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Anyone got the starting eleven? Hope we get the job done today, and pile the pressure on the rent buys……Pompey stil doing wel….Come on Pompey…
Torres had a real opportunity there…..Stil Pool 0…Michael Brown taring the pool scum…Breaking up most of their play….
Pompey 2……………..POOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL LOOSERS…HAA HAA
Kuszczak, Fletcher, De Laet, Carrick, Evra, Valencia, Scholes, Anderson, Gibson, Owen, Rooney.
Subs: Foster, Berbatov, Park, Tosic, Welbeck, Fabio Da Silva, Obertan.
lol @ liverpool
@Mr Santos, Thanks mate…..
No Giggs in bench even….Shit…Anything worng?
Giggs had a hamstring problem and Vidic a calf strain. Pity they didn’t manage to shake them off for this game.
Hop we beat fulham and westham do us a favour. Come on united. Are u guys watching merseyside
I’m tempted for a bit of banter on facebook to all my Scouse supporting friend but I’ll wait until after our match.
carlton palmer predicting a draw & trevor sinclair going for a fulham win on tv. well…..i says: Go fucking suck a dick & rinse ur fucking dirty mouth! Come On Utd!! Prove them wrong!!!
Shitepool haha haha!
Scared, fuck em we gonna beat em
Gonna go….Catch ya all after the match, hopefully with a big smile…Go United Go……
Howard Webb? Oh dear…
This defence thing is a nightmare, absolutely sick and tired of it now, want Fletcher in centre midfield where he’s so important to our chances. Berbatov on the bench: time to well and truly admit, the man is a £31m fringe player, it hasn’t worked out, if it had he’d be an automatic selection.
We’re all over ‘em! C’mon Owen (haha never get used to saying that)! Terrible yellow card call. Fuck you Webb.
Lads,
Im watching on Sopcast channel shanghai sports. Video stream is very good but unfortunitaly it is Chneese Comentary! No offence to Any Asian people but there is only so many chun su ling chao ci hang chan wang woo choo booo goawo i can take!!
Anyone know of any english comentary streams?
Thanks in advance!
anyone know of any english comentatry streams?
sorry for duplicated post… firfox was playing tricks… didnt show my last post had posted! haha
@FusilliJerry
Maybe its time you give him a chance!… give him to the end of the season!
No harm in rotation, Owen deserves a game! Berbatov just back from injury!
Fulham look up for it today, hard to break down and full of engergy>
scholes is typical scholes. pulling the strings, always having time on the ball. Picking out smart long passes and also has already been booked for a typical scholes challange! hahaha
Gibson has just had another shot, its nice that we have a player in the team that from distance isnt afraid to shoot!..> The lad can hit 4 wide and still have no doubts about hitting a 5th long shot!… I like it!
Fuck sake, great save Tomas!
Kuzack has just made a good save, he hasnt done too bad with a run of games in the team!
Goddamnit!
for me 20 Minutes gone and we are over defending. Fulham having the beter of the play. Our midfield sitting too deep, probably protecting the weakend back four of Evra, Carrick, Deleat and Fletcher!
Think we need to keep a clean sheet and get fergie to give a pep talk at half time!
Fulham 1 up murphy lon shot. Carless from paul scholes! Gave the ball away in midfield and Kushak slipped and murphys shot hit the corner!
Any decent streams not on SopCast?
Just fecking great! Scholes who usually rarely gave the ball away kept giving the ball away in dangerous areas.
not that i know of.. have found sopcast very good if you can put up with the chinky comentary
With regards to the game, We do look like we are struggleing for form or composure!
FOr me midfield are sitting too deep. Last pass letting us down, Gibson has had a few shots but maybe needs to mix it up also and look for the cross or throughball! Rooney is getting the hump with him after his last shot!
Scholes has hit a few missed passes, its one of them games where nothing seems to be coming off!
Rushed shot by rooney!.. Way way way over the bar!
@hurr
Yeah, doesnt look on form! Although saying that none of the lads look on form!
Couldnt see too clearly on stream but looked like anderson had a shot!
Think i will say no more!
i don’t ever remember the lads turning the ball over this often in a first half!
still, no need to panic.
Anderson has had another shot!!…. dont think i will say anymore again!
@rooninho
Saying that we have had many many first halfs like this over the years, a half time pep talk from fergie will see us passing the ball more quicker, Being more direct!
Fulham are playing with good tempo but for sure they wont keep this up the whole game!..> in the last 20 we will get chances!!
In fergie we trust!
Bring on the hairdryer!
@trevor
true. it reminds me of the fulham game when ronaldo scored the late winner and ran over to heinze and the lads to celebrate. bring out the hairdryer fergie, and a possible kick up the backside for a few of the lads.
scholes is my all time favorite, but he gifted murphy that goal.
sort it out lads! who gets subbed?
Midfield looks fucking woeful. Scholes and Rooney especially over tentative.
Fergie needs to kick a boot in someone’s head.
Scholes having a shocker……Would love to see some sort oa change…..We have not got going at all…..
Worst display I have ever seen…. WTF is goin fuckin whore of a dispaly
Berbs and Giggs need to get involved for sure.
Oh, and Ando keeps fuckimg up with the easy thinks as wel….once he had a great opportunity to free Owen…poor pass and gave away the ball…
omg! We need a dribbler in our setup. Next 10 minutes to equalise, else…
Scholes has passed it… He has to retire now…
Park for Gibson. Fletch in midfield, Park in defence.
We need Scholesy on the pitch. Bring on Berba. What a nightmare.
@manchuchu , Giggs not even in the bench mate…
We lose this, we will not win the league barring a miracle. I hope the team realize that.
Wat the f… with Nani……Not sub even…And behing Tosic as wel, in the peckin order….Surely he’s fone
How about you fuck off Kunal; kneejerk twat.
seriously cant see us getting anything. we have to improve miraculously to get even a point. forget three points.credit to fulham though.
Here are the changes i would make right now. Move Evra among the back 3, bring Fletch in the midfield area and substitute Scholes for Berba. I won’t go overboard and say that Scholes is past it. He is just not helping out today.
no creativity what so ever – fulham keeper had fuk all to do
get park on and move fletch into the middle and get berba and obertan on pleeeease
@Go United Go:
Nani is injured.
It is going to take a miracle this second half…but thats what we’re about eh? Really worried that up front we look ordinary. Right now Rooney is just average, Owen is missing, Valencia can’t get a cross in…Gibson is fast looking like one trick pony (and that trick doesn’t seem to work all that often either). Fergie has to shake this up next half, Berba has to on, dunno what other changes he’ll make..But changes there have to be!
Fabio for Scholes, move fletcher in midfield.
Bebatov for Owen
And De Laet needs to stay back and dont fuck up trying to get forward.
Gibson needs to pass the bloody ball and not try to shoot all the time.
Patethic performance.. the only ones trying are Valencia and Evra, but are not getting enough of the ball
Oh yeah Scholes has to come off – not his day – he’s playing poorly, and on top of that he’s on a yellow…he’s not worth it to keep on for the second half.
We need to get a least a point out of this match .
too easy for fulham so far. we can’t afford to lose this game. it’s up to fergie to motivate & change it around. everything is too congested in é middle. come on utd! we got 45 min to turn things around!
@kunal: go fuck urself will u. fuck off!
Mahesh, it was the same last March and remember how we performed in the second half with 10 men? We need a similar wake up call. Poor Ritchie. He has done so well today.
Costas – what do you think, three points dropped here is like dropping the league title?
I agree – i feel sorry for ritchie, kus, and the makeshift back four…the experienced ones aren’t helping at all!
Come on wazza time to step up and produce a bit of magic.
Mahesh – 6 points ? Not sure.
I’d even say 3-5-2 but we don’t really have a commanding holding midfielder do we?
At this point I’d even setting for Everton’s Fellaini
Rooney is really bothering/frustrating me – for a while now…if I were a defender I wouldn’t be shitting my pants with Rooney in front of me.
@Mahesh: I honestly don’t know. We have overcome bigger deficits in the past and like many people, i believe that Chelsea over the next 2 months will enter a sticky patch. I really hope that it won’t be costly. However, 5 league defeats before Christmas is not good. Lets just hope that West Ham get something tomorrow.
lets be fair. Fulham are a good side and craven cottage is a difficult place to go. without a stable back 4 we were always going to struggle so even if we lose its not going to be a shock or upset.and the title race will still be open. saying that cant see chelsea dropping any points tomorrow
No changes – crap!
Come on United!
@kunal
calm down mate, many of the lads have made howlers this season and it happens in football. scholesy has had enough good performances and a few crackin’ goals to warrant his place in the squad so far.
people were calling for rio’s head when he gifted that bellamy goal in the city match, but i’m sure most of us would want him in there today instead of carrick. if you look at the replay carrick actually steps aside and lets murphy take that shot on goal. i don’t think rio or vidic would have let that happen.
get behind the lads! it’s fergie’s job to sort the players out, not ours.
hope we see obertan soon.
shit ….
jesus.
fucking hell
Oh my fucking god, this match is hopeless!!
when we faced really strong opposition we saw what we saw…
not a fucking useless Wolfsburg..
That’s a really bad blow.
which of the 2 teams out there are the champions??????
FFS!!!
game over!!
@rooninho how can I be calm…? Look at ur self… 3 points down the drain hope we can save the goal diff… WTF fergie u r not playin friendly…
time to see what this team is made of. our emergency defending was going to negatively influence a match at some point, we had to expect something like this.
united need just 1 goal to open the door and get back in this thing.
fucking believe!!!
not game over, bu the lads need to wake up NOW
Thy have no bloody clue wht thy r doin … Fuckin hell
Inevitable.
A draw or a loss. Same thing, 1 point don’t mean anything.
Players don’t care.
