the club terminated.
GoatinaUnitedShirt
When we had the Green’n'Gold shirts, they were Umbro, not Nike.
Goat…. The copyright would only be for a red, white, black, and turqoise shirt, with the black, and red chevron! It wont include all colours of shirt and all chevrons! If that were the case, teams like St Helens Rugby League Club would be having law suits thrown at them too!
what the hell is wrong with Aon wanting to increase their awareness! its a sponsorship not a donation and you’d expect them to want something back in return for £20 odd million a season !
And yeah the guys answers were very political but cut him some slack..was anyone expecting him to say the Glazers are wankers ?!
It would be great if they offered season ticket holders some sort of benefit and would really underline their commitment and turn their words into action (i’m not a season ticket holder myself)
Glazers just issued statement saying club isn’t for sale
Why can’t they invest their own money in the club and pay of the debt
Scumbags
Hello Kanchelskis.
I didnt realise that sorry, So am I safe to assume that Umbro have plagiarised NIKE ??
mikekelly12
Mikekelly didnt the shirt have a united badge on it. Ive only seen a few but with jackets over the top. Surely if the united badge is present and in the right possition it can be regarded as a copy. Ive seen AIG on them, was AIG involved with the Green and Gold? Also if the United badge is present than that is copyright infringement.
GoatinaUnitedShirt
What do you mean Umbro plagiarised Nike? Umbro made our shirts before Nike did…
Well, with such consummate skills of question avoidance Mr Prosperi can always fall back on a career in politics if it goes tits up at Aon.
I’ve never heard such a slew of banal corporate shite in my life – no real fan gives a fuck about these chumps or their services. They’ve just latched onto the United behemoth – we shouldn’t expect any meaningful sentiment from them about average fans. The Glazer ownership is of no consequence to their particular objective at this moment in time, as such the level of antipathy from the fans is equally of no concern.
Funny to see David Gill in the Times and elsewhere this morning slagging off green and gold and the Red Knights. Apparently we’re a minority of fans (lol!) and within that small tranche of disaffected fans only a minority of them actually understand why they’re doing what they’re doing.
Gill – you are a patronising cunt. You know what happens to traitors who get on the wrong side of history….
If the Red Knights ever do get their arses into gear and buy the club I heartily look forward to seeing you fucked off into the obscurity you so richly deserve you Quisling bastard.
I don’t get why you would buy a Green/Gold chevron top anyway. They look like shit and aren’t Newton Heath’s kit.
Total bullshit artist. Pointless exercise in inanity.
GoatinaUnitedShirt –
‘If you go to the games you’d see its very much in the minority’ (referring to green and gold)
Which makes me think, do you to to the games???
I would agree that not everyone is dressed in green and gold from head to toe but most people are wearing the scarf at least!
kanchelskis says:
GoatinaUnitedShirt
What do you mean Umbro plagiarised Nike? Umbro made our shirts before Nike did…
The Green and Gold shirt had achevron on it, AIG sponsering, United badge? If Umbro want to Green and Gold an old Umbro kit they can do as long as they have permission from Manchester United. Umbro do not have the right to copy a NIKE kit just because they made kits before them. Your comment Im affraid just didn’t make sense. The Green and Gold kit was a replica 2009-2010 kit with colours changed.
@GTull
I go to the odd game, living a thousand + miles away doesnt help. But when Ive been I can tell you the Green and Gold are very much the minority. Theres no need to be defensive, Im not pro Glazer I just like things being done properly and without damage to my club.
lot of shit!
GoatinaUnitedShirt
Crossed wires.
I was talking about our Green’n'Gold kit from 93/94 or whenever it was. Which was made by Umbro.
Umbro aren’t making the protest shirts…
…obviously.
@kanchelskis
Oh right i thought there was something wrong with you, lol. Makes sense now.
Good interview Scott.
Look forward to seeing this new Gill interview people are talking about. WIth the collapse of the Red Knights (whoever the fuck they were) it will be interesting to see where the protest goes. Im all for more transparancy, im all for Green and Gold, but I can also see why the Glaziers don’t show their entire hand. Why should they considering they’re running a lucrative Business in a highly competitive market? MUST advising supporters to boycott games before a real offer was put on the table was borderline exploitive. The Red Knights don’t give a fuck about you, the sooner Supporters understand that the better.
We should demand to know more about our Debt, and we should know more about what plans are in place to Clear it, of course we should, but adopting a stance of ABG (Anybody But Glazier) is naive and dangerous. Would you want Abramovich stepping in? How about that Thai fella? How about that lovely english bloke at Newcastle? How about MURDOCH?
Right now, the Glaziers have Alec’s support and I doubt he would take shit from anybody at this late stage in his Career, so his opinion is more than enough for me at this stage. Our Protests should be based on Facts, but even in this interview ROM stated “the debt is rumoured to be anywhere between 300million and 700million” So even now our level of “crippling debt” is unknown. How can supporters be lead by ANONYMOUS PEOPLE to boycott their own Club without knowing exactly what they are Protestng? You could be backing MURDOCH for all you know. Considering the Red Knights were paper tigers all along its interesting that the Media carried their “story” so authoritatively. Its just my opinion but Gill should be forced to do an interview with MUST so a few simple questions can be asked, like how much debt did we accrue in the first place? how much have we already paid? how much do we have left to pay? how long is it going to take to Clear everythng? These are Basic Questions we should all already know. Protesting against the Glaziers, giving up Season Tickets, Advocating Boycotting European Games…. this is all pointless if you don’t know exactly what your Protesting. Just protesting against the Glaziers isn’t enough, the Red Knights could be the Bush and Saudi Family for all you know. I know who I’d prefer. I understand the HATE towards Glaziers believe me, I just don’t understand the blind faith people place in the Red Knights. Firm believeer in the Devil you know. I think MUST have let people down by not being honest about who the Red Knights are. MUST will protect their identities, but at the same time encourage supporters to attack the Identity of Manchester United with Boycotts and divisive Protests? Green and Gold until we’re Told how much we Owe. Sorry but “between 300 million and 700 million” doesn’t cut it for me I want a FIGURE.
@PAUL PARKER
Xcellent post mate.Totally agree with you about red knighhts.Without knowing about anybout we should not support them.
I
Its very surprising that some people would boycott the matches.I want to ask them what kind of supporters are you.I dont love glazer and i also dont hate him just because of fergie.I dont think fergie would lie and just support glazer even if they are harming our club.
I just hope best people owns united.
UNITED TILL I DIE.
@Paul Parker
I am also for the green and gold campaign but at the same time I am highly sceptical about the so called Red Knights. We don’t even know who they are.
http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11667_6176470,00.html
This says that United have increased revenues in all areas other than matchday revenue. Also not sure what the satellite commercial arm in London is?
http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11667_6176158,00.html
Gill has said that United have approx £95 million in cash but how much of that is given to SAF nobody knows. He is also gorwing tired of the green and gold campaign calling it a minority of people. Last time I was at Old Trafford I’d say about 85% of people were wearing green and gold.
United not for sale says the Glazers.
Gill says Minority. Oh Fuck it!
They stay we’re doomed!
Choose sides AON.
The fans or the Glazers.
What a quote by Sir Matt. Good interview if not a bit shallow. Not blaming you like Scott mate.
HOT NEWS, OFF TOPIC
City to sign EVERYONE. hahahahah
http://www.goal.com/en-india/news/article?contentId=1946726g
atleast jose is sensible enough o realise he wont get to coach rooney until he comes to United
people who think united will be doomed should know that even today we are in a very good state than many other clubs.We are performing much better than the likes of ac milan,real madrid ,ou r mindless neighbour man shitty ,liverpools etc but still people think we would be doomed and finish outside top 4.
I guarentee know one would have really cared about these debts or glazers if we buy players regularly.People think the teams which buy players are rich and which doesnt are poor.I Know this 100% that united would be always a dominating team.
paul parker.good well thought out post,should we strive to bring the coloured braces boys into ownership of the club and dump the Glazers.I mean how untrustworthy could some forty odd London stock market spivs be?It’s not like their main aim in life is fill their pockets is it.Thing is Who is it that runs Must that associates with that type.
Good interview Scott. You hit the right subjects in your questions.
Also great post @Paul Parker. I don’t wear green & gold at OT but accept others right to. I do think it will become more and more devisive though and not sure the players really like it. (Interseting that Ben Foster waited until after he went to say this.)
No business tells it’s whole story to the world but Fergie has probably as good an idea as anyone. The clubs debt will never be understood by at least 90% of our fans. That’s not because they’re stupid … it’s because it’s fu*king complicated!!
That leaves one option …… Trust Fergie!!
LU -IFIT
@Xyth
Look at what Gill says in full though. He is expressing an opinion that many people here have also expressed and thats that of those taking part in the G&G there is only a small percentage who are really protesting about something they understand or actually fully believe in. Most are just going along with the crowd or are simply being caught up in the senstationlist nature of some of the ‘claims’ about the Glazer.
On match day the Green andf Gold wearers can be seen in the droves buying official merchandise and we see on this site so many of the ‘Anti Glazer’ crowd are clinging onto the over the top claims and the spin from the media and MUST and who. So there really isn’t many who actually believe in the cause AND who come from a neutral pov and listen to both sides and all the information to make up their minds so that their view is balanced.
Its easy to once again take a brief soundbite from what he says and attack him, just as people have with Foster recently but READ what he says and it makes alot of sense and as I have said its things which some of the most Anti Glazer people here have stated
~The way to get rid of the Glaziers and the debt is to find a new owner, not get rid of the existing owners~
By the way, who is in charge of MUST anyway? Why are they the ones trying to have a say about our club? If the ideal is to have fan control, MUST contradicts this ideal because it is trying to hide stuff (ie the identities of RK), and making and fanning decisions against the club. So even if a new owner takes over, will MUST fan the flames again if things are not going with their way?
@Sayyid
As I have stated previously when you include the £175mill PIK loans (which are in the Glazers name so are still personal investments) they have invested over 400mill into buying the club.
On top of that they have passed on the Final PLC dividend and then every year of Dividend they have been entitled. The results today also suggest the reports that they weren’t taking the 70mill they were entitled under the bond issue (They may still take it but at the same time they might not. Until they do we cant assume they will)
By passing on these dividends they are effectivly reinvesting in the club, atm thats to the tune of 100mill and while they don’t take the 70mill out that actually 170mill.
What more do you want them to do, sell off all their assets and give united the money and take no return? If they do ‘invest’ to pay off the debts it would only be the way Abramovich, the Shieks and Lerner has done and swap debt for equity so they would get a guaranteed dividend each year, a dividend that wasn’t profit linked. And paying the bonds off early would cost significantly so the personal investment to pay the bonds off would be higher so the preferential dividend payments would probally be greater than the interest on the bonds
@Paul Parker
The problem is he would be hijacked in any Interview just as he was a few months back where someone with a stance that they refuse to budge from and an agenda to push will just keep on and not let the answers to be given if it doesn’t fit in with their belief. Plus could we really trust MUST to not spin it and twist it, just look at the figures they got Andersred to put together on the ‘Cost of the Glazers’ which they are now using as propaganda. Sure the figures are technically right but its full of none cash losses that actually have REAL savings for the club (89mill in corporation tax alone) and they don’t provide any context due to ignoring the increased revenue OR any context by highlighting how those costs compare to not only other football clubs but business in general.
And on the debt figure. The figures today show its £520mill, down from £540mill. And on the books thats a debt of £425mill (as there is £95mill of cash in the bank)
I do not think there is any united fan in the world who supports the glazers but let’s be honest the debt is believed to be between 300 700 m so we don’t even know the value of our debt.please don’t give your season tickets the fact that gill is talking so much about our green an gold campaign means that it bothers him.has anyone heard about the new uefa rules city and Chelsea are really threatned.btw totally agree with paul Parker comments.
@Wakey
I am no financial expert but you do not need to be one to understand that a huge chunk of the club’s profits is being used to service Glazer debt.
Is this the same Gill who was very outspoken against Glazers just before they took over? If the deal was bad for United then, it is even worse now. No matter how one spins it, the fact that we are £800m in debt cannot be good for the club and majority of fans know that.
I hate to think what may happen if we have a bad season or two?
I meant give up.
David gill is trying to save his job so there is no, point reading much into what he says or blaming him. The only good thing about the glazer regime has been the fact that they have allowed fergie to run the club the way he wants and not interfered in anything. While SAF has money to spend its clear that with the emergence of city and obnoxious spending or real madrid, we dont have the financial ability to compete with them. hence the emphasis on youth will be even more important in the years to come
niceee aon , you’ll look good on our shirt
Personally, I didn’t believe much of what David Gill said. And if we do have 95 million cash, announing it like that won’t do us any favours in this enflated transfer market. Not that I am expecting us to make anything makor this summer.
*major*
@Xyth
Yes in theory you are right a large chunck of cash is being used to service the debt tied up in the bonds HOWEVER in reality its just not that simple.
You have to ask yourself the following
1) Would the massive increases in revenue have happened under the PLC. They were notoriously slow to take advantage of any opertunity, hence why there were people circiling to takeover if they could get the money together. Not to mention the operations were bloated which the Glazers have managed to streamline into a much more efficent business
2) If the Glazers hadn’t taken a leveraged route and had found the money themselves (via leveraging against other assets or even selling on other assets) would they have been so happy to keep passing on dividends? They really could have taken much more than the £13mill of management fees as would have any new owner. Even the PLC would have been paying out a heft chunck of dividends if they could have got revenue figures anywhere near the Glazers level
As for Gill, people keep taking his comment about the Glazer takeover out of context. His comment was about an initial offer to take over earlier and not the one that went through. By all accounts this first one was alot more agressive and loaded with debt than the one that went through
And the figures not £800mill, its £520mill and people need to stop lumping the PIK loans into it. I was talking to an acquittance in the US the other day about a business matter and he was actually telling me that in the States the Interest is tax deductible so it can actually be better for them to keep the pik debt, let the interest roll up and invest the capital elsewhere. Done correctly you then end up making money when the loans mature rather than lose it.