How we r playin3 5 2 is beyond me
It’s not poor defending or anything. We just have no fucking clue going forward.
Wtf Owen u whore
da laet was the best man utd player on the pitch, and SAF changing him ..FUCK!!
I have been out and just got back. What is going on!
I know you cant win every game and todays conditions are not great!… Brass monkey weather and all!
From what i seen in the first half our attacking play was very poor.. The last ball letting us down and our defence was playing way too deep!
Still 30 minutes to play i wouldnt be supprised if it went either way!.. Come on boys!… Put in a performance at least!
442 come on lads
Please! Please find the back of the net!
with the performance fulham have put in they only can get tired thelast 20 minutes
,,,
If we loose then so be it, at least i want to see shots on goal.
I want to see saves.. I want to see us knocking on the door..
If we do this and loose at least its bareable.. With the quality we have out there if we dont it would be criminal!
Hmmmn. I hope we can hang on till january. We really need a skillful playmaker who can unlock stubborn teams like this. We’ve been awfully poor.
Where the fuck is Gabriel Obertan???
now it’s over
Game over! I can’t bear to watch anymore…
3! Nightmare.
Fergie I thnkhas dropped his balls onthe way to cc
Holy hell, shocking display. It’s almost like the players don’t care. I mean really, this is poor. We lucked out against Wolfsburg, they missed those two sitters early on, else I think we would have been in the shit then too. Fuck, let’s get a serious goal threat before we play Milan.
AND AS I FUCKING TYPE THIS DUFF SCORES. We’re hopeless lads, fucking rubbish against Villa, even worse today. Can’t blame Kus or our defense really, our attacking play was fucking awful.
we miss fletch on midfield badly!
You cant win the league with Gibson,Owen etc. but considering our financial position I expect to see Scholes,Giggs and Neville for few more years.
Humiliating!!!
Great, every fucking chance we just balst it to left, right, over the bar and anywhere but on target!
Poor poor performance by most. I havent watched the whole match but by christ i cant think of anyone that has stood out and looked well for Us.
Rooney has been poor, Owen poor, Scholes Poor, Subs have been poor.
Defence have looked ok but i havent seen any of the goals!
I remember last season or the season before ronaldo bailing us out!
We need that someone special!
I dont care if it is not till the sumer and we come second, you dont get value for money in January!
Fulham have played well but we played into their hands by playing 3-5-2, most of the players looked like they had no clue whether to attack or defend and ended up doing neither most of the time. Shocking performance from the lads today and the susbsitutions for Fergie never really made too much sense either…..
5 defeats and it’s December this is the worst team I can remember
during our championship winning seasons its games like this we usualy grind out.
You have too!
just looking at the stats
Possession
Fulham 51% Man Utd 49% Attempts on target
Fulham 6 Man Utd 4
Attempts off target
Fulham 3 Man Utd 11
Corners
Fulham 5 Man Utd 1
Fouls
Fulham 9 Man Utd 7
Dont look great!!
@Wayne hamilton
LOL… No time to slit your wrists were 2nd in the league, 3 previous seasons we have been champions!!!
I can remember the time where we hadnt won the league for 26 years!
Im afraid we ave to take this one on the chin lads.
Will Brazil please take off the Fulham kits now? Please…
Oh, and will the School for the Dumb Deaf and Blind Girls please take off the United kits
I knew we were going to lose this game. I can’t really remember the last time I thought going to Fulham and getting a draw would have been a good result.
Guys, the players in the white shirts are Fulham players! Stop passing to them! Pass to your teammates in red!
We lost 5 before christmas 02/03 season, keep believing lads.
When you decide to do fuck all with 96 million and try to put a seriously tentative team through the stress test with a bunch of unripened players and are too headstrong to buy a legitimate proper holding midfielder who doesn’t spend half his life injured or trying to stay alive after 35 then you get performances like these.
Where the fuck is our command presence? I don’t mind if we lose. But at least we make a fight of it.
We just bent over today and took it up the keister.
Absolutely fucking disgraceful.
The only people who DIDN’T suck goat nuts were Evra and Kush (I can’t fault him if his defence is made up of headless chickens).
And by God, I love you Scholesy… but maybe you really shouldn’t sign that extension.
WE will bounce back thats for sure.
For me, The fact the defence is so short of first teamers doest help at all.
In this match i have noticed too many of our midfielders covering back, Staying too deep.
That doesnt excuse our attacking play as all our attacking play has been shite!
Where was wayne rooney in this match?
352 was simply a mistake and he still didnt realise it during halftime, hodgson must’ve been dreaming when man u came out with the same formation and look how they punished us.
fletcher is really needed in midfield too
and fergie you owe me a new remote control
Well………………………………………………….. its time to get drunk
We. Look. Fucking. Awful. I don’t really have anything else to say, I’ll just leave it to Scott. Sad lads, really fucking sad. This is the kind of game where Ronnie, pouty little puff he may be, would have struck a thirty yard belter and got us some points. We need a player like that desperately.
I’m gonna drown my sorrows I think. At least we have some good cup games coming up. Keep the faith lads, Fergie will sort it out like he always does.
@Costas :
Thanks mate, didn’t know he was injured…..
Lost…That’s ok…..It was bound to happen with our make shift defense…
But worries me is our inability to create chances, let alone score…Can’t remember one proper chance…gutted….But we’ll bounce back…as we have always done….Go united….
Lads at the end of sopcast it showed the statistics!
Not one of our strikers had a shot on goal.
Think it said Carrick, Valencia and 2 others!
I want to cry.
Whoever kidnapped my team and replaced them with Derek Zoolanders
I WANT MY TEAM BACK YOU ASSHOLES!
THIS IS HOW IT FEELS TO BE CITEEEH THIS IS HOW IT FEELS TO BE SMAAAAAAAAAAAAAAALLLLL THIS IS HOW IT FEELS WHEN UR TEAM WINS NOTHIN AT ALLL NOTHIN AT ALL
The fans were really awesome. That’s the only positive thing I was proud of today. United fans are really the best away fans.
What I hate is ppl stil talking about Ronaldo, and how he would have pulled it off for us….Well, let’s get over it…he’s gone.. We r UNITED…we never die…..Let’s talk about the future and how we can improve…..And let’s back the team…cos they need it….
Rooney only plays at Old Trafford.
Keeper not at fault. Bring on the overreaction.
If the players don’t go on a ridiculous run, Fergie will get rid. Even our fans didn’t perform well. Just hope for a Hull win and a West Ham win.
I really missed Keano in that center of midfield today.
What a shocker!
Owen,Rooney,Scholes,Carrick,Fletch and even Patrice, very very poor!
Well, let me be a little fairer, they were ALL poor.
Dear oh dear, appalling!
@manchuchu:
lol mate….seems today our players were replaced with zombies..:)
We can’t score goals against half decent opposition! We can’t defend properly, with or without our makeshift defence! If we’re gonna be honest with the odd exception we’ve been poor this season, really poor. 6 points adrift by the end of the weekend i presume and not sure we’ve got it in this squad to pull it back!
I feel ashamed of what i said today. but it has been a frustrating and now really miserable day. My May trip to the UK gets cancelled due to work.i was going to watch our final league home game.I was hoping atleast we win today but that too hasnt happened. Miserable day. evern orse than the 2007 night in Milan
I 2nd that drew.
Looks like sparky’s getting the sack…
Manchini in town……What do u think guys?
please put fletcher in midfield, he isn’t a great defender and his loss in midfield is being felt. another headless chicken game by anderson. and what on earth has happened to rooney?
we would have lost that match with ronaldo for anyone mentioning him, we really need vidic and ferd/evans back.
the lads look knackered, fletch and carrick are trying but don’t belong in the back and are wasted there. carrick basically stepped out of murphy’s way for the first goal!
no rio, vidic, evans, o’shea, brown, etc. it was going to hurt us badly at some point, too bad it all happened today.
rooney needs to start being the man of the match every time. it’s what is expected of him now and he can’t have days like this.
the worst part of united losing (even worse than dropping points) is all the whinging and moaning by the supporters. not to say that the lads don’t deserve it after a performance like this- but it will soon get to the point of ridiculousness i’m sure.
so let’s have all the – united are crap, the old lads are past it, rooney is crap, fergie has lost the plot, we need to buy players, where’s the money to buy players, it’s crisis time, we can’t win the title- talk out of the way.
see you all in a few days, when the suicidal depression wears off around here!
gutted, but i won’t lose hope.
@aig alex is god:
That’s very bad, mate…makes this day even worse ha?
We lost 5 before Christmas in 02-03, but didn’t lose another one for the rest of the season. Sadly we can’t say the same for this team. The defeat is NOT the end of the world. But the situations surrounding it could be.
I know that many people will vent about certain players. I will take a different route. I blame the coaching stuff. We have 10 first choice defenders and have ended up playing with 2! Now there are 2 scenarios. 1)The work in pre season wasn’t particulay tough. 2)We keep relying on defenders who are injury prone. Something must be done quickly. The twins are still developing, but can anyone say for sure that players like Brown,Neville and Rio can be depended on again? I hope Vidic isn’t also entering that cycle. As far as the 2 Irishmen are concerned, Evans should have operated his ankle long ago. O’Shea just got injured on international duty. Nothing to compalin about here.
Don’t get me wrong. There are players who haven’t done themselves proud. Rooney in particular. However, our success in recent years has been built in our defensive unit which this season is non existant.
@ Manchuchu….”Where the fuck is our command presence? I don’t mind if we lose. But at least we make a fight of it”
This has been my biggest problem this season, I dont care if we lose as long as we play the Manchester United way, the never say die attitude! The beautiful football which made me fall in love with the team and football in general. I actually used to hate football with a passion until I saw an amazing team play one day on the television, the way this team played made me fall in love with them. The way we played today lacked fight, passion, Charisma, class, ffs we are not Liverpool!!!
“We just bent over today and took it up the keister”
Fergie loves trying to play square pegs in round holes and it was apparent today in 3-5-2, we have played attacking 4-4-2 for years Fergie, why oh why would you change it, ok I understand we are short in defence but everyone could clearly see it was’nt working working in the first half yet we persist and are carved open within twenty seconds of the restart???
“Absolutely fucking disgraceful”
pretty much sums it up for me, we never looked like scoring, never looked like getting back into it, we will never die, but I hope Fergie takes not of this and sorts these fucking bullshit performances out!!
Hope we get fit defender fit for next game!!
Go United Go
ya mate. it does. I Live in India and for me it has been a dream to watch United play at Old Trafford. i have been waiting for this chance from 5 years and now its not gonna happen.
@rooninho :
Yes we were awful today….But stil a long way to go..and as Scott said in an earlier post…if not this year..then there’s always next year..atleast the pool loosers aren’t gonna get 19….
What do we do. We plough on. But we start fixing things before we do. It’s terrible that we have nearly no defense whatsoever, our second choice keeper, no hargreaves, out of form strikers and you could say inexperienced wingers. Our form is shocking for a team that has the title in our sights. Attitude, it’s got to be attitude. I don’t think our mentality is quite right and this can only help chelseas cause and thats gonna make it a lot tougher. We as fans can sit here and say, “It’ll be grand ACoN and the ruskis still have to visit OT, they’re bound to drop points.” We don’t win titles like that, we can’t depend on them dropping points. All we can depend on is our boys on the field and to be honest they’re very hit and miss this past while back. I honestly think theres complacency there big time.Fergie saying that he told the lads to take the chances and not depend on ones coming later, thats complacency and fergie admitted it himself right there. Yes we need our defenders back and a wee buy or two in january might help but we need a big attitude adjustment right and quick, cause out of all the factors holding us back i sincerely believe that it’s the attitude and drive doing the biggest amount of damage. COME ON YOU REDS!!!!!!!!!!!!
@AIG: Sorry to hear that friend. Is there a chance you can reschedule it for the future? Or maybe for a friendly in August?
Keep our head high Lads.
We need to swallow this lost, painful, but we played poorly. Better team won today.
Have problem in our team Fergie needs to sort out. My trust are 100% on him.
We very clearly lacks a leader on é field to drag us esp. when chips are down.
What a complete waste of space Michael Owen is, there’s no point in scoring hattricks in CL games when we’ve already qualified if you can’t do it when we need you to in the league.
Not fit to tie Carlos Teves’ boots.
Who else is fed up with Rooney? He doesn’t seem to be cutting out the bad elements of his game. He was pointlessly tracking back to stupid positions again today. The boy needs to be dropped or he won’t learn his lesson.
I never want to see us play 3-5-2 again its a shit formation played by shit teams.
Rooninho – united are not crap, the old lads aren’t past it but only perform every now and then. rooney is not crap, however has been playing poorly for a while now. Fergie hasn’t lost the plot, however, some of hid decisions have been questionable this season. We do need to buy players as bringing Wellbeck on to change a game doesn’t show a strong squad, where is the money to buy players?, it’s not crisis time, but we do need to start creating chances. We can’t win the title if we continue like this.
We’re all family on here, but I don’t get why some of you lot are so offended by some complaints. We’ve been shit the past few games, only beat Wolves reserves 3-0? Are we not allowed to have a moan and vent some frustrations?
I have no doubt we will get our shit together. Maybe not to win the title this year, but fuck, we’re not entitled to win the league every year. FOUR in a row is something that’s never been done, and I think that’s important to remember. Fergie is the master, and he’ll sort our kids out, we’ll be fine. Just because the Ginger Prince had a stinker today doesn’t mean he’s past it, him or any of the old guard. I wish we could have thrown Ole on the pitch today more than anything, if I’m gonna be honest lol.
All that being said, it’s still upsetting to see us play so poorly, surely no one can deny that. I will never stop supporting United, no matter how shit we play, but there’s nothing wrong with pointing out when we play poorly.
@Matt:
What did Wayne do today, or even Berbatov, for that matter all our attacking force? Can’t blame it on him, mate….Chin up….
I would hate to be in that locker room. I would fear Fergie and feel shame.
Costas
Hi mate. its not possible for it to be rescheduled. i am have my management exams next november. my classes start from jan 2010 and tests will start from june end. i had taken a week off in may but due to execss workload in that period i had to cancel it.
Everyone can blame and moan that we missed a lot of defenders and that’s why we didn’t defend well enough but what about our attack?I’ve never ever seen such a disjointed front line.We didn’t even create a single chance today ! Man Utd being the biggest club in the world…..and not creating a single chance in an entire game…it’s shocking !
@mikekelly12 :
Rooninho is trying to be sarcastice, buddy…
Our defence should never really be an excuse here. No passion and attitude was shown in fighting for every ball that came and the midfield was horrendously anonymous as always. They were actually relying on evra n valencia to spark something instead of controlling the midfield area. Scholes just cant bring it that consistently anymore IMHO… Terrible loss and outplayed throughout the game. Our players had their soul warped to MARS today.
who thinks we deserve to win the title with our performance today??
come on…. anyone???
i really dont understand the tactics.. seriously? 3-5-2
it didnt even fucking work against wolfsburg!! they shud have buried us within 15minutes but as soon as we change to 4-4-2
BANG.. two goals we win 3-1.. tactics were really shit today.. plus the subs?? seriously?? WHY DIDNT OBERTAN COME ON!!! we needed a winger!!
Defensive problems aside the fact that no-one seems to see is that we are not scoring any goals. The fifth defeat with no return. Going forward they have no idea how to break teams down so the opposition make two banks of four and United play down the middle which is very easy to defend against. Today they never created any thing. Its all too predictable these days.Rubbish absolute rubbish.
@AIG: Sorry to hear that. I hope that in the future you can find a date. You never know what can happen.
@Asish: No doubt about it. And no one is foirgetting that. But Zamora’s goal was a soft one and if that had been avoided, Fulham wouldn’t have been so relaxed in the second half. But no one even challenged Zamora in out own box!
ALSO… wot we really need IS A DEFENSIVE MIDFIELDER!!!
lets be honest.. scholes cannot handle these big games.. fulham away?
we all know its going to be a battle.. that SCHOLES will not win now.. he can be played against wolves birmingham etc at O.T… but not in the harder games.. but i believe fergie is to be blamed as much as the players..
the tactics and subs were awful!
Go United Go….I realise that pal, however, I just wanted to point out that although people will be asking these questions, they do have a point.
@Costas,
I believe we conceded the 2nd goal at the worst possible time.That shouldn’t have been allowed to happen.
If any of my friends give me grief over this game, I’m really going to punch them in the face.
@obertanthenewstar: Fletcher is that player, but Fergie never once played him in his natural position today.
Maybe these results will inspire Ferguson to buy in January. Who? What position? I am not sure where we’d even start. But we need to bring in someone to give us a spark.
conceeding 3 to fulham… and you guys start talking about offensive frailties..
okay
We lost – come on it’s tough not having your second choice defence let alone first; what are we on our third or fourth best pairing?
It’s difficult but we have to believe that the squad will get together again esp the defence – apparently today Fulham kept on pumping the ball into the box – you can’t defend mistakes – Scholes had an off day but to be fair Carrick and Ritch could only do so much – that’s why we won the league for 3 years because of brilliant defending too. Hang on for a while as long as we aren’t more than 3-6 points behind – we have to be patient and hope also that we have had our injury crisis – because we would be able to soak the pressure up now – we would not if this was end of Feb-March because A. the games would be less – B. we wouldn’t have enough time. We have matches and time – which means it’s time to buckle up… For me Berbatov and Obertan should have started… they were both immense on Tuesday and Fulham have been from Switzerland and back and scored 3… you’re having a laugh right? Oh wait…
@Ashish: Exactly. Among the many things that went wrong. Also, i never understood why De Laet was substituted.
@John Ferry: Same here mate. Good thing my brother, who is a Chelsea fan, has army duty today…
Ain’t seen the game as been Xmas shopping. Fucking gutted. Thought we may have learned from last season. We NEED our fucking back five back. Tell me how the rentboys would do with Fat Frank and Ballack in defence. It is not just our defence that is suffering but we are now not only Hargo short but Fletch and Carrick in midfield. Hope this is our seasonal blip. Come on United. Fergie will be livid. Lets hope the rentboys slip up. Found it hilarious the dippers losing but now I feel fuck all. And to those saying “Ronaldo would have scored a thirty yarder to get us the points”. Does a thirty yarder count as 4 goals or summat? Fuck off. He may have done that or he could have been waving and flapping his arms about and not getting a sniff of Koncheski.
Expect some serious questions and soul searching from Fergie.
The defensive crisis might be an excuse bt if we played with more passion n determination this wont have happened.
We arent pressuring zamora & co enough and did nt play like our life depended on it. The midfield (as in many games this season) relied on evra and valencia to find something and never really controlled the game at all. Totally anonymous and ineffective and predicatable… Time to buy perharps?? Scholes cant bring it week in and out and we lacked a leader in giggs today. No 1 was in command and served as an impetus to bring man utd back since they were down by 2…bad day..crap..
@JD
Unlike us, Fulham grabbed whatever chances they have by the neck and made full use of it. We instead blast ours wide time and time again.
@Costas:Since the 1-0 loss to Chelsea,I think many of us had agreed that it’s absolutely imperative for us to go on a winning run but recently the losses to Villa and now Fulham have affected us big time.Fergie had better iron certain things out which he’ll most probably be aware of.Others aren’t playing well but the sad part is we aren’t capitalising.
Played bad,real bad.Although the defence was shocking,i can’t bring myself to blame them actually,cos its a serious make-shift defence.I need to wail.Scott, gimme some statistics for consolation.