As for being in debt not being good, pretty much every successful company is in debt. Cash flow and ensuring it doesn’t grow out of control is the more important factor
I’ve read that Gill thinks the Green and Gold campaign will just fade away, I don’t think he’s seen anything yet
Drasdo has destroyed MUST’s credibility by hitching his wagon to the Red Knights. A pitiful group of city blood-suckers masquerading as fans. The fact they were able to fool as many United fans as they did is an embarrassment. Paul Parker has it spot-on. A group of anonymous, shady investors promising the world and delivering nothing. Their sole and only interest is their own profits. They are no different to the Glazers. Wake up.
Drasdo’s latest response to the Glazer’s “not for sale” statement is childish and desperate. MUST is dead, the Red Knights are dead, the Glazers are here to stay. We might not like it but we have to accept it.
@GoatinaUnitedShirt
I can only assume when you say ‘the odd game’ the last one was a while ago.
sorry glazers( and david gill for that matter) but action speaks louder then words we aint buying into your crap, DO NOT RENEW, STARVE THE GLAZERS, it’s the only way. UTD TILL I DIEEEEE
I wonder what David Gill has to do to become more believable. I don’t get the comments made to the effect that he is just trying to save his job. Look at the commercial successes of the marketing team in the recent past. More than 200 million worth of commercial deals have been struck. I wouldn’t be surprised if he we struck another deal in Mexico soon either. The change in business plan to move from global partnerships to regional ones has been a master stroke (To be fair the Glazers thought of that). But the implementation thus far has been good. Read a recent article where the F1 marketing team are looking at the Man Utd model and looking to emulate that in the future.
We can’t wish away the debt at this stage. It has to be dealt with and I have more faith in the current team led by David Gill than in a bunch of people who called themselves the red knights and allegedly started fighting amongst themselves even before making a bid. The less said about MUST in the entire affair, the better.
Off topic, I wish Gill would shut the fuck up with his comments – having a pop at the supporters of the green and gold campaign. We all know he licks the Glazers arseholes so he can keep his job. Such a two faced wanker. He is also clearly telling porkies about Fergie having money to spend in the transfer market.
Goatinaunitedshirt – don’t know what games you’ve been attending but as a season ticket holder I would say that G&G scarves were definitely not worn by the minority – especially as the season progressed. In fact I remember one of my mates who isn’t a regular at OT these days commenting after the match that they couldn’t believe the amount of fans in G&G – after the Chelsea game if memory serves.
In fact, towards the end of last season, going off the amount of dimwits wearing G&G scarves whilst carrying around megastore bags, they were obviously being worn daytrippers with little or no understanding of the campaign at all .
GTull – well said mate.
off topic and I bring peace guys
this guy is mental , anyone read this
http://www.goal.com/en/news/12/spain/2010/05/28/1947382/real-madrid-coach-to-be-jose-mourinho-in-extensive-interview
Am a Glazer apologist and i make no apologies for that. Fans commenting here think they know what it takes to run a multi national corp like united. How wrong all of u are. Am glad glazers have said they are not selling at whatever price. Get over it.
slim – Yeah his best line in that interview was the following :
“but that I am also capable of leaving a foundation for the future”
Yes of course you are Jose, of course you are.
arijc – Good post mate.
Interesting angle from Mr Prosperi and massaging the fans with thought through words.
AON = in Gaelic means ONENESS/UNITY, there is an irony in this logo being on a Manchester United kit at this current moment in time.
Anybody who forgets the truth can I kindly direct you to the Financial times an independent and unbiased view publication date May 11th 2010.
Quote “Despite the Glazer nursing debts of £717 million, advisers (and people happy to bury there head in the sand) talk up the financial health of the club.
A quick refresher on forecasts.
Cash outflow 2010- 2017 post refinancing. £M
Cumulative interest to 2017 333
Cumulative dividends to 2017 161
Cumulative fees and expenses to 2017 63
Extra cost of Carrington to 2017 8
Total 565 Thats yes 565 MILLION POUNDS.
Anyone who thinks the Glazer are good for Manchester United.Arrange these words DEAD FLOGGING HORSE A.
It’s good of them to talk, they’re not ‘saying’ much but it’s more than AIG did.
Excuse got my columns slightly wrong, lol
@tuubbzy
Actions do speak louder than words. Hope your not too lonely outside the ground while 75,000+ enjoy watching United play every game from inside OT!!!
Your right United will never die but it won’t be any thanks to fools like you.
LU -IFIT
@Jish Inc.
It’s difficult to do get over it, and with good reason. Imagine where we would be without the debt. You can’t possibly apologise for that with all that talk of unlocking commercial potential and brand value etc.
@King Eric
Hahahahahaha. Mourinho at his hilarious best. I think he was being sarcastic.
————————————————————————————-
The Special One is gonna stay there until SAF retires, which is probably 2 more seasons, so nervous times ahead of us. He has the funds, he wants to conquer La Liga and CL, he doesn’t have to worry too much about Real’s future, since he’ll leave them for us, so he has no inclination to buy unproven young player as short-term, they will only fill up squad space and time. He’s gonna buy players at the very peak of their careers, who will produce that lightning success. Real’s future is gonna be FUCKED UP (which I will enjoy), but Mourinho won’t give jack-shit because by then he will leave. It is as simple as that and no it’s not failure in team-building it’s using what you have and a bit of common sense.
Nice interview Scott, although that AON representative sounds like he’s reading off straight from AON’s Corporate Responsibility. Exploitative questions, but evasive answers.
Manchester United post a loss for the first 9 months of the fiscal year of 66.5 million pounds.
Defend the Undefendable.
Who’s smiling now!
Someone must of told this guy who Sir Matt was, but fair play to them for giving an interveiw.
@redscot
We can always sell Rooney.
http://www.newsnow.co.uk/A/423524815?-11193
Hope this is bullshite.
@Moscow is my heaven, Mate dont even joke about that, a few analysts are already talking that way , that we will need to sell some of our jewels to keep this dreadfull buisness model afloat.
Thats what they have delivered for you me and and all United fans.
I’ve just read the following link – http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2010/may/28/manchester-united-sell-players-debts.
It’s terrifying. How come all the experts say one thing while the Glazers, through their various mouthpieces, say the complete opposite?
If the Guardian piece is accurate, the situation is far worse than even the worst of the doom and gloom merchants have been claiming.
I’d like to hear how the Glazer apologists explain all that stuff away, while making a convincing argument that debt is good.
Moscow is my heaven – I wouldn’t joke about that mate.
I apologise. This is horrifying.
MKRed – You know they will, but the red kights are full of shite, getting the fans hopes up.
is the £66m loss before or after we have recieved money from TV rights? before or after the season tickets are sold? When all this is taken into account I guess it will be less dramatic numbers.. the press only want to sell papers on this day where both Gill and Glazer sources have spoken to the press .. I guess
em our club has released an official statement saying the club is not for sale..
http://www.manutd.com/default.sps?pagegid={48C41513-A376-4D1F-981D-660FC5BB193E}&newsid=6649394
hurmm..
what now..
sadly, i think Red Knights is not going to make it..
well i dont disagree too much with that article. if the glazers dont sell the club there will be a point where we will have to sell players to repay our debt.the on field success has masked the financial problems in the past 2-3 years but after last season and the sale of ronaldo the financial situation has come into the limelight again.
the cost cutting measures are already evident with us investing more in young players hoping to mould them as we get them cheap rather than going for established players. the fact that we are looking at snapping players available for free or cut price further shows the financial limitations
@ Aig, may I just ask a simple question you always seem to appear and roll up to revel in bad news and take some sick pleasure in saying we are doomed and all that shit.
To me mate as much as I dont object to negativity its not news to have a poke at and attempt to indicate the end is nigh.
I realise its dreadfull and no laughing matter, but lets not score points eh, and say things like it does not surprise me.
What we need is a Baldrik and a cunning plan.
Ps other wise hope your well, and your cousin!
Cheers for asking my question Scott, appreciate the selection of questions too and the answers were just what I wanted to hear too, not to mention they don’t ruin the shirt with their logo unlike other sponsors!
I;’ve just read rge depressing news about the future of the club on The Guardian:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2010/may/28/manchester-united-sell-players-debts
To all those ‘fans’ (?) who feel warm and fuzzy towards the Glazers the question I put to you is this:
What will your reaction be to these parasites when UTD have to sell its star players at knock-down prices and suffer s drop to a lower division? Mark my word, that’s a very distinct possibility.
A loss of 66million over a 9 month period equates to 88 million for a full year. It will only take a couple of years to lose the present squad. The decline is out of control. The down-ward spiral is well under way, The Glazers have set in motion a course of action that cannot be stopped.
As the financial figures get continually worse, the ‘we won’t sell’ noise from Florida gets louder.
How on earth this family of pirates were ever allowed to buy a football club on 20% deposit and no plan to pay off the debt is beyond me.
No one can force the Glazers to sell but hopefully the FA could kick the club out of the Premier League.
Can I just make a comment about the 20million a year sponsorship deal.
I know a man who worked for Murdoch in London in the field of advertising. He told me that to get a company (brand?0 from nowhere to 44 position in the table of company brand recognition in only 4 years, as happened with AIG , would cost hundreds of millions of dollars.
The 20 million a year that UTD ask is dirt cheap. Too cheap in fact.
@ Brisbane fan agreed Liverpool achieved as much, and YES they are great for Manchester United.
Some people dont read the FACTS. great comments Aussie.
Ya mongrel….. lmao taken from Home and Away! Scottish humour.
@wakey
You’re obviously a clued up chap when it comes to financial matters however id just like to comments on a few of your points
‘By passing on these dividends they are effectively reinvesting in the club, atm thats to the tune of 100mill and while they don’t take the 70mill out that actually 170mill’
Are you serious? You’re trying to tell me I should be thankful that they haven’t taken out money Utd fans have INVESTED or utd have generated by on or off field success! You’re crazy the glazers have not invested a bean of their own money in the club since they took over. If your calling MUST for their propaganda you’re not bad at it either
‘Would the massive increases in revenue have happened under the PLC?
Who knows but my guess is that we would have seen an increase in revenue. People like you seem to forget that UTD pre-takeover was the most profitable club in the world (topped the money league year after year) it invested heavily in players year after year and improved the stadium. So for you to say UTD was bloated and inefficient in the PLC days are a bit wide of the mark. In addition all these brilliant commercial deals are all well and good but the facts are that we would have made a LOSS last year were it not for the Ronaldo money, so there not all there cracked up to be.
‘And the figures not £800mill, its £520mill and people need to stop lumping the PIK loans into it’
Why not that is UTD’s debt in all but name. They will use UTD’s cash flow to start paying that debt off; you know they will as that’s why they turned the bank debt into the bonds, so they could increase the money they could take out of UTD. My hunch is when things have died down some time in the next year 50-70mil as the first down payment.
‘As for being in debt not being good, pretty much every successful company is in debt. Cash flow and ensuring it doesn’t grow out of control is the more important factor’
Football clubs aren’t like normal businesses. They can’t operate with such crippling debts when year after year you have to invest in talent to stay above your competitors. When most of the profit is going to pay down interest/fees/loans for your owners then you can’t invest in talent to the degree you want to, therefore performance suffers. I do remind you again that united were debt free before the Glazers took over and could invest in quality talent every year.
To finish I agree with you there are the muppets in the megastore with G&G who don’t understand the ins and outs. However the fundamentals are that people don’t need a business degree to understand that United is £520mil in debt plus the PIKS 220 at last count and paying £45 mil a year in interest just for the privilege of having the Glazers as owners.
Thats me for the Night lads, I was just hoping and ready with my ammunition to DESTROY Wakey as he has tried to do to several lads earlier on this thread, not that i carry vendettas around a blog.
And he speaks of ignorance and I am an Idiot, and know knowledge of the current status. I have made it my buisness for several weeks now, beware.
Wakey read the fiscal results, I take no pleasure in saying you I told you so.
Get the Bastards out of Old Trafford, sooner rather than later.
Defend the Undefendable.
@wakey
Please don’t get me wrong – it is not my intention to sound smug or blase here, but I need you to explain to me how I’ve got my life so wrong.
I’ve paid off my mortgage, have no HP, own two cars and have no credit card debt.
Following the model you appear to subscribe to, are you advocating that I should rush out and take out a new mortgage, buy new cars that I can’t afford on HP and max out my credit cards to the limit?
@ Wakey: You ask if we’d've made the kind of deals under the PLC regime that have been made by the Glazers.
I ask you whether we would’ve needed to.
I also laugh at Gill’s comments about United being “effectively” run under the same business model of ‘living within your means’. Firstly, if it is the same business model, there’s no need to preface your comment with “effectively”. Secondly, it’s semantics, AFAIC. “Living within your means” when you’re debt-free and making very healthy profits is completely different to “living within your means” when you’re burdened with crippling debt and announcing losses.
@redscot
Hey mate. Well my stance against the Glazers is about the same as yours, but I avoid debating about it over here nowdays. I honestly prefer arguing over Berbatov than this. If anyone believes that we are better off with the Glazers, they can have the floor and explain it. So my suggestion to you is to not get drawn in arguements over this because they turn quite bitter. That doesn’t mean that you shouldn’t speak your mind of course.
As I have said before …. why is it most posters on this site will rail against the ABU press and media on anything to do with United … until, that is, it comes to the Glazers. Then they swallow it all … hook line and sinker!!
Phil Long of PKF is a well known tosser who loves to suggest he is the only one who knows how a “football club” should be run. He’s attacked just about every other “business model” including City, Liverpool, and Chelsea. (I think he likes the Arse, however!!)
He loves to come out with little sound bites like “United will have to sell players to sustain their business model” ’cause it gets him publicity and he hopes, business. I don’t know that he is involved with the Red Knights but I wouldn’t be surprised. I know he’s no friend of United or Gill.
Ask yourself this ….If he knows so much about how a football club should be run , why is he an accoutant??!!
To get back to the thread…. Why would AON, having done the due dillengence any public traded comapany must do before investing in a sponsorship deal of the magnitude they just entered ….attach themselves to MUFC if there was the slightest chance that the businness model was suspect or that the brand could be in decline?? (Which is what it would be if we were forced to sell players in order to stay in business.)
It’s all scare mongering by interests who want to see us knocked off our perch and sadly, as ever, the masses fall for it.