I’d think of Rooney as our spark,but he hardly was today.Poor touches.I thought our only decent player today was Valencia.Usually,after defeats,i’d be ranting at the ref,or the cheats in the opposition team,but in these recent losses against Villa and Fulham,we got absolutely no one else to blame but ourselves.I feel like wailing when i think that we’d gone 90mins without a goal at all.
I’ll just sleep my week away.
@20legend99
fuckin right we can complain the money we spend each year supporting our club. Someone said there also we should drop rooney. I agree but replace him with who owen, welbeck, macheda? We need to say fuck that balls to this value for money crap. There’s none out there. Get that 80 mill out and go and get a proven goalscorer no matter what the cost. Id take ruud the dude back in a shot. I hear he might be available. A creative midfielder cause we’re not imposing ourselves there at the moment david silva but hes broke at the minute so we’ll certainly not get value for money for him cause the WC is gonna increase his value. Another defender? Certainly Philip Lahm would be perfect at RB. He’d lock that position down leaving o’shea, brown and evans as more than decent cover for times like these. As talented as our squad is it’s not as strong as it could be.
BUY BUY BUY as they say on wall street. if we got 2 of those three players we could field nearly two world class teams.
VDS
lahm rio vidic evra
valencia hargreaves(or fletch) silva obertan(pending improvement)
rooney berba
that would be ideal. That team would be hard working, creative, quick, tough and backup we’d have in abundance. I think i should take over transfers at OT to be honest folks. Show me the money!!!! What you reckon?
(probably went off in a wee tangent there but fuck it)
Comments that say “o.k. never mind about our injury plaqued defence what about are attack” miss the point that a succesful team is a single unit. Ignore the fact that we have two of our best midfield players “unavailable” ’cause they’re playing in defence what confidence do can you expect those ahead of them to play with knowing that we have such a gaping weakness behind them.
Simple enough. This has nothing to do with the form of individual players or SAF’s formations or player attitudes. It’s all about getting Top Premier League quality defenders back, giving 3/4 games to get settled and then hopefully putting a run together.
Hate to admit it but our best chance for trophies this year will the domestic cups and if we can go on a run and get a bit of “swagger” back maybe we could pull off a surprise in the CL.(’cause that’s what it would be.)
Think Fergie will change his plan and buy some players in jan. we need a defender.dont know whether rio will play consistently this season. not sure about a midfielder but we need someone who can conjure that bit of magic. thought Rooney will be that player but when we need some magic Rooneys passing and crossing gets even worse.Giggsys absence was felt too today. wish we have him back for Hull.scholes cant be blamed. he can dictate the tempo only when he has player like fletch besides him. think park should have played on the left and ando in midfield with rooney alone up front.owen was anonymous throughout.berbatov starting could have made difference. owen can finish off the chances but we need someone to create chacnes and there was no one today. Berba could have helped us a bit more in the creativity department
@Ashish:
Yeah, i know. It’s been frustrating. These things aren’t new though. We have lost twice in December before. We have lost 5 before Christmas before. I think that Fergie has to take a long look at his defenders and who he can depend on. Is it surprising that Brown, Neville and Rafael are out injured? No, because it happened all the time last season too. Same goes for Rio. I like a lot of these lads, but i miss the days when we would go 10-15 games with the same back 5. And that, above anything else, is what gives you consistency in the league.
i love owen.but i think he should almost never start,except for maybe the domestic cup games?Come on Berba’s the man.He needs to be upfront with Rooney from the start.
Owen was inexistent today
It ain;’t fucking football manager. Put Lahm here and Silva there. Silva the lightweight little cunt would do fuck all at United. Every bastard time after a defeat you see the same people on here who you NEVER see any other time demanding we BUY players. We have NINE fucking defenders out and 3 midfielders either in the back four or injured. As soon as key players come back it will be very different.
aig – That wasn’t intended at you mate.
And as for those who say BUY, BUY, BUY, I say WHO, WHO, WHO, and WHEN, WHEN, WHEN!!!
The quality we need to get the swagger back that we had withwith Ronaldo is not likely to be available in January (or can’t play in the CL) and we only want players that want to play for United at the peak of their career.
Sadly, I’m not sure how many of those there are around right now.
@JD
the only goal that i would take in to account is zamora’s…
the first one…was a silly mistake by scholes…loosing the possession so easily to that cunt
the third one …came from a free kick…which shouldnt have been given by the referee…anderson got the ball there….
the only goal left was zamora’s…we didnt close him down quick enough…that may be accounted to the lack of proper defence…which we all know how bad state we are in due to injuries…so there is no point in go on ranting abt it..
the disgusting thing is we didnt create a single proper chance…thats the reason why everyone is discussing about offensive play…
Ive high hopes for the CL DAVE MACK. Every team has their vulnerabilities. Doesn’t belong to BARCA or MADRID. Chelsea can take care of inter and we know we can take care of chelsea. But we need to solidify things big time so agreed on the defenders getting back but your domestic cup nonsense, nah! We rule the roost. We the big dogs whatever we’re in. As long as we’re in it we can fuckin win it!!!!!!!!! YAH COME ON YOU REDS COME YOU REDS, KEEP YOUR BOTTLE DON’T LOSE YOUR HEADS. FOR 90 MINUTES WE’LL LET THEM KNOW WE’RE MAN UTD. HERE WE GO!!!!!!!!!!!!
@ King Eric
Spot on
Everybody stand together
We are Manchester United – let’s take our hats off to Fulham and say congratulations – and we’ll have you next time to boot.
Why do a lot of us panic or shake or tremble?
We have 20 league games to go and if we are six points ahead tomorrow – so be it – it’s not the end of the world – we’ll hunt the leaders down and see where we end up at.
Why the doom, why the gloom? We have been here before – we were seven points off last season before Rafa went a little funny in the head – let JT get to ninety points and win the league – at least we are honest in that we take each match as it comes. I implore each and every one of you – us together to believe and stand firm when things do not go right for us – it suddenly doesn’t make us that bad. We have known for a month of days like today and last Saturday coming up and hitting us because of our injuries- are we surprised? I’m not – I just don’t want it to carry on for too long and hope that we can stay close to top spot. That’s the only thing we have to do. And yes it would help if the midfield and the attack were trying to compensate but hell let’s get real, the last three seasons especially when Ronaldo was on auto pilot, it was THE Manchester United defence that held the opposition at bay – and now because of unfortunate circumstances it’s become difficult for them. Let’s stand by our team and fight for them when they are down – it’s up to us too not to let them down – they after all have given us three wonderful years – and when they are in trouble through no fault of there own we should get them back up again, not kick them instead.
Seriously some fans must find a balance and need to get a grip.
In other news, Sparky confirmed out and Mancini will take over as gaffer! Hope that brings him back to earth while fucking up Citeh even more!
is this some kind of sick fucking joke…where the fuck is the motherfucking hairdryer??? Fergie has lost it along with his mind and his Scot balls…fuck it, man I was so fucking depressed this whole week..at work, at home…the only thing I had to look forward to was this motherfucking football match…and just FUCK IT ALL…what I get is a bunch of smug bastards unable to string together two passes right in 90 fucking minutes….I am sick of losing like this…I dont mind losing the way we lost to Chelsea, but I do mind losing this way…makes us seem like a bunch of lazy, rich, incompetent cunts…I am sick of losing like this when we know what we are capable of, I am sick of mad Fergie’s mind fucking tactics and team selections, and I am sick of all the smug bastards who are on their biggest mother-bumming trips (a la RCWIS, who was slated off by one such motherbumming twat for mentioning Munich and gave him as good as he got) trying to prove their red Man Untd balls on this forum, and who are going to slate me off for writing this. I dont give a fuck about whether we win the PL or the CL…I am a hard fan with a hard life working 60 hrs a week, and all I want is to see my team give a good solid fight every weekend…NOW IS THAT TOO FUCKING MUCH TO ASK?????
Rant over. Time for observations:
PS#1: Fuck Ronaldo, we seem to be dead wthout Giggsy
PS#2: Rooney has always been, and is grossly overrated, and 99% of the fans have bought into the hype created by the fucking celebrity-armpit sucking British media
PS#3: Thank god for the hash and the Scoth…otherwise, I wouldnt have been able to sleep in peace tonight
PS#4: Scot – THANK YOU for allowing a man to speak his heart out here
PS:
People are looking FAR too much into it. Even the abu papers are putting it down to our injury crisis. We have done well really to get the recent results we have. This isn’t me wearing red tinted glasses it is a fact. NO team on earth would cope with these injuries.
@King Eric: I agree with you. Apart from an emergency defender on loan, i don’t see why we should buy anyone else. However, and i don’t mean to sound like a broken record, i think it’s time the coaching stuff took a long hard look at our defenders’ condition. It’s not a case of bad luck. For the last 2 months we have been losing defender after defender and because they have track records with injuries, their returns keep getting pushed back. You know how much i hate the cunt, but at least Terry is there each week for Chelsea. Apart from Evra, we can’t say that for anyone else at the moment.
MG – Spot on as usual fella. Some of these people obviously weren’t about when we got hammered 6-2 or 3 by Southampton and then 5-0 by Newcastle in the space of a week. We still pissed the league.
..>And hell, King Eric and MG, I will stand together wth all my brothers and put up a brave face and cheer my team to victory, or die trying….but to all those who wore a red shirt today….PLEASE SHOW SOME BALLS OF STEEL, so when we cry ATTACK, ATTACK, ATTACK, we got some nice clanging rhythm to go with it.
@jeet
i completely agree with ur PS2# about rooney…..
i can understand how your feeling…as i wait every week as you said to watch a proper united way of football….but leave alone proper…we arent even playing average football by our standards….in the last few games…
Our luck has run out. We had been winning while playing badly for far tool long. The way our season is going, we cannot expect much from it. For quite a while, the atitude of our players has been strange, the style of play awful, but victories kept overshadowing this. I always feared that if we do note improve sooner rather than later our luck will run out. The only consolation is that rent boys are not too far away, albeit with a game in hand now.
@Jeet
Dude you need to get real.
Even if everything went against us at Chelsea – we still never scored so no matter we didn’t deserve to win. You have to outscore the opposition to win – correct? What about the days when we play rubbish and get a result would you like to rewrite the score in favour for the other team?
Please bring balance here – And don’t you dare have a go at the gaffer – without him we would not have had the last three seasons of unbelievable joy – you can only point to the CL loss against Barcelona as the only thing that hurt – and further the unqualified success for the last 20 odd years – are you sure you are a united supporter – you seem to be seriously angry over a match or two. Come on man focus for crying out loud
Also now we have to be aware of what’s going on behind us. Villa are 2 points behind and if Arsenal win their games in hand, they could go above us. Once we get a proper back 5 together,i think we can be ok.
Xyth Said,
December 19th, 2009 @19:02
spot on.
Needless to say this was not a good result. In practical terms I think we have to go on an unbeaten run until the end of the season and hope Chelski slip up. Neither of which is 100% impossible.
I would say that without a Chelski slip up that the CL represents our best chance of major silverware as it restarts in Feb when (hopefully) we’ll have a recognised back four fit. The injuries at the back rebound on the team cos without Fletcher in midfield we can look a bit lightweight.
Couple of new signings in Jan wouldn’t go amiss either.
we need to buy a player in January, if for anything only to help create a different look to our team. We are too predictable now and we dont have players that the opposition fears anymore. They attack us without worrying about the counterattack. anderson, nani, carrick, valencia are not very threatening. bring in attitude Fergie, a name, someone who commands the midfield and can play along Fletcher.
Thank god for Evra though…
JD attack is a form of defence, its simple if we keep the ball the opposition can not score.
@ Jeet
Sometimes it doesn’t happen which is my point – it’s okay to loose it is after all the flip side to the joy of winning. Some points
We lost to Burnley and battered them and didn’t score a penalty. We desrbed nothing.
We lost to Liverpool because they outmuscled us and desired the win more – yes ref was no good that day but neither were we.
We lost to Chelsea and played brilliantly. Yes the ref and his assistants were rubbish but when we had our chances we didn’t take them. We still didn’t score.
We lost to Villa at home – over a cross Rio or Vidic would have got to 11 times out of 10. Or John would have not let the cross come in – doesn’t matter we didn’t score we didn’t deserve to win.
Today at Fulham. They were away at Switzerland and came back and scored three against us – I agree the team should have had more mettle and fight but there you go – they didn’t we lost because again we were outscored so in another way we didn’t deserve to in because we didn’t do anything.
Sometimes it’s not fair – sometimes it’s bad luck – sometimes it’s no luck – sometimes it’s not being ready – sometimes it’s just a little of everything and that’s what the 5 losses have been – the last three have been hard because of various reasons – the last two because seriously not even Madrid or Barcelona could afford to get anything if they were playing with Midfielders in defence. We just hope that our bad luck/run has come and will go sooner rather than later and that we are not too far behind Chelsea – then it’s okay – you already know what Manchester United can d – have some hope man
Horrible 90mins to endure, great United support from the stands – pity the same passion and enthusiasm wasn’t shown on the pitch.
Scholesy had one today, not alone in criticism of course, every player wouldn’t be happy with thier performance after that shocker.
Roll on Hull so, hopefully, this game can be banished to the back of my mind!
@MG: I kid you not, I am not as mad as I sound, and I agree that I am not in the best of moods right now, and I agree with pretty much all that you say…but what seriously encourages me to ask you to FUCK OFF is:
1. the fact that your verbiage of “dont dare to…” stinks of sanctimonious smugness. Fergie is my acknowledged God of football, but God also tests his children’s faith…sorely at times:)
2. your questioning whether I am a Utd, supporter. Would it make you feel better if I was a Chelsea fan and asking you to politely fuck off, instead of a Red?
Good night all – I do promise to be on better behaviour tomorrow morning.
No doubt there’ll be a DVD again.
What’s the point in football? Really, what joy comes from it.
Bah fucking Humbug. At least the darts is back.
Costas point about getting five settled defenders is the only issue here. I’d say you need to have a run of 20 PL games using a max of 6 defenders and a consistent experinced goal keeper.
When that happens all the talent, creativity confidence and goals begins to flow from those ahead of them. Simple every great side is built from a solid realiable defence and the reverse (as we’re experincing right now) is also true.
Everything else being suggested is just panic and bollocks.
All eyes on Chelsea tomorrow..
@costas
You are dead on with the teams below us. Arsenal, Villa, Spurs are not that far behind. We cant only worry about chelsea!
Even Bellion just scored for Bordeaux:) what is the world coming to.
Anyway Kala Xristougena!
Hey it could be a damn sight worse! We’re still second even with about 8,674 injuries!
Don’t worry about Villa and Spurs . They WILL hit a wall, no mistake of that.
@ Jeet
Come back kid, you’ve every right to be angry but you have to put it into a place, a context and let it make sense – I’m not your guru or for that matter your master but if I were I would tell you that getting that worked up doesn’t make sense. Right now I’ve read that the players are down and that SA is saying we need our defenders back.
You would agree with that yes?
If I’ve offended you then I apologise about your commitment to our team – just come on let common sense tell you 20 games and maybe six points – no problem – you have to be there in that place to know that this team can do it. And if it can’t then I hope it tried. We have time and matches on our hand. That’s why I know that everything will balance itself out accordingly. Don’t wait till tomorrow to calm down.
Staggered that people say “I hope Fergie notices this” and “Fergie needs to do summat”. He is the greatest manager of all time, I think he knows what he is doing.
@united.george: Ha! Thanks. Merry Christmas to you too! Bellion is doing quite well over there. I think Laurent Blanc is a miracle worker!
@Dave Mack:
I have been saying this since the summer. It doesn’t matter too much whether Ronaldo and Tevez have left and whether Valencia and Owen are suitable replacements.
It’s very simple, once you enter a transitional period in your attacking approach, you have to make sure that you have a solid core of 5-6 defenders that will give you consistency at the back. If you don’t concede goals, you can always nick games. The same happened during the 03-04 season. We lost Beckham and our attack was in a transitional mode, but we were top of the league and winning a lot of games. Until Rio got suspended. Then it all went down hill.
Lads have read a few posts and am not supprised by the reaction.
To be honest, we currently are facing a massive injury problem.
Players are playing out of positon, The midfield are being over defensive. Its not good!
Todays performance was low key and not good, what i am sure of is that we will bounce back.
The people who are saying this is the worst united team Our players are shite need a kick up the arse!
What we need is everyone fit!
Lets face it we are going to have poor performances from time to time, we have had them a little too often for my liking!
In addition it wasnt the best conditions to play in today. Its been hard to motivate myself to go to the shops never mind Play football!
I agree they are paid handsomly and should have upped their game. For me Fulham wanted it more. WE struggled with the formation and injuries and most of our players had a poor match!
It happens!
I think this topic has the potential to get 400-500 comments. I doubt we will get a new one until Monday!
Has anyone heard Fergie’s comments? I can’t find them.
ahem… hey people, ok al confess I didn’t watch the game, but.. when was the last time our golden boy Wayne Rooney had a good game?
Man such a wrong time to lose all these players, I’m expecting us to drop more crucial points in this holiday period
I seen some of the match today.
Owen – Didnt do much, but got little service. Our attacking play was shite!
Rooney – Was poor, Where as Owen Relies on Service ROoney doesnt, He had possession but did nothing with it, Passing poor and shooting terrible
Gibson – We know the boy can shoot but you have to have more to your game than shooting every oppertunity
Anderson – Strange Performance, Passing hit and miss. Shooting awful! Just not up for the fight!
Scholes – One minute i seen the old scholes at the start of the match> He gets caught in possession then we are 1 nil down and he didnt recover from that! Rest of the match he was poor!
Velencia – Struggled today> Alot he tried didnt come off and often ran into players. Crossing mostly hit the first man
Fletcher – Quiet!
Carrick – Quiet
Delat – Quiet
Evra – Same old evra, if i had to pick our best player it would have been him. but not by much!
Kusack – Did ok, although for me slipped for the first goal.. If he hadnt lost his footing he would have got the shot.. Unfortunite but an overall ok performance.
Tactics – We played too deep, our energy levels were low. Too many Shots from outside the box in hope more than anything. Everyone is nervous maybe somethign to do with playing with such an uncommon back four!
Am i worried – Hell no, its along season! We stilll have quality in our squad! We will be there at the end of the season!
The future is bright lads! this is just a blip!… We cant win every game!
@Tony Starks
I have been biting my tounge on the rooney situation for quite some time.
For me he has showen potential but i honestly feel as he is english we beef him up to something he is not.
He is an energenic forward who has alot of potential. He is capable of great things but he has to mature for me!
He has to improve his temperment, im not worried he might get sent off but the games where his head goes his performance goes also.. Cantona didnt have a great temperment but he produced the goods!
What i keep telling myself is that rooney is very very young, I know i will see a great player when he is 28 but i wish people wouldnt build him up to be our shining light!
sparky has been let go by City….the italians are moving in now…
Bellion scores again for Bordeaux!
Correction: Fergie didn’t speak, Phelan did:
http://www.skysports.com/video/inline/0,26691,12606_5785525,00.html
As far as Rooney is concerned, i will just point out one thing regarding whether he can be our leader or not: He didn’t get the armband. I am not saying that it means a lot, but i think he is kind of like Paul Scholes. He is a great player who is more a servant than a leader.