LU -IFIT
@MK Red I’ll let Wakey speak for himself but your making it sound like debt is a bad thing.
Debt allows people to buy houses, fund their kids education, add quality to their life etc etc. It’s only a problem if you become over extended …. i.e. can’t make the repayments.
To answer your specfic question. It makes no sense to pay off your morgagee if you’d lose tax relief and believe whatever you’d have to sell in order to pay it off will earn you more than your going to have to pay in interest.
That in a nut shell is what the Glazers believe and the reason why the ordinary fan will never ever understand our clubs very complex finances.
Costas is right …. this subject always ends in division. (Even more than Berba!!)
LU – IFIT
@Dave Mack
How about you already own the house, have already got your kids settled, and generate more profit than anyone else. Surely, to improve the situation we must accrue debt? I thought United were self-sufficient enough to make us the biggest club in the country before the Glazers took over the club.
I am asking because I genuinely don’t know how the Glazers have benefitted the finances of the club, since their arrival.
Paul Parker:
I’ve just read your piece and I know what you do for a living.
You clean Malcolm’s dirty anus with your tongue.
A true apologist for the parasites if there ever was one.
UTD;s debt, caused solely by the Glazers is in excess of 720million pounds and RISING FAST.
Forget the nonsense about the fans not knowing – the only ones who won’t accept the truth are the Glazer arse-lickers.
In 5 years of owning the club the owners have never produced a plan to get the monstrous debt. to a manageable size let alone pay off any of the principal. The Glazers have treated the ‘true’ fans with utter disrespect and contempt. THEY DO NOT INTEND TO REPAY ANY OF THE LOAN. They are happy just to let the fans pay off the interest.
And please less of the crap and nonsense about ‘we don’t know anything about the Red Knights’
So what exactly do we know about the Glazers, apart from the fact they’ll ruin our football club in order to enrich their personal wealth? We know nothing, absolutely NOTHING
At least with some of the Red Knights they know more about finance than the Glazers will ever admit to,
Every financial expert in the UK press say that the Glazers’ plan is doomed to failure. That’s good enough for me.
Its time the leeches were driven out. I hope that can happen this summer with the Red knights. Failing that I just hope that the FA will kick them out of the PL for having too much debt. But I doubt that will happen so we’ll have to sit tight and witness the decline of a once great club,
Moscow … this won’t be popular .. but the Glazer’s used debt in a completely legitamate way to buy the club. Remember it was publicly traded, which is another form of debt, so basically their choice was to liquidate other assets … (sell other investments or interests in other sporting ventures) or get banks to loan them the funds.
The basic principle behind borrowing is that the future value of what your borrowing for will be worth more when you’ve paid the loan off than what the loan cost you.
The Glazers clearly believe that applies to United, as does Aon and every other major sponsor / investor.
@ Costas***, you know what I think of you, just a true Red and just a fantastic Manchester United fan. I am Scottish and passionate as fuck
I dont explain my self so well when i put my points across.
it angers me this mismatch of financial wisdom and balance sheets.
Costas I have spent so much time on reading all this financial gobbildy gook around our club, i almost give up and throw in the towel.
As you have said I think i will keep out of it and you have indicated that also.
you were one of the first lads along with Willie, Eric, Fred, Boogeyman, Jellybean, Aig, big Phil lawman, Giles oakley**, Corea, Wakey, Goat ,Ghht,* Ulster Red , Jansdad , notorious red devil Paul Parker and Bruce the mufc., that Acknowleged my posts i thank you. this will be my last post
TiLL THE new season begins!
Long live United.
Brisbanefan.you are typical of some people on this site who will attack anybodies view that does’nt fall in line with theirs then hurls abuse.Your one obnoxious fool away back to playing with your sheep.
@redscot
Lol, I don’t buy that mate. I expect to see you here once the WC kicks off or once we buy a new player. Thanks for the kind words though. I think the same of you. And I reiterate that it’s not about not speaking your mind on the Glazer issue. I just feel that arguing about it is a lost cause. That’s not a knock on anyone who is on the other side so to speak. It’s just such a complex topic to argue over.
@costas and Redscott
You guys are total class and post some fantastic and Humourous things on here.
I’m with you guys 100% I have read with interest most of the comments on here tonight but I prefer the on field blogs and discussing players. I don’t know anything about the Glazers or anything finacial.
I also have to agree with parryheid (not the insults) that If your veiw isn’t the same then your an arse licker or something worse.
It sickens me that our Great Club is in so much debt, how much I’ve no Idea as I’m to busy trying to keep my own buisness afloat in these hard times. I can’t Imagine The Glazers would want to send our club crashing into the Lower leagues I mean aren’t they wealthy succesful buisness people?
http://m.guardian.co.uk/?id=102202&story=http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2010/may/28/manchester-united-sell-players-debts
Anyone else read this?
@james21
Thanks mate. Hopefully the WC will provide some distraction for a while. The sad thing is that the debt issue will pop up over and over again for the next months and possibly years. The funny thing is that under new UEFA economic guidelines Shity are in a worse predicament than we are. Because more or less they state that you have to spend as much as your revenue is. And for City that’s not a lot!
If there are people here believing in the news that we are selling our players to servicing our debt, I think they are seriously being played by the media. Heaven’s sake, we just bought 2 unknowns for close to 20M! Which other club in the world is doing this?
By the way, for this blog, it is always agree to disagree. People like brisbanefan who starts to use insults, are seriously immature and needs to learn what is called respect, even in the face of opposition.
That said, if you read properly, nobody, absolutely nobody said that our situation is good. It is just that some of us think that it is not so wise to pump for something you don’t even know, we are just the cautious type, and in our current situation, I believe we need to be extremely sure of who/how our club is to be runned if there will be new owners, until then, the Glaziers are here to stay whether you like it or not.
don’t know if anyone has read this, but it’s quite touching. Who knew Ronaldo, a player that seemed so arrogant on the pitch has a big kind heart. If this article is true…then Ronaldo deserves a lot of respect.
http://www.goal.com/en/news/1863/world-cup-2010/2010/05/29/1948086/world-cup-2010-blogportugal-goalkeeping-coach-dan-gaspar-2
@Rooney22United
thank you soooo much for sharing that story. Inspirational. It moved me.
@redscot
i am good and so is my cousin. he is off to Birmingham though for his higher studies so he wont be around for some time now.
i am not reveling in this. i am frustrated and angry with the way things are being done like many of us. especially when you look at the way clubs like barca are run it makes me feel even worse. all the headlines this season have been about our financial problems rather than about our football.700 million debt is no joke. its rising rapidly too.despite being the best supported club in the world, merchandise selling like hot cakes, we still make profit because we sold a player for 80 million. its get fucking sick to read that every time. David gill every few months comes up with crap like this saying the glazers have been great for United and all that. the retarded statement of all was when he said the ‘MINORITY’ of fans are protesting when more than half the stadium if full of green and gold.
if the glazers continue for long we are not exactly doomed but our era of unprecedented success may come to an end. we must also remember more money is being pumped in and clubs like spurs and city will only get stronger and the gap will reduce.
@Rooney22United
touching one mate. i always respected ronny for what he did at United but this one has increased my respect for him even more.
Good one ron. keep it up. I tip my hat to you
@Costas
With that comment you’ve made my morning good old UEFA. I havn’t read too much on what UEFA are planning with these new rules, but anything that curbs shittys spending is good by me.
The world cup will soon be here and I love it , hopefully Teves will be crying after it finishes, I know I won’t.
@Costas
With that comment you’ve made my morning good old UEFA. I havn’t read too much on what UEFA are planning with these new rules, but anything that curbs shittys spending is good by me.
The world cup will soon be here and I love it , hopefully Teves will be crying after it finishes, I know I won’t.
Wow. I don’t surf by for a month or so and exactly the same arguments are being traded. Except that things have changed. For the better.
This time it looks as though the hardcore of the green and gold campaign are being isolated, the MUST leadership has lost whatever credibility it might have once had and the Red Knights are actually looking like Red Knightons.
I suppose the main difference is, Michael Knighton came quite close to buying the club, whereas these dreamers haven’t been close. Heard much from Keith Harris recently? Thought not. Biding his time with a decisive bid, is he? Doubt it. Helping someone finance another smaller EPL club takeover, so they can take it down the toilet. That’s where you’ll find him.
So what happens now to the green and gold? Its already yesterdays news to most of us. It is highly likely to fade away over the course of the next season, with perhaps one or two diehards in denial to bring the tone down.
I mean how many people did you see wearing those plastic yellow wristbands a few years back, who genuinely didn’t have a clue what it was all about. At least their money was being used as a force for good. If you stood on the Warwick Road and asked a selection of match goers sporting the g and g for their views, most would correctly identify their accessories as being “something to do with that Glazer”. They might even be able to recite a small amount of MUST rhetoric and you certainly wouldn’t have to wait too long before ending up on the receiving end of a handful of angry young men grunting something about wanted an elderly American chap to die. Gruesome. But when pressed, it would be clear that for most, their real motive was keeping up with the latest trend.
At least Lance Armstrong’s campaign was worthwhile, positive and for an immense cause.
@Paul H
Cracking post. I also would love to stand there and ask the wearers of the G+G Their veiws. Its Laughable you can spot a daytripper a mile off wearing the G+G Hat, Scarf, Badge, face paint and T-shirt. I have said though that I fully respect what fans are doing, its standing up for what you believe in its just most don’t have a clue.
Keith Harris wasn’t he in control of a Green and yellow bird called Orville, hmm.
Off to the Beautiful North now.
I’ll admit straight out that i’m no fan of the glazers…big name signings have dried up now whether thats up to a lack of funds or SAF not wanting to use them is hard to tell and is up to conjecture
What really gets to me though is the fact that you almost never hear anything out of them and in an age of increasing social corporate responsibilty they are doing the exact opposite by keeping millions of fans in the dark
In my view private individuals should NEVER have been allowed to own football clubs in the first place and thats is the cause of all these problems. I’m a fiorm believer that football clubs should only be able to spend what they earn..that would solve the over inflated transfer fees and wages that are becoming more and more ridicolous as well as the neveaux riche clubs playing football manager with their teams !
A football club SHOULD have a strong business sense and should try maximise revenues but it should never be run as a business because there are just too many stakeholders in the form of fans. Sadly I feel that the situation now is now irreversible because you cant make people like the Glazers, Abramohvic, Mansour, Lerner and whoever sell up now
Whatever the Guardian says it MUST be true!. Good god.
@ GoatinaUnitedShirt
Don’t when you last went to a game, but prety much everyone has at least a green and gold scarf….even in the corperate seats.
Great interview Scott
@Paul H
What a load of patronising drivel. It seems like your celebrating the fact you think G&G is over. Happy with the Glazers are you?
United have made a move for Joe Cole.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/football/premier_league/manchester_united/article7139614.ece
on hearing that the club u supports so much is swallowed up in debt is not very a good thing . i dont really love that glaziers
I’d take Joe Cole on a free, the lad needs a new challenge and we’re the perfect club to give him that challenge. He’ll want to prove a point to Chelsea and the boss has always rated him, so i think it would be a good move for the player, and for us.
@moscow is my heaven
i hope we sign him
Ronaldo(The next Rambo) on duty
http://www.kansascity.com/2010/05/29/1979156/cristiano-ronaldo-channels-his.html
I Have been hoping for some time we would get Cole.Delighted if we do.
This is the biggest load of shit that ive ever read, That aon rep clearly rehearsed his info before leaving his hotel this morning. Utd IS a FOOTBALL CLUB, not a fucking brand. AON only wants to grow by using United as a way to advertise, its just another form of revenue for the Glazers. They don’t care bout United, they care about a green bottom line. Fuck the Glazers and their bullshit.
For me the only real problem with how the Glazers have financed their purchase of the club is that it’s so complex less than 1% of our fans could even begin to understand it. This allows all the ABU media who want to see United knocked off their perch and those with outdated agenda’s, like MUST to manipulate the masses with half truths built on “facts” taken out of context. (Debt is bad, the Glazers have put nothing into the club, they’re only here to raid it, interest payments will mean we have to sell players or sell OT etc etc.)
However, I don’t agree with David Gill that the green & gold campaign is going to fade away anytime soon. In fact my worry is (and has been since this whole thing started) that the extremists will turn to much more disruptive action that negatively impacts the team and divides the support.
Hearing Foster critize the protests only after he left has me wondering how many of the players are already put off by it.
LU – IFIT
Sorry Chino… but your living in the past. MUFC isn’t “a football club” anymore .It’s a “global sporting enterprise”. FC United is a football club but the couldn’t afford to pay Wazza one days wages.
http://www.newsnow.co.uk/A/423654422?-11193
More Red Knight bullshite.
Manchester unite are only 1 of 5 premiership teams working on a profit last season. Nothing to do with Ronnie money. Stoke arsenal Blackburn and villa made a profit. With unitedaking the highest amount of green. Hate the glazers don’t trust gill but it’s not all bad reading all the time
@ willierednut
u’ll take Joe Cole on a free? JESUS CHRIST!! What in hells name are u saying? Is Joe Cole d type of attackin midfielder we need atm? Common mate, United will be competing with d like of Real Barca Inter next season and all we want is Joe Cole? Some1 d rentboys av used up all d good thing left in him. Are we sorta like a refuse dump where we buy up used products?
If Sir Alex and Mr Fish-GILL (I’VE GOT SCORES TO SETTLE WITH THAT DUDE BUT NOT NOW) claim there’s money in d bank, why do we go 4 players like Joe Cole? Instead of getting J Cole i’ll rather promote petrucci 2 d 1st team. FFS there are young attackin midfielders in d world who can grow in2 world class players (some r already)- diego, hamsik, gourcoff, silva,aguero etc-we could buy instead of one spent horse 4rm d stamford bridge…
Personally i don’t really think we need a striker,we’ve got players who could score goals- including Berba, if told 2 stay where they ought 2 be.what we really need a WORLD CLASS attacking midfielder and a defensive midfielder 2 complement fletch (i dont really trust in Hargo’s fitness)
well I am back bitter towards the parasites has ever, some fans can try and paper over the financial cracks but the true fans who bleed red always want to know if this club is financially sound. LOL I got to laugh at wakey’s comments that we are better off under this lot than the PLC you having a laugh, and if a rich invester bought the club in 2005 they would be paying the 800 million that is it not the extra 700 million pounds of debt and rising. And if investers of the PLC walk away the club would still not be close to facing huge financial troubles.