Hello all and congratulations to Fulham…………..Gutted, but at least my Knee is not jerking up and down like some on here. Rotation is tough enough for managers what Fergie is dealing with is nigh on impossible. Yes, he may have got the tactics wrong today (with that wonderfull thing hindsight) and yes, the team overall were poor with a couple of stinkers thrown in aswell but that happens. Have a bit of faith eh?
I think the Mar Hughes City thing was inevitable, the guy was at the wrong place at the wrong time
Yes the injuries are a big problem, but in most of the last few poor games we’ve had its not that we’ve been torn apart in defense. Its been more about us being shocking going forward. And Rooney has been the worst of the lot – given the talent he possesses. He can’t pass or shoot to save his life. Yeah he works his socks off, but its usually to retrieve balls that he’s given away. He is not, and I will say this again, he is NOT world class. He can be, but he isn’t.
We need new strikers. Rooney is so overrated. Owen is useless. Berbatov ‘ain’t fit to lace tevez’s boots’. Our midfield is the worst in the league, which explains why lots of goals are coming from there, more than the previous season. Where do I start from? Valencia is crap because he’s one footed and scored 7 goals in 89 games for all his time at Wigan, but scored 6 in 23 games for us this season. Scholes should not sign a contract extension, he can’t run or tackle, and keeps picking up yellows. Carrick is utter wank. Maybe that’s why we won the title 3 years on the trot since he joined us. Fletcher is more utterly wank. That could be the reason why we almost always win when he’s in midfield. Anderson is so inconsistent. He’s 21 years old, has been played out of his natural position since he joined this club, shat all over fabregas, stevie me and the whole of the rentboys’ midfield. What a useless twat. Gibson’s luck ran out, he will never score a 30 yard screamer ever again. Kuszczak is a Schmeichel wannabe. All Evra does is speak well of the club. De Laet should stick with the reserves. Fabio just competes with his brother.
The best british manager in the world of football is clueless. He needs to rebuild the team in jan, otherwise the rentboys, essien- and-drogba-less will win the title. We are doomed. We should buy Silva and Villa. We are missing Ronaldo. He would have rescued us today.
We are second in the table, topped the CL group and qualified. We have scored more goals at this stage than last season. We have Brown, Rio, Vidic, Evans, Hargo, Neville, Rafael out. We really are shit. We are boring to watch. The rentboys will win the title with 90 points.
Tony Starkers: You ‘re right there. Kiddo has been named as the new assistant manager. How wierd?
Hughes had to go- but I think the way it was done was truly shocking. To think they Mark Hughes was on the touchline while he knew his successor was watching in the stands was truly shocking professionalism from the board. I’m not surprised – but still it was like they put him out there and said, go out there and hope you don’t embarrass yourself. Shocking.
Fze123: very,very,very WELL SAID !!!!
Mancini was not there he is flying over by private jet tonight.
Fze123 there writing the united-centric script for the sequel to 2012.
DOOOOOOOMM DOOOOOM DOOOOM! numpties.
it’s a shocking defeat, disgraceful even. but look on the plus side, pile are even shitter. and fergie will turn it around like he always does, we’re still right in this race guys and we’re still to play chelski at old trafford. we’ve had the curse of injuries, and as soon as we get through that we’ll be right back up there. have faith! in fergie we trust!
Kiddo’s appointment makes sense. Mancini has never managed in England before and he will need someone to guide him through.
What did the Arabs expect from Hughes? A place in the top 4? When your team’s shirt is historycally lighter than a feather, you need special players. If they wanted a place in the top 4, they should have got him Messi and not a certain other overweight Argey.
Terrible display by the lads..Another off day.. Rooney starting to piss me off..But thats it. A bad day. Forget it and move on. Shit happens…with everybody..Its how you deal with it that matters.. Fergie will sort it out.. No one will be more disappointed than him.. Forget the title for a moment..Concentrate on the 3 points in the next game.. End of story..
Good night and Good Luck..
P.S: Hammered, but still sane…
Kuszczak
Fletcher, Carrick, De Laet,
Valencia, Gibson, Scholes, Anderson, Evra
Rooney, Owen
WTF? Surely it should have been:
Kuszczak
Fabio, Fletcher, Carrick, Evra
Valencia, Scholes, Anderson, Obertan
Rooney, Berbatov
We’d lost this one before we even kicked off.
http://www.mufcweb.com/2009/12/19/fergie-no-light-at-the-end-of-the-tunnel/
Maybe the light could be a loan deal for a defender?
Alex Ferguson really said that? He sounds really really negative about our chances, very much unlike him…
@Fez
Well done and well said and let me also add:
It’s not like we won the premiership three times in a row from apparently a time when we were dead and everyone bowed t Mourinho – (who?)
It’s not like we got to back to back CL finals from a time where we got kicked out of the group stage (winning one and then forgetting to turn up in the other)
It’s not like we never lost before and had bad days (but then came back)
You’re right we’re worthy of fuck all because we haven’t done fuck all – should we get a new manager in because we have lost three more than the neighbours? I mean whatever has our manager done for us, for this club – what has he made us into?
Seriously we should expect more – I mean isn’t true that’s why we have a divine right to score in every game and win every game and win every cup?
Good night all : )
Why complain about Rooney’s goal scoring ability? He has 12 goals – the second most in the league next to Drogba’s and Defoe’s 13.
I don’t understand.. why do people get so sensitive when someone criticises the team? Sometimes its OK to call a spade what it is..
Too many things catching up with us at the same time for my liking. I think if SAF sticks to his guns and doesn’t buy in January then we are certain it is the Glazers asking him to make do with what we’ve got, hopefully just for the moment.
Of course we don’t know what goes on. It could be the Glazers have asked SAF to do his best for this year, with a view to steadying the ship financially and making further signings next season. I wouldn’t think Sir Alex would put up with performances like this without wanting to bringing some players in to freshen things up, and as soon as possible
I am worried though that we are soon approaching a situation where we have too many players who need replacing, or at least cover bought for them, at the same time. Rio, VDS, Gary Neville, Park, Wes and even the two da Silva twins – despite their youthful ages – are all looking like players who will now constantly suffer from injuries.
Then we have questions about Giggsy – how long can he give us 20+ games a season – and Owen and Berbatov still don’t look comfortable in a United shirt. Rooney’s form is suddenly going, as it usually does this time of year and Hargreave’s comeback keeps being put further back, just as it has been for the last year and a half.
We have some youngsters who haven’t made the progress we had all hoped for. Wellbeck is not influencing any game he is involved in, Gibson had a couple of good weeks, just when the knives were coming out for him, but then disappears again, Macheda doesn’t seem to really figure at all this season, Anderson is just up and down from game to game, but mostly down in my opinion.
I think we are going through a period where injuries at the back are obviously too much to cope with, but there is more to it than that. When United are confident, playing good football and pulling together we don’t seem as if we need a defence. We could certainly outscore practically anyone just a few seasons ago, even when we leaked goals the other end. It’s easy to just point at our injuries and blame them, but when have we actually looked stable, consistant, threatening this season?
We don’t look or feel like a team that can be consistantly dangerous, full of confidence and take a game by the scruff of the neck anymore. Todays game at Fulham, last weekend’s against Villa and even the game against Wolves 10 reserves and the first team goalie have seen us teetering on the brink. I hope we can pull it round, but I think SAF is financially hindered, at least for the momen.t
Maybe the Glazers will feel forced to release some of the funds we thought were available. I hope so because replacement and rebuilding can’t start soon enough, and that isn’t meant as a huge criticism of our present squad – they are trying hard and putting in a lot of effort – as much as recognition that the constant and expected process of strengthening and building for the future seems to have taken a serious turn for the worse the last couple of transfer windows. For me, it is becoming an impossible task to address all the areas we are lacking in or need to find top class cover and relacements for.
@Fred
I would have gone with
Kuszczak
Fabio, De Laet , Carrick, Evra
Valencia, Fletcher, Anderson, Obertan
Rooney, Berbatov
Congratulations to BARCELONA. They have won all 6 competitions they have been involved in 2008/2009 season.
I can’t help myself saying it should have been us!
Playing Fletch at right back is such a waste.. SAF proved today why he prefers Berbs with Rooney as his first choice strike partnership and why Owen is just an impact sub (a quality one at that). We need our defenders back and we need them back fast! Not too worry, in SAF we trust and we will come good, lets just hope it’s not too late!
fergie said he hopes this defeat dosent cost us the leahue.(first time i have seen him a bit negative).also he said the club was working overtime to get players fit but ‘there is no light at the end of the tunnel’.i am getting worried. Hull City looked an easy fixture even though it was away.now it is looking a bit tricky.i hope its not the same back 4 next sunday.
Fze123, two can play at that game.
“We have the strongest strikeforce in the world. Rooney and Berbatov are an amazing partnership. They have the best understanding since Cole & Yorke. Owen leads the line so well. He’s a goal machine. Our midfield is the best in the world, that was very evident today. Valencia and Scholes were brilliant today. Carrick and Fletcher are incredible centrebacks. That could be the reason why we almost always win when he’s in midfield. Anderson is so consistent. He dominates Arsenal, Liverpool and Chelsea’s midfields every time we play them. That’s why we never lose to those teams. Gibson is the best midfielder in the league. Kuszczak is better than Schmeichel. De Laet is the best young defender in Europe.
Fergie never makes mistakes. We have easily the strongest squad in England. The Rentboys will fall apart when they lose a couple of players to the ACN, after all, they don’t have any replacements in their weak squad. We look invincible at the minute. We don’t need to buy any reinforcements in January. We aren’t missing Ronaldo. He never rescued us. Not once. He was quite shit when you think about it.
Even though we have Brown, Rio, Vidic, Evans, Hargo, Neville, Rafael out, we are not missing them. We are the greatest team in the world today. FACT. We play the best football ever. Today proved that. We will win the title by 12 points.”
Sadly, mine sounds more ludicrous than yours – and that is worrying.
C’mon people, this is the time when we stand as one and support our team!, why the fuck are we trashing the team so hard?, it is OUR team and they deserve at least OUR respect!, today the match was awful but so what?, we can still win the cup and even if we don’t we should continue supporting them, because we are not gloryhunters like chelsea fans, we are the best fans in the world and we should show that to the world!
LOL Im pissing myself at some of the comments on here today!! We are playing with no fucking defence and all I see is people slating the attack and moaning about getting in this guy and getting in that guy. Fact is the defence get confidence from a good goalie and the midfield from a good defence and the strikers from a good midfield as king Eric said its a team game and no matter who was upfront or in midfield the problem is our defence is fucked at the mo and any team can take advantage of this. I mean for fuck sake we got beat by burnley with a full strength defence. I think if we are going to buy in Jan get a couple of really good young CB’s just in case some crazy shit like this happens again. But for the moment we just have to except we cant do alot about it and it could be alot worse than it has been, we are still in the mix even with the problems we are having and we can all look and fucking laugh our bollocks off at the fucking Rat eaters and take solice from that lads eh surely!!!!
Tony Starks: I don’t think it is so much the criticism or calling a spade a spade it is just that some comments are no more than abuse, for example how does calling Rooney a cunt help? Or saying Scholsie should fuck off!……………Honestly it makes you ashamed to be associated with these people.
Congrats to barcelona. Best side in the planet in 2009 and also congrats to Leo Messi, best player on the planet in 2009 without a shadow of a doubt. scored the winner today as well.One top side you cant hate is barcelona. Brilliant footballing philosophy, silky style. have a great chance of retaining the Champions league.
I agree that Fletch is too important to our midfield to be wasted as an emergency defender.
While i admit that having just one fit regular back 4 is going to affect any side the fact is even with a fully fit back 4 we will have to improve big time.How long can we carry on with this defence? carrick and fletcher are great playes but are going to be poor defenders. they wont have the same awareness and positioning sense and rio,vida and evans.so its not fair to blame them. The best way to reduce the pressure on your defence is to keep the ball. unfortunately scholes and gibson couldnt do that today. the best players to do that are fletch and carrick but they were in defence.
Zamora isnt that bad. grilled our center backs today.has been scoring lately too. maybe we should sign him.would be cheap too
Dont start slating me.Just kidding
@Gee
“no matter who was upfront or in midfield the problem is our defence is fucked at the mo and any team can take advantage of this.”
Okay but…
“I mean for fuck sake we got beat by burnley with a full strength defence.”
Surely this disproves your theory that our makeshift defence is the problem?
Rob the Red.. OK i’ll give you that. It’s just during and straight after the game people have very high emotions and don’t always mean what they say..
But the managers comments suggest that he is not too happy with our current situation, the thing is we won’t be able to rush the players back if we want to keep them fit. O well, at least it makes expectations more realistic
I love to talk rate comment rant and blah bollox but 1 point to be said for a while
very very much in disaray Manchester united and we lost a team with those injuries would of romper this team and villa
/2 sitting in my couch with my dad watching the 1985 fa cup final I became a fan and I can’t remember a worse game from united since
So we no longer are regarded the best team in the world. Barcelona have that trohpy now. I guess the ‘club world cup’ badge that is on the centre of the shirts the players wear in the champions should be removed.
that badge looks crap anyway!
People are seriously over reacting. Chill out!
It hurts when we lose. And it hurts even more just thinkig about not winning a trophy but, Jesus – it ain’t over yet!
Utd players aren’t super human.
Just calm yourselves
@ Fred, that sounded comfortingly optimistic. ‘Kuszczak is better than Schmeichel’. Nice one.
@ Tony Starks, any badge that is stitched on a utd shirt which has the Manchester Utd badge on it looks crap.
@Fred
No what it actually proves is that with the defence the way it is a the moment we are more likely to lose because even with a full strength defence we can lose to shit teams. Pretty obvious really!!
Seriously though, WTF was Owen doing starting ahead of Berbatov today?
I wonder if something has gone on with Berbie behind the scenes. Fergie seems to have finally given up faith in him.
He may not have set the world alight at United but we needed his creativity and composure out there today.
Lads,
On another note Hughes sacking!
Some have said he has spent 200 million!
Robinho wasnt his choice from what i remember.. board signed him! Who knows
But for me
Tevez – Good Signing _ Althoguh a cunt!
BEllemy – Good
Dejong – Great
Barry – Good
Given – Great
Bridge – Good
Lescott – Great
Torure – Great
Agabagohshite – Ok…… He has enough assets to trouble defences!
Santa Cruz…….. I think will come good.Is quality but hsa been injured!
There is very few players that hughes has signed that are poor!
Anyone with half a pea in their head would realise that if you put that many players together who are all used to differnt tactics it is going to take some time to become consistant!
People may argue that he had enough time i dont think he did!
Its not a bad thing for us dont get me wrong. Mancini doesnt know the premiership. Hasnt got bags of experience. For me i dont think he will be an improvement over hughes!
I would have been more worried if Gus Hidink took over or even avram Grant. Seasoned pros who are more than capable ot taking any team and getting the best out of their players!
@ Fred
With you on the Berba front tho mate!!
Red C & Fred …. couldn’t disagree with you more.
@Red C you say buying is the answer. Who, from where and when?
You say that when we’re confident and playing well it seems likewe don’t need a defense. It’s the other way round, mate. When we have a defence (i.e. with Premier class defenders playing consistently together in it) we have the confidence to play well and look like we don’t need it!
The fact that Rooney has performed as well as he’s done this season given the impact that injuries have had on the team, arguers well for the form we can expect to see when we get a settled defence and midfield behind him.
As for Beba considering he himself is just back from injury, I think he looked great in the bit part he played today but it would have been a mistake to play him from the start given he played his first 90 mins for over a month on Tuesday.
@Fred .. I’m afraid your just come over as “the glass is always half empty” sort of bloke. You don’t have to be negative to be balanced!
MG, @20:18. Should we get a new manager? Hell yes, why not. Fergie lost it. I heard Sparky got sacked today. He managed our neighbours and is a former utd player. He also signed a fantastic talent for 40 million, who is scoring for fun. Some argentinian guy. Believe me, he is the signing of the season, even better than our signing of Owen. I say we should consider Hughes as Fergie’s replacement.
@Fred
Its called rotation!!
Berbatov has just came back from injury!
OWen is always going to have some fans on his back, He really needs service we didnt have that today!
What did rooney do today???? Was rooneys performance that much better than owens?
I didnt think so!
For me Owen offers us something differnt to berbatov, He sits on the last defender waiting for a through ball.
our overall performance wasnt good enough today all over the park!.
its easy taking the easy option and jumping on Owen, Or scholes cause he is 30+ or berbatov when he plays cause he is slow and plays the game at a slow place.
We cant win every game, WE dont win every game. All we can ask is a good performance we didnt have that today from anyone!
Fergie knows it wasnt good enough and i am sure the players will as well.
Playing a back 3 makes us way too defensive imho. And when you have defensive problems surely the attacking side of the team should be exploited. Valancia in the first half was wasted as he couldn’t get into advanced positions due to the defence duties
@Gee
I disagree. It would be nice to think that no matter how bad our defence is, we would still outscore the opposition, like in years gone by.
No goals scored against Burnley, Liverpool, Chelsea, Villa and Fulham is worrying. We weren’t totally convincing against Birmingham, Arsenal, Bolton and Sunderland either.
On the owen Berba debate i repeat what i said earlier. Owen can finish off the chances but we did not create any today. berbatov can create chacnes for us.he is more creative than owen.so Berba should have got the nod today.Giggs was sorely missed
hi guys just when i needed a pick me up on todays result…THANK YOU SHITTY, Sparky you Prick…
@ Fred
Did you used to support fucking newcastle, out score the opposition. what like fucking shitty today, come on what I remember is us beating teams soundly with a solid defence, top goalie, a strong midfield and good strikers, I dont remember havin a fucking wank defence with midfielders in it and winning every game 4 fucking 3. I also remember winning fuck all for a long time!! we have won 3 back to back titles and people are fucking whinging coz we are second in the fucking league. GET A FUCKING GRIP!!
WILL NEVER DIE!!
Fuck me. Is this a Barca love in? Fuck those cunts. As soon as we get the lads back it will be very different. Some of the “fans” calling that cunt Green are a disgrace. Saying why did we play with that back 4 and Fabio should have been Centre half. He is 4 feet 6. We just have to take it and struggle through till we get summat like our proper team back. It could be much much worse, we could be Citeh or Dipper fans. Do not understand how all of a sudden our squad is “shit”. Aside from the Judas we lost ONE player. Admittedly a great one but Valencia ain’t doing too bad.
aIG – “You can’t hate Barca”. I ain’t too fucking keen pal.
Trev – Usually agree with much of what you say BUT Bridge, Toure and Lescott were NOT great signings. Their best defender Dunne was sold for a pittance and replaced with the awful Lescott for twenty odd million. That is not a great signing mate. I actually think Hughes has been treated disgracefully.
The league this year really is STRANGE.
@ King Eric
I second that mate!! Barca aint all that, and this year they will get bounced out of europe by the mighty MANCHESTER UNITED just like on our way to moscow!!
Gee – bang on lad.
Oh and all those saying Rooney is over rated get fucked. The lad is a fucking beast of a player who I would not swap for anyone. Just struggling for form at the minute but his goal record ain’t too shabby. It is only 3 weeks ago people were saying we should get Torres. He isn’t doing too well is he? There is a hell of a long way to go and lets face it our form can’t get any worse. The lads will bounce back I would put my mortgage on that.