What is that saying if I put a suit on a goat it is still a goat, thats what PPL like wakey and Dave Mack are doing trying to dress up a problem that still is a problem. This is not transfer gossip wakey and Dave Mack these are cold hard facts and they are brutel. But for PPL like Dave Mack to basically call fans idiots because they are not insiders is insanly stupid thing to say, reports come in very mixed maybe on transfers etc etc because that is all speculation they have no foundations towards those storys because united gave nothing away the media have said that themselves, but when it comes to financial reports then it is a totally different ball game.
but when you get down to the bones the heart of the problem the real truth they do not get their financial reports wrong very often, because what they do is they go out and they look for the facts basically research and ask experts who know how this game is run of the financial game, especially when financial experts come out and they know how companys are run they know how stable it is, and the model of manchester United FC is walking talking bomb its basically the foolish man who built his house on sand andsooner or later the tide comes in for united debt tide, Manchester United is the twin towers just ready to be attacked and its not if it will happen but when and that is a horrible thought to take in.
Also the man keeping the entire structure if MUFC is sir alex ferguson himself and he has not got long and if profits are being swallowed by the debts how in the fuck are the club able to not only sign players, replace fergie in the future which will also cost cash and allot of it unless some hack takes over fergie and keep up interest payments, united will have to make profits that cannot be made and that is a structure ready to collapse.
RTNK is right.
We’re a ticking time bomb, a disaster waiting to happen. People try to paper over the cracks by saying the Glazers’ investment will come good in the future. In the near future, SAF is gonna retire. That’s when it can all fall apart, everything the club’s been through everything that’s been sacrificed would count for nothing but history. We NEED to be on a sound financial footing when that time comes to brace for landing if you like, and SAF is only human, he won’t manage until 2017 or whatever time we’re meant to come free of the debt.
Marcwilliems – Don’t get your panties in a twist mate, yes i’d take Joe Cole on a freebie. On the names you mentioned, Gourcuff is the only one i really rate. I disagree with you that we don’t need a striker, look what happened when Rooney got injured, we got caught out. I agree about Hargo, we might need another combative midfielder in there to take the pressure off Fletcher.
Joe cole on free would be a good signing but he isnt getting any younger and like the risk with owen is extremely injury prone. Its worying that once again we are looking for cheap and free players we will have to spend top dollar if we want talented players. they dont come cheap anymore. joe cole and a striker and our team for next season is ready. would prefer suarez and cole as our 2 signings.
The circus starts again.I am not pro or anti Glazer I am indifferent,the stockbrokers I dont even give the time of day, the sometime never guys suggest you read the link provided by willierednut.Must if some posters on here are members please enlighten the likes of me who are they and why the anonominity do they fear scrutiny I think most of the support go with the original ideas of Must but definately not the stockbrokers.
Rooney etc… we don’t agree but I I appreciate they way you made your comments.
But let me clarify one thing …I’m never called our fans idiots or said they were stupid. Follow me on this. Stand outside OT (or Twickenham or Lords on any High Street) and ask 1,000 people what a bond is and how it can help finance a business and how many people do you expect will be able to answer it? 100? I think that would be a stretch but that’s just 10%.
Now how the Glazers have financed their purchase of United is 20 times more complicated than that so what I’m saying is 99% of us are not going to be able to evaluate this business model. I’m not saying anybodies dumb I’m just saying that MUST and ABU’s can talk about debt etc and we who care about our club can easily be spooked and therefore manipulated.
So my whole theme is to try get fellow supporters to take comfort in a man who would not sell his soul by saying the Glazers are “TERRIFIC OWNERS” if he genuienly didn’t believe that.
LU – In Fergie I Trust
@marcwilliems
Joe Cole on a free, sounds pretty fucking good to me.
@AIG
I prefer Higuain. Not so sure about dutch league strikers after what’s happened to Huntelaar (WHAT a bullet we dodged right there). Although the last dutchman we had didn’t do too badly for us… I’m enjoying a nice Rooney-Torres partnership on FIFA 10 manager mode though.
The other thing that the average citizen doesn’t understand is that being in debt isn’t the same thing as being broke. If I take a loan to buy a house and can comfortable make the payments, I’m investing in my future and have become wealthier.
Cash (or cashflow) is king in any business and as long as United continue to bring in revenue from match days, mega store shirts, sponsorship etc etc, to pay wages and buy the players SAF wants, why are fans suddenly worrying about the clubs capital and debt structures?
The answer IMO is that there are all sorts of parties very interested in trying to destablize this great club ….. not least of all those behind the Wastelands in our own City….. and I hate to see them succeed.
LU-IFIT
@ Dave Mack
couldn’t agree with you more about your comments about the understanding of leveraged buyouts or bonds or business plans amongst the majority of the fans. I had nightmares about a finance exam involving leveraged buyouts during my mba…
Back to football …. I hate Cole diving, dirty, injury prone git. Besides with the number of young wide players fighting Nani and Valencia for a place …. we don’t need him.
Grrrrrrr, lol I said I would stay out of this but, not watch with wonder and Interest, but am a wee liar! lol
Dave Mack @ 21.22 ?
ARIJC @ 21.22?
Please then for all us thickos observing what is a bond issue?
And how it benifits Manchester united, and dont scroll and paste documents!
And for the love of God dont say the Pik is not held against Manchester United.
I would not mind seeing joe cole at united….plus van der vart imagine them two in midfield.
now that would strike fear into most teams dont you agree?
in fergie I trust.
I meant ARIJC@ 21.38, SOZ
@RTNK
Agree with your post. Personally, I would take our PLC regime over the current one any day even if it meant less trophies in 2006-2010 or less free cash. But the question at this point is what alternative do we have? The Red Knights? All fluff and no stuff so far. As I said a while back, that’s the most worrying thing in this for me. That no other solution is in sight.
@Moscow is my heaven
although many accuse him of being a flat track bully i wont mind higuain at all. we struggled to break the average and poor teams at times and could do with someone like him. the problem though is real said yesterday he is not for sale.suarez has done very well and unlike huntelaar he is not an out and out striker but is a more mobile forward like rooney when it comes to playing style.kind of when we had tevez and wazza up front the formation was very flexible
Dave Mack – You wouldn’t like Cole because he dives, you must have hated ronaldo then. @AIG Higuain has no pace mate, which you need in the premiership, i’d take Fabiano instead.
Ony LAD that speaks aboot doing research outside Twickenham or Lords, FUCK me pink do you not see the bigger picture! Thats a Merchant Banker.
I know what we will do its simple lets get rid of the Glazer, and find another cock that wants to Milk Manchester United.
The club needs to think how to rid ourselves of this disease and fast.
@willie
you got to be kidding mate. higuain may not be a ronaldo but he has great pace. i have seen him race past defenders. fabiano is 30 now and we will have to pay 12 million for him. can get him for free next season. we will have to wait for him. plus fabiano isa very temperamental lad. got a very short fuse
He’s over – rated, let shity pay 40 million for him.
@willie
i think he has time on his side to develop. he is scoring well and is just 22 so for 25 million i am ready but anything above that we should approach targets
I have a odd habit……. lmao I read everyones posts and inwardly digest.
Nite Reds.
No real point in just going to the post box and typing drivvle is there! pmsl.
Awaiting answers.
I read an article today, that SAF has give Gill his list of targets.
Whats it say that Madrid are prepared to let Higuain go, and keep Benzema. I don’t think you’ll get him for 22 or 25 million, more like 35 40 million. Someone said Suarez, who can play out wide or up front, again though, the fee could be to much.
Costas – cheers mate, some PPL comparing the glazer debate with berbatov really does piss me off.
This debate should not be even be devided like berbatov, berbatov is not losing this club millions, berbatov is not putting united at massive financial risks, berbatov is not a greedy son of a bitch who berbatov himself would not sell his gran down the river faster than ronaldo say only god knows. there should not even be arguments, its like arguments over what is 2 + 2 see how insane that sounds.
But I am not condeming manchester united has a club which profits are unbelievable it is insane what united have made and this is football, macari said clubs like united are running a tight ship that angers me even more, did anyone count up the amount of cash this club has made since the 06/07 season it dwarfs anything the fascist and barcelona chelsea inter arsenal etc etc have made in 4 years, we could buy a new team rebuild the south stand and still have cash still left over.
When I say ticking time bomb that is a very very possibility when you look at what is happening and like I said even for a club of united’s size? every club has its limits, there is only so much you can bleed from one body. like in the dark knight quote know your limits master bruce and even united have their limits. MUFC are not apple or microsoft or sony, those huge companys can go into huge debt because what they make back what they borrowed at double the rate or even treble, this club is expected service debts of the levels of a big company.
but these are my concerns and parasites do not even care and are willing to put this club at huge financial risk.
debts interest rates are going to increase now in august, when that happens what else do we have to concern ourselves with
the club continues to make losses every season, without ronaldo cash we would make a 40 plus million pound loss that for me is an outrage when we look at these facts, we add the rising cost in tv revenue, a 76,000 capacity stadium which is one of the best stadiums in the game today, we won the premiership carling cup world club cup add the prize money for that is huge, got to the CL final fa cup semi finals and say ronaldo stayed we would have made a loss. I do not care what anyone says that is disgraceful losses and how many times will we have a season like 08/09, that when the squad is weaker physically and lighter in the striking department that is a huge concern.
replacing fergie is mount everest, yes fergie will have a big say but PPL are saying players cost a bomb, to hire a top class coach that is going to cost millions if that manager is under a big contract
now you add rising interest rates and getting a new manager how you going to maintain the quality of the squad, because the academy is under pressure now more than ever to produce results faster than ever before.
my last concern is, we have had an outstanding core of players that have been a part of the success the past phew years under this current ownership. Like VDS ferdinand vidic evra carrick fletcher ronaldo rooney tevez I could go on, you also add the heart beat the blood of the team the past 16 years, giggs scholes neville brown, now if the younger players coming through are not doing it faster will this club be able to keep up what I call a gigantic interest rates and that is huge ask from even the club of uniteds size.
the glazers buinsess model is a complete disaster, their buisness model is no different to the time when PPL said the Titanic was called unsinkable.
I have no reason to distrust M.U.S.T. If someone is going to buy out The Glazers -it’s not gonna be some anarchist co-operative ,let’s face it -so they are doing us a FAVOUR by keeping tabs on the Red Knights. Of course -they would expect some financial reward -but with The Glazers -we start off at minus 70 million each season -so if that dropped to 20 or 30 -we are better off. And if MUST are involved -it will reduce the possibility of the “Scam” that some fear .
And thx again to Scott for providing us with material to discuss. Top Bloke!
@willie
we will have to pay top dollar if we want to buy talented strikers. they will not come cheap. reports say higuain is close to extending his madrid deal so that one can be crossed out. also madrid dont want to sell benzema saying he will be like a new signing and they expect him to make more impact next season. dzeko maybe on his way to city so that leaves us only with suarez who wants to come to united. cant think of anyone else
http://www.goal.com/en-india/news/222/transfer-zone/2010/05/29/1948576/gonzalo-higuain-set-to-sign-improved-contract-with-real
It’s gonna be an interesting few weeks, my fear is that we’ll miss out on our main targets, because we always seem to take an age to get the players we want.
willierednut – I have no idea how anyone thought benzema was up for sale and higuan, they are doing something which shocks me learning from their mistakes and not letting good players go so cheaply or not all especially when benzema and higuain are 21 and 23. Like I said weeks ago there is nothing out there all the good strikers are mostly gone now since 2007 and 2008, summer 2009 was another dry patch of players available. only that ajax striker is available but he will possible cost unrealistic price add the fact clubs are more smarter and wanting more than before, ronaldo sale has triggered an insane price rise in players cost.
are united outdated in their transfer policys what they see in the cost in players I dont think so, but at the moment the cost of players has made uniteds transfer policy seem outdated but it is not, but this is a current cycle in the transfe market? that has seen the transfer market seem like chaos, the fascist and shitty are the agents of chaos in the transfer market at the moment, and united do not want to get into the thick of war which if your financially bloated with extra cashwhich the facist and shitty are then you will get burnt badly, and I do not blame united for saying to clubs go fuck yourselves, but the irony uniteds sale of ronaldo has been uniteds undoing in players they want.
@willierednut
How about this for pace from Higuain?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a5-S6cHGFTQ
Don’t want to sound like a Real fan, but the guy KNOWS how to put the ball in the net. He’s an exceptional finisher, and I can point to a lot of examples this season where that’s ALL we needed:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KYEILDTQgXg
There’s no way Real will let go of him now, and I think I will agree with AIG that our striking options are v limited hence why Suarez is being favoured.
@AIG
You left Aguero out. What do you think about him? Not that we can afford him or anything…
@willierednut …..loved Ronaldo from the day he joined. I rember when Joe Cole threw himslf two footed like a spear at Ronaldo’s calfs….. Never forgot it …. Dirty cheatin git , average talent, inconsistent, injury prone. Not even within two legues of Ronaldo.
Anyway my point is we have all the wide talent we need.
lmao @ Dave Mack, CONVIENTLY side stepped my ?
I am Scottish and no Cunts fool.
@Dave Mack
Who IS within Ronaldo’s league these days?
for all the thickos watching Dave Mack will explain what a bond issue at the value of same to Manchester United?
@redscot
It really is scary mate.
RTNK ….
You and I have a chance to buy the club we love, MUFC. You say I’m going to have to sell the house and move the wife and kids into a one bedroom rented flat, sell the car and take the bus or whatever…. but yea I want to do it.
I say don’t worry mate I can get the bank to loan us the money and secure on MUFC. Also the revenue we’ll be able to drive by new commercial deals will be enough to cover the interest payments with out hurting the team or interefering in anyway with SAF.
Are you telling me you’d say, no I want to move the wife and kids and get the bus?! Course you wouldn’t ….”cause your not a idiot.
Well our owners aren’t idiot’s. They’re smart business men and while PL rules permit leaverged ownership why would they dismantle other parts of their “sporting empire” rather than expand it?
You and me wouldn’t become hated parasites, bent on destroying the club overnight and they aren’t either. If you want to hate somebody hate the PL for allowing it but if they make the rules to tough potential investors go eleswhere.
LU – IFIT
lol am waiting on Dave Mack, he appears like some Glazer cock sucker, and like a lame bendy toy.
I asked a question of him, its not tricky.
Answer it dave, as we are all stupid.
Rooney gets a wee pat on the head, good boy.
it dont work with me!
Be warned were not all mugs that take in all that is said and written, some of us are free thinkers and wont take on board everything.
We tend to do research and investigate facts, not some crap that is written on the the net.
I would like to write the rest in Gaelic, but know Blog rules.
When you research get back to me.
I need a boyfriend and a Allie….. pmsl roflmao
Dave Mack – did you read any of the concerns I have for the state of the club and how badly the club is financially at the moment, this is not abu media I am getting info from, I am pointing the facts which is happening at the club. MUFC is not apple or sony it does not make the payments to swallow the debt its a small buisness in terms of what money it makes, what united make is nothing what big companys make so that kind of debt repayments is well out of the boundrys of united. and that is hard to control debt interest and maintain the quality of the squad and fergie will have to be replaced sooner rather than later, and to pay off interest payments without paying of the debt itself you are asking for impossible numbers, and the reality is the numbers make no sence for a succesful buisness, and unless we have insane scouts and a magic academy it will be the arsenal way success on the cheap and arsenal model is horrible model for a club of the size of united.
Its simple no debt has been uniteds model since they were formed all the way up to 2005, maybe they were in debt before they propably were but uniteds prioretys are debt control and its been well managed, and when thats right that leads to quality squad maintinance and thats how the club has been run and why its been such succesful club, since 2005 debt controls are struggling to be kept and uniteds cycle of success has bought the glazers time but time is running out for them its like tring to contain a hungry lion sooner or later it will get out.
And comparing borrowing to buy a house with football is bad example, because we have seen borrowing going out of control and PPL losing their houses, oh yes who would forget woolworths who make twice the profits united have and they went bankrupt.
also football runs in cycles, unlike other big companys where yes they have to make better quality gadgets to keep up with the times but they have such huge subscribers they will easy pay off the debts, united can easily lose the success they have been treated for the past 2 decades and if that happens the loss of revenue money is going to make it very hard, but again I will use the 08/09 season has a massive example, that was uniteds most succesful season in the clubs history for the amount of revenue the club made, and still they would have made a loss if it was not for ronaldo those numbers are truly shocking.
@redscott … why are you getting so angry, mate? Let me repeat what I already posted… (see below) but you missed my point or I didn’t make it very well.
The biggest problem with how the Glazers business plan works is that very few people can say they fully understand. (I’m certainly not one of them!) But what I’m saying is that doesn’t make us stupid … it just means that ABU’s and others can easily put the shits up us.
I chose to trust SAF and believe if he says the are “TERRIFIC OWNERS” then at least they can’t be all bad. But on this site they are the scum of the earth beant on destroying the club I’ve supported for nearly 50 years.
Ask yourself … why is there such a gap between what SAF believes and what the green and gold protestors believe.
And by the way …. your not the only Scot that visits this site! Good Night!
“I’m never called our fans idiots or said they were stupid. Follow me on this. Stand outside OT (or Twickenham or Lords on any High Street) and ask 1,000 people what a bond is and how it can help finance a business and how many people do you expect will be able to answer it? 100? I think that would be a stretch but that’s just 10%.
Now how the Glazers have financed their purchase of United is 20 times more complicated than that so what I’m saying is 99% of us are not going to be able to evaluate this business model. I’m not saying anybodies dumb I’m just saying that MUST and ABU’s can talk about debt etc and we who care about our club can easily be spooked and therefore manipulated
So my whole theme is to try get fellow supporters to take comfort in a man who would not sell his soul by saying the Glazers are “TERRIFIC OWNERS” if he genuienly didn’t believe that.
LU – In Fergie I Trust”
@ willie.
Well he may be on a free but do we really need him? I dont think so.he’s injury record these days wont even let me touch him,coupled with d fact that he is way past his best . Moreover we have a lot of wide men who are young and good but are yet 2 grab a shirt.
On a d issue of getting a striker, getting one means at least 2 have to go-either on loan or sold- cos we have kiko , biram (SAF talks highly of this guy.dunno why, but i am not a manager), hernandez, welbeck, owen , berba, rooney. 7 of them…but if we must get one, i’ll prefer Suarez cos he can play on d flank in a 4-3-3 formation. Benzema is not an option (u dont get a 2nd chance if u snub united; its unpardonable), Higuain is good but not worth d price-tag,Fabiano is ok but his age and his temperament might be his achilles heel…BUT COME TO THINK OF IT THERE IS REALLY NO VALUE IN THE MARKET.just like sir Alex said only Ronaldo and Messi are worth over £50m. And i think d new uefa rules will help in curbing excessive price tags.or what do u think?
@ Dave Mack, tell me please how i am getting angry, i AM laughing at YOU.
I asked a question, you made out all fans are idiots right? or 90% of said are , i asked you to explain the bond issue and what a bond issue and the effect on Manchester United.
You have not answered that question to date…… have you
See the real point Dave Mack read the Blog carefully before you hit me with words, from begining to end.
then you will get what I mean no anger here buddie just trying to understand facts and get all points of view.
redscot – LOL he has not, its simple the bond issue has not benifted united but the glazers themselves, they restructured the debt borrow another 500 million and pay off some of the old debt, they can take another 130 million out for themselves they can also take out charges fees etc etc, so basically the bond issue has given the glazers more room to take out more money out of the club than they have ever done before. Which will help has come august interest payments will rise so it does not effect their own personal fortune. PPL say they are great buisness men, but there is a difference from great businessmen to great owners they are 2 different animals altogether, those 2 meanings are on oppisite worlds they dont even dove tail each other, its like cancer it does not look scary to PPL on the outside its a silent killer, where its destroying the insides of the body and when we have seen the extent of the damage we then see the damage it causes and thats what the glazers are.
I will look forward to the light of Dave Macks torch to show us the way forth, ffs that will be illuminating, at the end of the Tunnel 500 million pounds of debt and still leaking cash that could be invested in the club.
Addios as we say and Au Revoir, Bon nuit. over and out 10/10.
ps not to mention the 565 million POUNDS lost in INTEREST to get there, dont you just love the Glazer.
Scott, great job, mate, this is a class interview! I’m a fan from the States, and I admit that while I always wanted to buy a United shirt I couldn’t bring myself to wear AIG’s logo on my chest, given the fact that they almost brought down the entire American financial sector. Hopefully AON will be better, but I’m not counting on it.
In other news, I’m scared about Silva. http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2010/may/28/manchester-city-david-silva-valencia
Going to the fascists is one thing, but Shitty??
I’ve got it. I now understand why the red knights wanted us not to renew our season tickets. It was so they all had somewhere to sit in the increasingly unlikely event of a successful takeover. Sneaky or what?
On a serious note, I’m detecting a sense of resignation from the anti-Glazer posters now, so we are hearing a lot of “you wait and see” type remarks that cannot be substantiated about what the future under our current regime holds. Not to mention some abuse to those who, like myself, could see through the MUST agenda from the start.
Let’s draw a line under it now. Enjoy watching some of our internationals in action over the next few weeks, then see what action is done in the market before we start the next campaign.
A word of caution though for those who will be disappointed when we don’t get into bidding wars with our noisy neighbours and the chavs. The world is changing. In a short space of time their business model will be outlawed by UEFA, so the playing field will once again be a level one.
For a long period, other clubs’ supporters moaned that United could buy anyone they wanted because they had more stadium capacity that generated greater income. That was only partially true, because we were also the first club to truly understand the power of marketing, sponsorship and globalization.
When the squillionaires rolled into town, the landscape changed again, but their days of spending beyond the means of the club are almost over.
This is a shame for the likes of City, whose benefactor is only in the early days of chucking his oil money around like its going out fashion, and who wont have time to build the kind of squad they need to become serious challengers before the practice is outlawed. Chelsea too also need to throw the roubles in a big way, in order to replace some of their geriatrics and those who might jump ship for Jose. Although I reckon they’ll just use the interest to land big pay rises, or time bombs in other words.
So sit tight my friends. Watch the last summer of madness unfold. Enjoy some astute Fergie wheeling and dealing and he might just spring a surprise for us all to cheer.
Paul H – I’ve said this before, but I’ll make the point again because it’s one that I feel is totally overlooked when discussing the whole G&G campaign: I would say that the real reason why the G&G campaign took such a hold with match going fans was that we were sick to the back of teeth of the cost of out season tickets/match tickets rising after every season. Now, Wakey can tell me til he’s blue in the face that this was rise is perfectly fine because at least now the cost of out seats are in line with the dirties – but when you’ve seen the cost of your season ticket hike up by 400 quid you tend to feel a bit different. This isn’t because we were brainwashed by big bad MUST or manipulated by the ABU press – it was because we were sick to death of being shafted by Uncle Malc. Ulitimately we know how his ownership has affected us – we don’t need MUST or the press to tell us that. No one I know hasn’t renewed because they support the Red Knights or are blinding following MUST.
Giving up your seat is one of the hardest decisions you’ll make for most fans, but one which more and more of our hard core fans are making because of the Glazers. The G&G campaign was a good idea at the time and could it pure coincidence that for the first time in seasons I’m not looking at price rise? It’s now time to put it to bed though (although I am sure I’ll still see daytrippers comically wearing G&G whilst clutching their megastore bags next year) and start looking forward to next season.
http://www.studs-up.com/2010/05/a-man-has-needs/
@Neville Neville
I like alot of your comments mate and your reasoning why so many fans turned against the Glazers because of the sharp season ticket price increase. I feel that the days of Manchester being a poor and undeveloped part of England is a thing of the past and therefore the people cannot justify expecting everything on the cheap. If Manchester United is going to compete with the likes of Barcelona and Real Madrid let alone City and Chelsea then United cannot carry on subsidising fans to come and watch the matches. Of course I understand that the Glazers are taking out money to finance debt rather than pay for players with the increase in season ticket prices and that is regretable but is hardly a good argument for a fan to use. In life you have to cut your cloth accordingly, if you cant aford to go to every match then so be it, just enjoy the ones you go to that little bit more. There are lots of things I cant afford in life and that is just the way things are. I realise you dont appreciate the 400 pound rise in ticket prices but im pretty sure (should you have the job) welcome the fact that the minimum wage is far higher than the “minimum wage” was only 10 years back. It wouldn’t be in Uniteds best interest to carry on the way they did before and its not even the case that United are the most expensive in the premier league despite performing by far the most consistant since its beginning.
@GHTT
That was scary.
I think the Glaziers have them tumbling dice, what the Rolling stones sung about in that song.
.@Dave Mack @ 29/5/2010 @21.34.
“The average citizen doesnt understand is that being in debt isnt the same as being broke.
If I take out a loan to buy a house and can comfortably make the payments,in investing in my future and have become wealthier”
?Why would you take out a loan at a more expensive rate to invest in said house, racking up to 16.25%.Plus if you are not paying of any of the principle of the loan, how can that be good!
Know one has said we are broke,what everyone is quite clear on, huge amounts of Manchester Uniteds profit is being forfieted to service those loans that the Glazer have saddled the club with.
During this mortgage period of which you speak money belonging to Manchester United is being syphoned off to fund the loans and the Glazer personal wealth.
Only contributing less money availiable for the manager to invest in the squad.
And yes we may at present be able to pay the interest only part of the huge loans,just keep praying we are successfull on the field and continue to reach the Champions league competition.
Dave I dont wish to appear like a Dog with a Bone,but I asked a question of you on May 29th at 21.52,
Tell us the stupid 90% of Manchester united supporters what is a bond issue?.
I shall look forward to your theory of same.
I must go to Church and I shall pray for your sanity and all things good for our Club.
@ Neville Neville
Spot on mate. I gave up my seat and had to endure all
the usual crap about how can I be a ‘proper fan’ if I gave up my season ticket, but in reality I couldn’t afford it anymore. If I’m bitter towards the Glazers it is NOTHING to
do with MUST or the g&g campaign.
Some people would have you believe that MUST are something akin to the gestapo. ps Japan are beating England lol
Rumour going around a new group are intending to bid for United.Their spokesman say’s around forty estate agents are waiting on the clubs present suitors making a binding bid which they will gazump.As everybody knows our group have been convincing clients the slums they have bought were really palaces they are skilled liars the fans will know exactly what they are in for.Our group are confident they will out lie the stockb oops Red Knights with ease,slightly worried that we open the door to the real masters of deceit The Lawyers.
@Parryheid Mate do you have any links to this new group please ?
redscot in my mind
redscot – I think he’s taking the piss mate.
@willie oic, lol…….Glad your enjoying the England performance, lol a tad disjointed i would say.
Bad miss bye Lennon though after Wayne slipped him through
Rai – cheers mate – that’s a decision that thankfully I won’t have to make this year at least. Ignore the ‘proper fan’ shite. If you can’t afford it, you can’t afford it end of – it’s not as if the club with thank you for going – they’d rather have the daytrippers and the prawn sandwich section any day of the week (as we’ve seen from the loyalty pot bullshit in recent times).
Goat – thanks for the compliment, but your views on Manchester are, well to be honest mate, bizarre. And I’m not just basing my opinion on your last post, which did at least contain a somewhat back-handed compliment towards the city. You seem to view up here as some backwater hovel with little or nothing going for it when obviously the reality is very different, even if I am a little biased to say the least!
“Should you have a job” – is that another Mancunian stereotype you’re throwning into the mix ??? Lol! Yes, mate I do and one which allows me to live a comfortable lifestyle – however, the rises still do not sit well with me. And I suspect, they wouldn’t with you either if you were an ST holder?
No one expected our prices to remain as low as they had been and we did have it good for a long time – rather the issue is with the constant hikes season after season, not including the ACS on top of that. As I’ve said to Rai, if you can’t afford it then that’s that – game over. But when your ticket has been in the family for years and going to the match is a huge part of your life then you can understand why the Glazers haven’t endeared themselves to us. Like I’ve said before, that is why you’re always going to have a more negative opinion of the Glazers if you’re a regular match-goer, than if you can only watch the lads on the telly for whatever reason.
Anyway, rant over – that’s enough Glazer talk for me.
Goat – you should try and get up here more often – you never know you may change your mind about Manchester. As the great King Monkey said, “Manchester’s got everything except a beach”.
Rooney doesn’t look like he’s enjoying playing with Bent lol. Looks like my dream of United signing Modric are over, he’s just signed a new 6 year deal with Spurs.
Manchesters like Belfast, always raining.
@Willie you know what regards Cappelo I dont think he knows what his best starting eleven is at this stage of the preparations.
http://www.newsnow.co.uk/A/423743097?-11193
Looks like it’s over for the RKs, not to sure if it was ever really on.
redscot – You could be right, Lampard just missed a penalty.
jaysus i just saw 3 of the knights on the telly, silly twats
Morimoto looks sharp.. wasn’t he linked with us sometimes ago?
lol…looks like United’s OWN GOAL will be going to the world cup with england…
and I thought “he” is Italian?
Joe hart, is such a cracking goal keeper i wish we could sign him, Joe cole as had a steady game,
I suspect Micheal Carrick will not be going to South Africa.
Sorry this is totally of topic.
Got to be honest lads, I don’t think there’s a chance that we are buying another striker this summer unless berbatov is sold which I don’t think he will. People forget that we just bought an international striker who looks like he could do the business, not to mention the other young strikers we have.
Just saw some english fan with a shrek doll wearing a mini Rooney shirt – words escape me.
“Own goal” for England…. if he doesnt get in the plane ahead of those muppets Heskey and Bent then theres no justice.
@Big Phil…..the Shrek doll thingie was that on the telly mate, I know fans, and what they think mind boggling.
I dont think we need another striker anyway Phil, with Micheal fit, Diouf growing and Fredrico improving.
We wont sign as you say unless Dimitar is showing the exit door, which I personally hope does not happen.
I saw a report on the net he is the 8th most productive forward in the Epl, Drogba 1st and Wayne 2nd.
Disagree lads, i think we do need another striker. SAF said Berba’s staying, but he also said the same about Veron and other players in the past. As for owen, can’t see him getting much football next season, especially if hernandez hits the ground running. Welbeck will probably go to Preston on loan, i would like Kiko to get a chance next season, but he could also go out on loan.
@Willie agreed regards Veron, but he will not sell Berbatov, its too much of a hit regards the loss the club will be subjected too, to replace him for someone likely not as productive.
Also good point regards Hernandez, we shall wait and see, and hope he is a sucess.
We must not also forget he has recalled Cleverly.
Does anyone know if Danny is having a second season at Preston has this been announced.
I just cant see us having so many high wage earners warming the sidelines.
@redscot – yeah the shrek thing was on the telly. You can just tell that if england don’t win the world cup most of the fans can’t wait to jump all over rooney.
Agree wth you mate, I don’t think we need a striker – what we do need is more goals from midfield!
There ain’t that many goalscoring midfielders about, and anyhow, we can get more goals out of Nani and Valencia, who are capable of at least getting 20 between them.
@Big Phil, agreed mate regards who they will pounce on effing idiots.
Bang on the money Phil, its the attacking midfielder to mirror what Paul as produced in the past, that thrust to create and return some goals regularly, sadly like Lampard.
Its finding that player, I like Willie agree Joe cole on a free with although reputed 120k per week in wages would be a good signing if his fitness could be assured, and might chip in with 10 goals+ per season.
Thats the key in my humble opinion like yours to get that midfielder
@Willie ohhhhh Nani will mate, he is my darling. lol.
I think and really hope he will, Since Christmas I think he has just been awesome and shown us all what he can produce.
Antonio as well, we have in essence a great team just ready to boil.
As Phil said lets discover the threat from midfield.
No joking here I read an article on the possibility of putting Rafael in an attacking role on midfield in made fascinating reading and not to be discounted.
I gotta go, there are Two Frogs outside my window having sex, its a taboo on a Sunday.
Laterz.
redscot – lmao.
http://www.newsnow.co.uk/A/423754164?-11193
Interesting article on SAF, don’t know if any – one will agree with this.
@willie – Yeah mate I agree with you and redscot that Nani and Valencia have the ability to get more goals from midfield. Doesn’t matter where they come from, whether we buy someone or if our midfielders just start scoring more!
I wouldn’t complain at all if we signed a Fabiano for example, but I just can’t see it. I think Fergie will hope Chicharito can get us a good ten to fifteen next year, plus there’s Macheda, Diouf and Welbeck (?) on the books. If we bought another experienced striker that would make Chicharito/macheda 5th choice at best and the way United is run I don’t believe we’ll see that happening.
I still think Joe Cole on a free would be a great ‘buy’. Though I noticed the bookies now think arsenal are in the race with us as well!
Chicharito scores for Mexico
get in there chicharito!!!!. looks like we have got a real talent on our hands
VIVA CHICHARITO!!!
Yeah i’m watching the game boys so i’ll give a report.
Hernandez’s goal was good anticipation as he picked up on a poor backpass before slotting the ball neatly between the keepers legs with his left foot (i think it was his left). The goal was quite similar to Rooney’s vs Porto…
I had got quite angry because he had missed an absolute sitter just before it though.
And he scores again.
@Fze 123 are you being serious mate Hernandez has scored twice?
where are you watching this please?
willierednut. hatchet job mate check the colours.
we ve got anoda playa to rival rooney for the golden boot at the WC
He’s off now. I must say I am extremely impressed by him. Gets into great positions and takes his chances very well. As well as scoring consistently for his national team. Hopefully we’ll see more of that at the WC. Vela was rubbish by the way.
Yeah he scored again, sliding in to convert a cross across the goal into the net.
He was substituted in about the 55th minute.
@ redscot, stream on justintv, he’s off now though.
thank you, sounds great, any reason for him being substituted
Cheers Fze123 I will try unless Scott puts the goals up on here to get them on You tube.Ta.
see the popular goal scorer for UNITED got 2 against the Japs today….you all know who I mean…… OWN GOAL !!
LOL @ Tony Bee. Yeah but England won, so its not all bad, and that was them playing badly, so all heart should not be lost.
Javier Hernandez scores twice.
Chicharito is speed and anticipation….and today he proved another thing, he can play in the rain:)
2 goals today and he shows Vela how to score too…He knows how to position himself in the box and take advantage of opportunities, he does miss some every now and then, but no one is perfect. I think we have our striker…..
http://www.redforcerising.net/2010/05/31/video-man-utds-hernandez-scores-against-gambia/
The first goal and the bad miss I talked about are here.
He was probably substituted because the game was won and he had done his bit and they need to rap him up in cotton wool for the world cup
With the Red Knights effectively shelving there planned bid to oust the Glazer I wonder how people feel that have offered them support.
Do they feel they have been hoodwinked and served up false hope, just curious.
I know I would be raging with anger, so many false dawns and no concrete offer.
Cheers Chrispiano for link
The Goals look good though and seem to come quite naturally with no thought or effort, just looks a real goal scorer.
Possibly we have found a real diamond.
good goals by hernandes.future star.
http://www.redforcerising.net/2010/05/31/video-man-utds-hernandez-scores-against-gambia/
parryheid – The only hatchet i’ve got is under my bed.
@Ash Mate the link has already been put up at 18.13, lol
btw that link has been updated and shows the 2nd goal, look from where he starts and his pace to get on that cross.
What a confident man:
http://www.mirrorfootball.co.uk/news/Jose-Mourinho-will-have-an-escape-clause-in-his-Real-Madrid-contract-enabling-him-to-join-Manchester-United-article442105.html
@Chrispiano ok sorry Ash, have a wee look, ta.jaysus you gotta leave the Blog though.
Well played chico, whats that now, 6 in 10 games.
its 7 in 11 willie
Chrispiano – Cheers mate, i wasn’t far out.
@Willie, Jaysus mate my eyes have just been diverted elswhere, see that Advert on the top of the blog, looking for more men, see the Burd on the left, hells bells the tits on that would smother yeah, nice pillows though.
next for Mexico is Italy on June 3rd in Brussels.
redscot – You sure your on ROM lol.
willierednut.not a jibe at you my friend,sometimes a lot of my remarks are tongue in cheek.Other times I just talk out my xxxx.
@Willie lol yeah it was a advert for dating I suspect, just two nice looking ladies, with shall I say rather revealing clevage, nice though.
I had not seen it before, sorry stupid comment.Just thought it added a bit of colour to the banner adverts.Well it tickled me.
maybe saying this too early but if chicharito is the REAL DEAL all we need this summer is a creative midfielder. we have enough strikers and if this lad can carry the same form for United we have 4 top qualtiy strikers and some good youngsters too. saying that, gamibia are no big team. however he also scored against the dutch. the world cup will answer a lot of our questions about his ability to perform on the big stage
@AIG, well said mate and spot on Buddie, From the links we have seen and the goals per ratio of games as you say could be the real deal!
Mate you have a vast knowledge of football, who do you think in the midfield attacking sense wise we can get at a realistic price and wage.
Joe Cole playing at the head of a 4-3-3 for England today looked very good, better than he is in on the wings, if we get him to play there when we play 4-5-1/4-3-3 and fill in as a winger then he could be all we need.
@Chrispiano, yes agree, to get a fully fledged International player for zero fee in, although large wage appeals, but I guess the club will be slandered for signing only free transfers so this is like a posioned chalice if you like.
He delivered the ball sweetly as well.
You know who wrecked that lads confidence, none other than Mr Mourhino.Sir Alex would rebuild it of this i am sure.
Just a thought….Now that the Red Knights are seemingly out of it……. I wonder….do any of these so-called businessmen own a yellow and gold scarf knitting factory…..?? Cos some fucker sure has made a fucking mint out of them.
I personally think the green and gold campaign will continue and grow stronger after all its one of many ways the fans can make a visual protest in front of the cameras and world wide audience at there objection of the Glazer, i never felt it was a green and gold campaign in support of the Red Knights.
To me until I saw there proposals I was always a bit suspicous of there true intentions and agenda.
I’m sure SAF noticed how Joe Cole linked up with Rooney today, it could be the deal of the summer.
@redscot
hi mate.
thanks for that. i do watch all the major leagues and there are quite a few players who fit the bill. if we dont want to spend much then obviously joe cole is the answer. my worry with him is he is too injury prone and is aging. he is 28 now. silva is the other name that comes up but many clubs are reportedly interested in him and it will just increase his value to some ridiculous price like 30 or 40 million which only shitty or real will pay. defour, hamsik are options too.dont know how much you have heard of javier pastore who plays for palermo and is in maradonas argentina squad for the WC. good talent and is just 20. other good players include ganso who plays for santos. he is 20 too and a good talent. then there is mesut ozil of werder bremen
sorry to mention so many names . cole would be a great short term options but his signing would be a short term one. however that looks the most likely at the moment
Ever since the rumours about Joe Cole coming to Utd started, I was convinced that it would be a bad idea, which we may regret… Mainly because I thought it may hinder the progression of our young wingers. However, if he is available for free then we should snap him up. We can play him in an attacking role, so the left wing is open for competition between Nani/Park/Obertan/Tosic (?) only. With the new 25 player rule coming in for next season, his versatility may be a bonus, although if he does come here then Fergie will probably use him sparingly. He was brilliant against Japan today playing behind Rooney, and the pair linked up well. I think he can provide us with what we’re missing. He can be a short term solution to our midfield, until we can find a young, talented attacking midfielder for the long term.
@ AIG, well Owen was injury prone but he did turn out to be a great signing. He did get injured at the most crucial stage of the season, although if it wasn’t for the Wembley pitch, then who knows, he may have stayed fit for the remainder of the season, would have been availabe to partner Berbatov, and we may even have picked up points against Blackburn and Chelsea, we may have even won the League.. Anyway, if Joe Cole is used sparingly, maybe used mostly for big games, and we don’t use him at Wembley if the pitch is still not sorted, then I think he won’t get injured too often.
@Aig. wow….. Thanks there are a few names there to ponder over, not familiar sorry with Javier Pastore, I will check that name later and his background etc.
Its a tricky puzzle and all speculation and theories but thank you for your thoughts and views.
I cant really see the problem with Cole other than he is on a free, just think a few days ago we were being linked with James Milner in excess of 20 million pounds fee and 1 good season at Villa and the lads were raving about him as being a great addition.
The problem for me with Cole he is on a free and this is a rod that will be used in the press and other media to beat over the back of Manchester United. Agreed whole heartedly about the age.
Sorry I was slow with reply, was away chatting to a friend, A Celtic supporter, jaysus thay cant haver rubbish. lol
@ Willie @ 19.58 ever to the point mate, well noticed. I hope Sir Alex saw that also.
Your not Joe’s agent by any chance are you. ?
I would add Gourcuff to aig’s list.
All we need for Rooney to enter this debate and we will all be put in our place. lol I hope so.
Or king Eric to say get a fucking grip and we will all hide.
Or Costas to advise of Joe Coles poor passing rate and assists. lol.
Joking of course on all those points pure Scottish humour.
redscot – I wish i was mate, think of the commission lol. I just think it’s too good of an oppurtunity to pass up, a very good player on a bosman, now thats value.
@willie,redscot
yeah. how the fuck did i forget gourcuff, another top talent and he is just 24.
i certainly dont want milner that much. he is an average player who has lot of energy but we dont need that. we need someone with genuine quality and milner dosent fit the bill. let shitty have him. ole certainly is worth a punt. he has quality and as willie said his link up play with rooney today was excellent.
theere are options but a lot of these players will be at the world cup. that could raise their price significantly
The sorta thing we should really consider is sell the fucking lot we have all our players and just go down to Tescos and get a new bunch, simples and double card points too
cole not ole. lol. typo error
@fze123
yeah. the fucking wembley pitch did some of our players badly. owen did do well fitness wise until that point. cole when fit is a class act and i think to keep him injury free he will have the same fitness regime as owen had . that will maximise the amount of games he plays. with a fully fit squad we can rest him too. he can also be used as an impact sub
Seriously, does anyone know if Cole commands a signing on fee, and how much, why have Chelsea let his contract run down to nothing.
Just curious, possibly you can answer that our Belfast friend, who I will personally hold responsible for if we sign him and he turns sour on United.
As you say Willie the Bosman ruling jeezie peeps, some one’s gonna trouser a load of money.
Actually, I wouldn’t like to see Joe Cole at United, so if I can find any negative stats, I will gladly pass them along.
@ Costas I was seriously getting worried as i think most lads were, no posts from you today, I thought he must either be sunning himself on some beach in delightfull Greece or staying out of this thread, lol.
Thats made my night, truely.
Not joking either, although you are totally wrong on Joe Cole.
Chuffed to bits you are still around. I will enjoy your posts as normal tommorow.
Off to the Pub, with my mates. Aforisto poli, I think in Greek mean’s, thank you Sir.
So negative Costas, i’m not sure thats you.
Scott, where are you leaving on a jet plane? lol
Bon Voyage..
@redscot
Nah, I haven’t forgotten about this place. I am just trying to wrap up some last college stuff for this semester. It should be done by Wednesday. The I hit the beach.
@Willierednut
Lol, it is me mate. No imposter this time. He is a good player, but I wouldn’t like to see him at United. I was actually more warm about the Michael Owen deal last summer. For the record, it’s got nothing to do with his Chelsea ties.
@Costas
Interesting that you don’t see him as a good fit. But who else could we afford? IMO, his title winning experience, his skill, pace and creativity and importantly, his versatility (he plays right, left and centre) is exactly what we need, and if not, we need a player in his mould who we can afford. We HAVE to strengthen, this is a golden opportunity. Gourcuff is all well and good, but he hasn’t got Premier League experience, he might not click, and ultimately, his value would be inflationary.
We keep saying we can’t afford him or that, or not good value for money, but here we have JOE COLE, one of England’s best midfielders who is available to fill that position between midfield and attack, and suddenly, we become a bit (snobbish?) and say he’s past it? He’s available for FREE, imagine if we were told this 2 or 3 years ago… we weren’t too fussy with Micky Owen’s performances, heck, people seem to think he’s more of a threat than our record signing (won’t go too far into this, for obvious reasons) and he’s injury prone, he’s 30 and is revitalising his seemingly bleak career with us. To turn Joe down would be a great mistake, even an arrogant decision IMHO, but we’re not SAF, HE calls the shots, whether that be Joe Cole coming to United for FREE, or Mourinho succeeding him.
@Moscow is my heaven
Well I didn’t say that Joe Cole is past it. Of course he isn’t. That being said, at 28 years old I would only take him on a free. But that’s not what this is about. It’s not like United to make signings like that. We did it once with Michael Owen, but I don’t want us to make a habit of it. Something about bringing in a player that was basically rejected by his previous club turns me off.
I am not saying that I want us to spend money no matter what. But, after last season we do need to stregthen the squad. And in my opinion, you can’t do that just with the Smallings and the Chicaritos of this world. And if we have funds to spend on players, as David Gill suggested we do, then we can do better than Joe Cole.
And then there’s another issue. We are in a good position in therms of wingers. It’s not a position where we need stregthening. Nani and Valencia could possible reach new heights this season and we have Park and Giggs behind them. And then there’s Obertan who showed signs of settling down towards the end of the season. And to be honest, I’d much rather give him an opportunity than Joe Cole.
Classic( wont go into this for obvious reasons) roflmao. moscow is my heaven. you dont mean Dimatar do you.
I just laughed like crazy at that.
I will go to my bed now after reading all the posts and lil digs like Sprite, and for your benifit although I wont put it up on web cam, my gorgeous girlfriend is in my sack.
Slightly pissed but still capable of reading.
Nite Reds, glad we recovered some humour.
Blows a kiss* in the sky, catch it Reds its just for you.
I’m beginning to think that Fergie may be a closet Green and Gold fan.
Perhaps he thinks that if UTD fail to reach the CL next year then the loss of about £30m per season – what UTD have picked up in recent seasons – may propel the owners into a situation that they can’t pay the interest on their borrowings.
A bad credit rating would not be something the Glazers would want.
How else could Fergie’s lack of spending in the transfer market be explained?
Talk of signing FREES such as J Cole may be part of Fergie’s ploy.
And before people say that Fergie wouldn’t do that then remember this – Fergie’s loyalty is to UTD, not the Glazers.
Joe Cole on a free wouldn’t be a bad signing considering the options available….he’s got the ability to shine at United and would be a lot less restricted with us compared
to Chelsea. They stifled his progress this lad was on the verge of superstardom at West Ham, I reckon Fergie can get the best out of him.
Joe Cole it’s a tough call for me. He is a good player but i can’t say i like him much. I think he is a diver, he played for Chelsea, he is 28 years old and might want 100k in wages which is UNREAL.
There were players who sacrificed a part of their salary in order to play for us and i think Joe Cole would have to do just that. But i am not sure and i think Costas put some valid points.
I agree we might need an AM but i still believe Anderson will come good. He is asuch a talent and i just hope Fergie figures out how to use him in the position we are short of.
And i have strong believe we might need a left winger. Park, Obertan, Nani are all right-footed players and we can’t rely on Giggsy salvaging us. It is just a little dream, a dream of seeing a left-footed player on his own territory. I am a bit tired of experiments.
Anyway all this talk of value-for-money does indeed make sense but we can’t afford to play this game and lose title for the second year running. Gill can’t afford it i’m afraid.
We failed to take notice of “the duck” aka Pato in time. Hope we do better and act faster in signing up “the goose” aka Ganso.
As far as Cole is concerned, I’ve got to agree with Costas.
http://www.newsoftheworld.co.uk/sport/830572/MOURINHO-CONVINCED-HELL-SUCCEED-FERGIE.html
what a confident man. people dont want to manage United fearing the pressure they will be under but this man enjoys it.
some people on this are running out of things to say, its like they’ve been writing the same thing every post
give it up to redscot and moscow is my heaven
you never know what your gonna get with top posts
Morning to all that give a shit im saying hello to them
Chicarito scored twice i dont know if anyone has linked the goals but
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KP-bj5iqmXc&
this guy smells like ole, a 6 yard box toepoker with vision
what i seen from him that gets me excited without getting over excited is not the fact that he has 3 in 2 but his link up play is so good it makes me frustrated that we are near 5 months till Rooney plays for united but Himself and berbatov is another wonderful prospect
Chicarito= wonderful prospect
Joe Coles a no go for me. I think hes too old, sure hes only 28 but if his first season is a bedding in season after that Sir Alex is already looking for a replacement because of age. United does not need quick fixes. The strike force as far as Im concerned is done. A pairing of centre forward Rooney and Striker Hernandez, second pairing of centre forward Berbatov and Striker Owen. The second string giving us extra cover and teaching the youngsters, the third pair being centre forward Macheda and striker Diouf. Im not sure where Wellbeck fits in but possibly he looks better in a wide left role, not a left winger as such but if we decide to play the loan striker away to sticky opposition then Rooney on his own with Wellbeck left, Valencia or Nani on the right.
What about the youngster whos been on loan to Ajax, whos owned by managerless Inter. The Brazillian we looked at a while back, Kerlon the one who juggles the ball with his head, running through defences. Could be someone to get the blood boiling again.
Kerlon has failed to impress since all the hype started around him, I can’t see Fergie taking a gamble on a player like that when we’re still trying to realise the potential of Anderson/Berbatov….as I said earlier Cole would be useful but like a few of you have said, whether it’s a free transfer or not he’s not worth 100k a week.
Think Petrucci will possibly get a first team appearance this season if he can stay clear or injury.
I know we have got a lot of options already but we relied way too much on Wayne last season, Owen is hit and miss, Berbatov is a fantastic player but he himself admits he can do a lot better, and Hernandez is looking like a good prospect but until we see him in the first team we won’t know. I remember people on here talking about Manucho and saying how he looked like another Drogba!!!
Macheda/Welbeck have to step it up this season if they’re to be serious first team
players too.
So as a proven out and out goalscorer who we can rely on week in and week out, it leaves just Rooney!! He’s had a long hard season carrying the mantle for United, he’s going to the WC with the whole country expecting him to be the catalyst for success, then as soon as the WC Is over he’ll be back at United ready for another season…as energetic an enthusiastic as he is I hope he doesn’t get worn out…..
redscot
can you please tell me what you mean by that.. thank you
@Rai
Do you think that Kerlon would cost alot then. I would of thought having not really broken into the Ajax team that his value would have dropped and with Inter not having a manager then its only Moratti to convince of a sale and if he doesnt see anything he particularly like maybe its a goer. I dont believe Kerlon has become a bad player over night and a player in and out of the first team doesnt really get his feet under the table as it were, a chance to really shine with any consistency. We could argue the same about players like Wellbeck, Macheda, Possibon etc that have had a handful of games and not exactly shone, they arent bad players just need time. I think Fergie could get the best out of the boy and teach him what to do and what not to do. He has agood free kick and a lovely defence splitting pass and wouldnt expect to jump into the first team from day one. Id think its worth a chance at 10-12 million. If anything hes got that baby face the girls adore and there have to be shirt sales there, lol.
@ Goat
Lol at the shirt sales!!!
I’m not saying he’s a bad player mate but even at 10-12million for a player that can’t break into the Ajax team is too much. I’d much rather spend double (if possible) and bring in David Silva.
@brisbanefan – That’s one of the most ridiculous posts I’ve ever read.
@Rai
Ive heard hes injury prone (about Silva) and from what ive seen hes a bit light weight. I realise Kerlons a bit light weight but a winger more often than not gets the majority of the kickings – sliding tackles. I also wouldnt want to spend that much – quoted figures around 25 to 30 million. Thats silly money unless you can get 10+ years playing time for him.
@brisbanefan
Do you want me to call you a doctor, do you antipodeans actually walk around upside down. Your comment is either down to a serious mental disease or blood rushing to your head and putting you in a drunk like state. Try doing a handstand and talking out your arse for a while, it will make better sense and then we can all put it down to you being Australian.
@ Goat
25 Mill for Silva is expensive but any top quality player will be. We paid 30 for Berba when he was 27, I think Silva is about 23/24 so it wouldn’t be a total rip off. Fergie will more than likely sign someone none of us expect anyway!!!!
@ Brisbane……..Mate you need your head checking.
@redscot
YES, I actually meant DIMATAR FUCKING BERBATOV. Owen has scored a hat-trick for United in his first-half a season in the CHAMPIONS LEAGUE (has Berbatov EVER scored a hat-trick for us?), has scored just 3 less goals than BERBATOV even though he played half a fucking season, and scored a crucial goal in a CUP FINAL (does Berbatov recognise that?) to give us our only cup of the last season. So YES, he IS a better fucking goal threat than Berbatov, because he knows how to SCORE GOALS. Do you recognise the relationship between scoring goals and goal threat? It is difficult to unlock his potential at his age, he hasn’t clicked, and since he isn’t gonna leave, I sincerely wish him the best next season and all the luck (he sure needs it now) as a United player, but I’m not gonna be suckered into thinking he’s what we need next season to lift the burden a bit off Rooney’s shoulders. He FAILED that remember, not once, not twice, but three times he was given the opportunity. It hurts when you think back to it, but you gotta understand UTD fans don’t turn on our players overnight. He has had TWO whole years, yet Owen has done more to justify his status as a United player than him in half a season. Don’t let blind faith towards him cloud your memories. Owen ‘s half the size of Berba, yet he’s scored a header for us in the short time he’s been here. Has Berbatov ever scored a heade… but no, I’m being unfair on him, our wingers shit delivery makes it impossible for Berba the genius to get on the end of them and score.
I’m sorry but I can’t take arrogantly condescending remarks aimed at people’s OPINION, feel free to disagree, that’s what the blog’s all about, but don’t score points mate. Have a nice day, pal.
moscow
Berba has 12 goals in 24 games in EPL, so get off his back..
also you are talking about the carling cup, who fucking made that goal? dont make a joke of yourself..
also you dont say fucking Berbatov, fucking Carrick, fucking Rooney etc. that is the names of united players
who is to say that berba hadnt scored 20+ if he played more than 24 of 38 matches?
also some of those matches were as a lone striker, something everyone with half a brain sees that berba doesnt like to be.. yet he created a chance for valencia, had a couple of half chances and everyone is blaming berba..
@Sprite
Spot on mate. What our good friend doesn’t realise is that our strikers spent alot of time on the treatment table. There were only a handful of games we could field two forwards and when we could it was two No9′s (centre forwards). Both like to come back, press defenders, tackle back, come deep to get the ball and the balance if you play the two of them doesn’t work. Owen is a No10, Macheda is a No9 but stays up field, Wellbeck is a No10 all of whom were missing for a sizeable chunk. I think the Berbatov situation has been fixed with the signing of Hernandez. I think the Rooney situation (relying too much on one player) has been fixed with the signing of Hernandez. AND with Owen back I think at United its looking pretty rosey.
@sprite
I’m not blaming Berbatov for our deficiencies. The key issue at hand is how we support Rooney. He has evolved to become a lone striker this season, he doesn’t need the team to adapt to his style, he can adapt to the new formations that United produce. By the time we find a perfect strategy for employing Berbatov to win big games (I’m talking title-deciders, must win return legs, big four clashes etc), we will have stunted the development of our younger strikers who will be more effective to us than him. It’s been 2 years, we’ve evidently failed, but fuck it, let’s continue to switch the team around to suit his ‘perfect position’. If he doesn’t like being the strike partner of our best player, AND he doesn’t like being played up-front on his own, what else can a striker possibly like? If he wants to play in midfield (where he spends most of his time) then fine, but that defeats the point of the shirt number on his back.
We’ve already been over his goal stats, but they really don’t tell the whole story, as it’s been realised on the blog many many times before on previous threads. I’m sorry my half-brain doesn’t recognise the obvious fear he strikes into defenders, especially in the Carling Cup final, when he was robbed of the ball cleanly by the Villa defender, only for the ball to conveniently roll in front of Owen who rushed into the box. You know the rest…
@GoatinaUnitedShirt
Simple question: How many of our rich range of strikers will get to start against Chelsea next season?
Good that you mention Hernandez. He excites me, I hope he doesn’t buckle against criticism towards him, and answers by scoring more goals. Take note Berba.
the chance in tactics all the time will ruin the development of our younger strikers? A team that are going to compete in the top has to change the tactics from time to time anyways.. The most talented young strikers we have are Joshua King (most talented) and Will Keane (also very talented) IMHO and they wont become first team players in a while..So I dont think berba will be at fault if they fail to come through…
Who has said that he doesnt like to be Rooney’s strike partner?, all I said was that he doesnt prefer to be lone striker, something that everyone can see, including people with half a brain.. including you and everyone else, still I didnt say that you had half a brain, where was that? He does prefer to play with another striker, and it could be either Owen, Hernandez or Rooney (maybe preferably Owen/Hernandez, because Rooney and Berba is doing much of the same work .. )
You dont include the part where Berba robbed the ball from Dunne, why is that? Yes, Dunne came back and made a clean tackle, but it wouldnt have falled to Owens’s feet in the first place if Berba hadnt stole it from Dunne, or..?
“Simple question: How many of our rich range of strikers will get to start against Chelsea next season?”
We do lack in the CM department actually, Scholes, on of our 2 best opinions in CM although he is 35, cant run around like he did before and play against the likes of Lampard, Gerrard, Iniesta, Essien with only Fletcher beside him.. so we will still play 4-5-1, even if Torres, Villa, or Aguero come here..
Would that have been a problem with a midfield like this:?
Keane (young) – Scholes (young) or this:
Fletcher – Hargreaves
doubt it.
Moscow is my heaven says
“Simple question: How many of our rich range of strikers will get to start against Chelsea next season?”
How the hell is that an easy question. Hell Fergie doesn’t even know. Maybe Berba gets off to a flyer scoring 10 in his first 4 games, maybe Rooneys injured. No one on here is clever enough to predict the future. If you want my opinion whos good enough then Rooney-Hernandez pairing or Berbatov-Hernandez pairing, Rooney-Owen pairing or Berbatov-Owen pairing or Rooney on his own with three wingers behind him. I wouldn’t worry yourself too much, we missed out on the league by 1 point, the damage was the 0-0 draw against Blackburn after the Chelsea match. You have to consider motivation and tiredness. When we played Chelsea first time the league was along way from finishing and the three points meant just that 3 points. Second time around we were 5 points clear so for Chelsea it was a bit desperate. There is a chance we looked at the games ahead and thought there was no one we couldn’t beat. Maybe expecting Rooney to do the biz BUT he got injured and we tripped over the final hurdle. Taking away the Chelsea games we were far superior and consistant against the lower teams, that has to count for something. I remember the days when we beat Arsenal 6-2 at Highbury in the cup, next round Liverpool at Anfield (this when the league was being fought out between Arsenal and Liverpool) and then lose to 2nd division Sheffield Wednesday in the final. Thats being inconsistant, its all swings and roundabouts. We were close, we played well, the lads did well. I wouldn’t read too much into Chelseas success, they are an aging team with very few decent youngsters coming through. We are fucking unstoppable, we’ll be there or thereabouts.
@sprite
If Torres came here, it would be Rooney-Torres with Nani on the left, Valencia on the right and a strong Anderson and Fletcher/Hargreaves in CM. Torres could not possibly be deposed of the Starting XI if he was here. LMAO. Now THAT would be unstoppable.
I didn’t say that YOU said that he doesn’t like being partnered with Rooney, but I remember it from one of the wild excuses after frustrating games last season.
You forgot about Macheda, Welbeck and Chicharito who have played between them Premier League, Champions League and International football. It would take me a while before I come across Josh King and Will Keane, who haven’t played in any of the competitions stated above. I think the younger strikers, especially Chicharito and Macheda should be given more of a chance next season.
@Sprite good read mate. I think your right about the centre of the park. I think Fletcher is a decent player and can only wish Hargreaves will return. It worrying listening to Fergie saying he has confidence issues. You know dont say anything unless you need to, why does Fergie feel the need to talk about Hargos confidence issues – doesn’t fill me with confidence. Ando is something, there is ability there and like all youngsters you try and see which old player he reminds you off, helps you gauge whether he will fit in. Rob Lee of Newcastle old is the nearest I can get – not 100% but he should have more time. Carrick has that expensive Spurs player face, its botox or something, expressionless or lack of caring Berbatov has it too. You wonder if they have confidence, want to actually play or just earn the money. He can pass a great long ball and even split defences its just his manner. Gibson has come on leaps and bounds and he should get more playing time at the beginning I thought o heres another Gerrard, old tackle, take a walk about and to get the crowd shouting your name shot from long distance and hope one or two go in. Nothing looks better than a 30 yard screamer but when only 1 of 4 go in and better options were available, managers like Sir Alex get impatient. But Gibson started to show at the end that his possitioning is better and is more aware of finding space and readiness in receiving the ball, what was lacking at the beginning.
I would like to see a defensive midfielder come in myself, cover for Hargo. Maybe even let Fabio have that role, he had it a few times in the reserves and he looked good (only height an issue).
I can see joe cole has the paul scholes replacement in the creative side of things. He would be an outstanding bit of buisness, he is 28 ppl forget we signed berbatov for 30 million at 28 and also cole is starting to get back to the swing of things, his return to the chelsea team he really did give them an extra dimension, and he would be perfect in the 4231 formation has he would play off rooney with valencia and nani on either side, or we could use cole on the left and nani can play right side and that saying value for money, joe cole free transfer at the age of 28 would be the signing of the summer add the fact milner will cost well over 30 million bring on JC.
@Goat
I do not compare United’s performances against Chelsea’s or anyone else’s. Chelsea were shit this season, yet they won the league. I do not aspire United to meet the quality of title winners Chelsea, since they LOST 6 GAMES this season. Instead, I consider United of 07/08 to be the benchmark, lightning football, from front to back, simply unstoppable. The generous reasoning that United finished 1 point behind a poor Chelsea side doesn’t take away from the fact we lost 7 games in the league last season. The lads put in a fantastic shift last season, and it brought a tear to my eye to see them so dissappointed at Sunderland and Old Trafford for the last game of the season. We cannot ignore the lack of recognised quality up-front, so we need to make a decision. We weren’t unstoppable this season, hell, Burnley beat us, so we must evolve, because ‘At United, we strive for perfection, and if we fail, we might just have to settle for excellence.’
As for Chelsea, they are FUCKING SHIT, but instead of focusing on beating them, let’s focus on living up to our benchmark.
*back to front*
@rtnk
spot on mate.
moscowismyheaven
you dont take my point about the 4-5-1.. It is no point in having good forwards if the midfield is lacking..
and at the moment Scholes and Fletcher are our best options, at least that is what you could see towards the end of the season.. and Scholes is too old to play the against the Xavi’s/Iniesta’s of this world with only Fletcher by his side.. you are saying Ando/Fletcher.. maybe, if Ando get a hard kick up his arse.. he isnt good enough yet.. only if he does a Nani
goat
spot on about Hargo and Gibbo.. Gibson hasnt blown me away either, but I remember this one game where he really had many good passes and I just thought “this guy will come of age”.
As for Hargo I am concerned as well.. the fact that he need pain injections just to take part in training sessions does not sound very good, but lets wait and see..
All i ever hear is, we need a am, or a goalscoring midfielder, but not many names are ever mentioned. You know why? there isn’t that many top class midfielders around Europe, the lack of quality is staggering. I think thats why we’re being linked with Cole, and on a freebie, the boss should snap him up.
@sprite
I take your point that a central pairing to take on those names is difficult, but I feel Fergie would somehow, someway accomodate a Torres-like striker in the Starting XI.
.
@willierednut
Exactly mate, who else is out there (who are available to us)?
Rtnk
We signed berba at 27 mate..
Given all the rediculous prices out there, all the Argies between £40-60m only because they think everyone will turn out like messi.. Di Unproven Maria is never more than £20m in a realistic market..
Milner at £30, fuck even that Bolton guy, Cahill is it? for £30m.. Joe Cole could be a shrewd piece of business..
But he isnt worth rediculous wages.. I somehow understand Chelsea in that sense..
sprite – I would rather pay outstanding wages than spend the kind of prices been touted about, and cole may not extend his contract because of where chelsea see him in the team he wants a new challenge and he may think moving to a bigger club could give breath new life into his career, ronaldo also left because he also felt he could lose the hunger, cole moving to united will see him born again. its pot and kettle if we are not paying good wages or pay for players then this club really is worryingly short of cash.
Rtnk
yeah, if we could only pay Cole 120k/week it would have been all fine, but then the rest of the lads think “oh, if cole is paid that much, I certainly deserve twice as much/as much as him” and our wage structure will be at risk.. thats my concern
sprite – I’m not sure he would get 120k at United mate, i would think 90, 100k would be more likely the figure.
Oh sorry, my mistake, dont know where I heard the 120k/week.. I am sure I have heard it somewhere lol… oh, found it: http://therepublikofmancunia.com/would-you-take-joe-cole-on-a-free/
but I also think £100k is a bit too much.. remember the guy who eat dogs has about £70k/week and that was held to be a massive deal for him..
£90k would be max, at £90k I think the salary structure could be fine.
think you’ll find if sir alec has already been having a chat with joe as he likes to do, his terms will have already been sealed with a handshake so if he’s coming to United there’s no point squabbling about his worth.
isnt there a wage structure in place at united. a 28 year old freebe couldnt get 120k nomatter who he is
could well be .But should he be coming there’s lots of ways round that,ie signing on fees and such.
@Sprite your post today @ 22.07 Asking what I meant! re read the thread mate, my post to Costas @ 21.51 Sunday evening.Your post @ 22.07 Sunday evening, asking Scott about plane journeys lol And do not attempt to suggest it was the moderator.Thats a Anal attempt at having a pop.
That is why I replied, Too YOU having a lil dig(joke) in my post prior to going to bed. I know my post sounded Gay, but I dont care I just wanted to hear, Costas views on Joe Cole.
@Moscow is my heaven@14.23 today” I’m sorry but I cant take arrogantly condecending remarks at peoples opinions, feel free to diasgree, thats what the blog’s all about, but not to score points mate.
I cant see why I was scoring a point in my post to you simply asking are you refering to Dimatar,I have a different view from you mate, and you have ranted through your post to bash Dimatar that is your perogative as a fan.
All I will add is if we sell Dimatar and raise as some media sites and agents suggest raise 12~ 15 Million pounds, can we get a more productive player for the funds raised, I suggest not, infact know not.
Ps If you want to trade insults I am happy with that, regards condescending and arrogant, but really prefer to talk about Manchester United and the thread we are on.
Have a nice whatever Pal.
Thanks GHTT, for shout on surreal posting, all good fun.
@redscot
Looking back at my comment, I think what I said was way too heated, when all you mentioned was ‘did you mean Berbatov’. I did say that Berbatov wasn’t gonna leave, so I might as well get behind him just like the past 2 seasons, as he’s a United player. Not in the best mood when I read your reply, so apologies all the same and yeah, let’s keep it United.
Joe Cole wants £100k, so there’s no point stating or discussing any value above that, maybe we could find a mid-value between what he gets at Chelsea £80k and what he wants, so settle at £90k would be enought to tempt him in our direction.
redscot
I didnt fully understand everything you just wrote,
anyways I was talking to Scott The Red mate.. he wrote in his facebook status, that he is leaving on a jet plane.. I asked him where he was going.. maybe he was having a laugh, but I thought since he hadnt posted anything on RoM in a while that he was serious, but then he posted something today, so no worries..
The papers are talking about Arteta again coming to
United, I’d be chuffed with that….it’s gonna be a long summer
of being linked everyone and anyone
arteta is a super super footballer, id love it if he came….
In my opinion NO to Arteta. Too old, as soon as a top spanish club comes calling he’ll want to go. Its all very well that Everton look better with him biut would we. I doubt it.
GoatinaUnitedShirt
to be fair i dont think barca or madrid will ever come calling, where would he fit in at barca for example, whereas we could do with his creatiivity, i personally think we could do alot worse than arteta, he’s proven in the premiership and with better players around him at united imagine how he could shine
Look at this picture from Aon’s official site:
http://www.aon.com/unitedin2010/images/AON_MANU_HERO6.jpg
“Rafael” is represented by a picture of Evra and “Rooney” is actually Solskjaer!
I’d like to hear their Global PR man explain that one!
@Moscow is my heaven, No problem’s mate and most certainly no need for any apoligies,I realise we all get a little heated and angry if we are not getting our points across correctly and people are not taking on board what someone might be saying.
I understand you are sceptical of Dimitar, and can also appreciate your reasons why.Like you I just think as he is a United player and if and looks like he will be with us next season, as you say lets support him.
Agreed totally if we can sign a fully fledged international player for zilch and a wage of 90k per week would be a steal and Joe Cole would be a United style player with I believe the professionalism and commitment to blossom at United.Cheers for response mate.
@Sprite, ohhhhh right we got our wires crossed, lol which is not unusual on a blog of this nature,
What I wrote was the reference points as to how we got to there, were we did, but in all honesty it was just me having a wee bit fun, I really dont like bad feeling and squabbling over minor details.
So Sprite as you say no worries or hassle. High 5! lol
Keeping my head down and away to read page bye page of all the links in the first part of the season review, I started reading last night and Jaysus only got to October 2nd 2009, and guess what the thread was Berbatov lol.Maybe communicate again in a few weeks when I have ploughed through the rest. lmao
Dave Mack, you’re right, its much bigger than a club, but that doesnt mean it should be run like any business tycoon. The Glazers have a responsibility in keeping the fans content and doing what ever it takes to make the team successful. Im shiver when I think of what will happen when SAF retires, its him thats keeping this team so successful. Im afraid they might sell a player that would be incremental in the strategy of the team and bloop we would no longer become top european competition, or as I like to put it, top european fear.
I believe that these Glazer fucks are only in it for the money, wish to run it like they run their american football team. Surely you should know that the Tampa Bay Buccaneers have had several horrible runs with bad coaching and bad management. I just dont want that to happen to United after Sir Alex retires…..
Fuck the Glazers, Love United
Looks like the Red Devils will do it again this season