Who fancies Westham nicking a win tomorow? I am not too confident, we practically walked over them at Upton Park.
King Eric
Barca won the World Cup and have had an unbelievable year lets give them credit.i As for fabio i thought he should have played as right back(he has played there if i am not mistaken) so that fletch could have been pushed in midfield. we could have controlled the game better and that would have eased the pressure on our midfield .Fabio looked good when he came on. The squad is good, no doubt about it but we need someone to step up and score goals out of nothing when we arent playing well or conjure that moment of magic. Thats what we are lacking. Valencia is scoring goals but i his crossing is getting poorer every game and is becoming increasingly predictable and one dimensional. no mention of nani.should he must be given another chance? what do yo think?
But then again, Wigan, who got beaten 9-1, somehow beat the rentboys. It’s just too unpredictable. Hope they drop points tomorow.
Fergie did sound a bit negative in his comments, but i think that’s understandable. He knows two things. 1)That defensive injuries can ruin a campaign. It happened the season we lost Stam and it happened the season we lost Rio. 2)That you have to be within a touching distance of the leaders after New year day. Chelsea will play Fulham, so hopefully that and the West Ham game tomorrow will bring us closer.
However, we must get our house in order first. Right now, the next two games are anything but easy. They are cup finals. But it’s not all black. We are still just 3 points behind the point tally we got for the same 18 fixtures last season. So in a way, we could still get 85-87 points which would guarantee the league. But we have to make a big run of wins.
@King Eric
I do see your point, But i do think they will settle and become good players!
I wouldnt have either bridge, Toure or Lescott at united as there are better out there.
But in upgrading to what they had i think they have. i think had dune had of stayed he would have been better short term as he was settled, but long term after this season either lescott or toure would be at a higher level
This year in football anyone can beat anyone… We are not as crap as people think and Barca are not as invincible as people think.. I honestly believe most of the teams that are left in the Champions League are capable of winning it this year, and at least three teams can win the League – so in a way its great (!) to have unpredictable footie
aig – Oh I do give them credit but no need to go overboard on a United blog. Another thing pal, we ain’t the manager. We don’t know how Fabio has performed in training or what his attitude is like. There are so many factors to consider. It is too easy saying with hindsight “we should have played so and so here” or “so and so should have been left back”. etc I leave and trust all these matters to Fergie. He does get it wrong now and again but overall he ain’t done too bad. For what it is worth I really do hope we meet Barca at some stage with a fully fit back four, Fletch and Hargreaves. Will not be the cakewalk they experienced in Rome.
It was only a question of time before a team exposed Carrick and Fletcher as midfielders hopelessly out of position
aig – Yeah mate I reckon Nani is worth another shot. Fergie said yesterday he is out for 2 weeks. Seriously though and I know you know this the injury crisis at the back is the main reason for our form. How would the rentboys get on with Fat Frank and Essien as centre halfs? Would like to see Tosic given a go but again it is up to Fergie.
Elliott – Yeah you are spot on mate.
Anyway off for a big fat smoke now. See you in a bit lads and lasses.
Tony Starks – Spot on. Rubin Kazen proved they can be beaten. Out of interest which is your favourite Wu Tang album, collective or solo? Mine are the GZA – liquid swords and enter the 36 chambers! Also loved Tical and Raekwon’s only built for cuban lynx.
Belief is good but disillusionment is bad. We have developed a serious lack of consistency over the past season which is not getting better. We have a lot of inconsistent players who perform well in one game and bad in the next. the only players i can honestly put in the consistent performer category are vds, ferdinand, vidic, evra, fletcher, rooney and giggs.
rooney’s performances for a couple of games now has been bad but i think the problem with him is that he is such a good team player and when he sees that others are not performing he tries to help out others in their duties and tries to get involved in everything which sometimes works and sometimes doesn’t.
anderson is good in one game and ordinary in the other. he maybe promising talent but in my opinion (at least for now) he does not have what it takes to become a great player
gibson is like carrick but with lesser ability of passing and creativity. he can only survive at united if he improves his defensive game. i think if he does that he has the potential to become the next keane
Berbatov never was and never will be a goal getter and owen is stop gap for a couple of years until the youngsters step up.
SAF is not going to buy big until summer because he is hoping for some of the youngsters to step up their game and doesn’t want to hamper their progress. although this thinking is fine with me. but it can hurt our chances of winning anything this season. i still think we need one fast and skillful player (either striker or attacking midfielder) who can provide the creative spark we are lacking.
People show open there eyes and not moan at people who are criticising the team because of a ‘bad day’. To put it simply we have been pretty shite all season, yes we are 2nd but too often this season we have scrapped together wins and pretty much played without any fluency or consistency. The game against Chelsea was pretty much the only game that I thought we played well in, even then though we had very little attacking threat.
Now all people are doing is blaming the defence. Yes it’s a huge problem for us at the moment but even when we’ve been at full strength our attacking play has been so poor in general. As I posted the other day, the partnership between Rooney and Berbatov doesn’t work that well and hasn’t exactly progressed. Individually they are both great players but together there styles of play simply don’t fit together well.
Our midfield is the main problem we have. We simply have no consistency within it, literally every game we are playing with a different pairing in the middle. How often do you see Chelsea or Barcelona do this? Once again, as I’ve posted before we still need a top central midfielder.
Our defence at full strength is one of the best, but I simply cannot see us being able to field it on a regular basis. Rio, Vidic, Brown and O’Shea all seem to be highly injury prone, at least at the moment they do anyway. An additional CB and RB (an attacking one to compliment Evra, Rafael could perhaps take on this role in the future be he is still very raw, defensively we had a lot to learn) would be ideal.
You have to love football. Win loose or draw, home or away.
Its all about opinion and debate!
Have to love it!…
20Legend99 @ 17:36 “Can’t blame Kus or our defense really, our attacking play was fucking awful.”
mikekelly12@ 18:01 “We can’t score goals against half decent opposition! We can’t defend properly, with or without our makeshift defence! If we’re gonna be honest with the odd exception we’ve been poor this season, really poor.”
You guys have hit the nail on the head. In most games, UTD usually defend-from-the-front and tilt the field so that TheLads “play downhill” by commanding possession/territory. In this game, the tables were turned and Fulham were compact, disciplined, and dangerous on the break.
But, as mikekelly moans, this isn’t the first time this season that TheLads have been pretty meek in attack – two flukey goals against TheArse at OldTrafford (Giggs’ free kick was deflected by the wall stranding the keeper and Diaby had a brain cramp to make an own-goal); no goals against TheVirus at AnFailed, no goals against the RentBoyz at Stamford Bridge; no goals against Villa at Old Trafford.
In most of those games, UTD competed but today was just plain ‘orrible – the worst performances since David Bentley’s hat-trick for Blackburn, MIddlesbrough scoring four (!); and the away game in Milan in the CL a couple of years ago when the entire back four was crocked, with Silly and Heinze doing absolutely nothing to polish their reputations.
What’s troubling about today’s performance – like those others mentioned in the paragraph above – is the lack of co-ordination in the attack. Today, the ball never really got forward to LittleMikey, WayneRooney played like the worst impression of Nani – or David Bellion – I’ve seen in a while, and Dimmy entertained us his usual flattering-to-deceive. Even allowing for the strikers’ dismal, insipid and uninspired day-at-the-office, it would be unfair to single them out for blame because the midfield did – well – diddly-squat. And, Antonio Valencia spurned a good shooting opportunity – as usual.
We have to hope that somehow West Ham can do everyone a favour and, against form and the odds, trip up the RentBoyz. If not ….. well, that’s just too horrible to contemplate, isn’t it ?
King Eric
point taken.But i made just one comment about barca. Of course if we meet barca it wont be easy for them. Milan and barca are the 2 teams i want us to beat very convincingly for once.Think Fergie has got it surprisingly wrong quite a few times this season which is very very unusual. Of course the injuries havent helped. Hope we see out the remaining 2 games of the year without hiccups and then have everyone fit when the games come thick and fast in the 2nd half of the season.
A very disappointing (but not unexpected) result and SAF comments do not give me much hope for the next few games because of the injury situation.
Maybe we should be looking at the natural defenders we have out on loan or in our reserves – cathcart who is playing regulary at Watford and Gill or Cory Evans (the latter having played for Northern Ireland in a friendly)
Srely it makes more sense to give these guys a shot at 1st team football
King Eric
lampard as a centerback. he would be murdered. as for essien we did see him at right back in the champions league final and Ronny absolute roasted him.They would struggle for sure. any team would.we didnt have major injuries in the last 2 years. At some stage it was gonna happen.thankfully it hasnt happened in feb or march.
It doesn’t make sense at such a crucial point, we need experience and we get that from Fletch and Carrick, simple as.
@King Eric
My fave by far is the first one – 36 Chambers, this got me hooked on them, their style has been copied by so many since. But the Wu-Tang stuff has been going slowly downhill since the first wave of solo’s..
@ lyndhurst red: I couldn’t agree more with you about giving the defenders of the Reserves team a chance. At least they are used to playing those positions and it also gives the Fletcher the chance to play where he is best suited and most influential.
And lets never again try 3-5-2.
Tony – Yeah if I had to pick one it would be that. Can it be all so simple and C.R.E.A.M were . Stopped buying their stuff after that second album thing with about 1000 tunes on. Never really buy hip hop full stop now.
Altonian – That’s half the problem though mate. The defence hasn’t been at full strength for almost the whole season. No Edwin then no rio, no vidic etc. It IS becoming desperate at the back. We have got away with it a couple of games, today we didn’t.
Personally think it’s time for obertan and welbeck to be given a proper run in the team 20 mins here and there is enough think they could go on to be great players for the club just need a proper opportunity to prove it!
Time for Thomas to be dropped and we need to buy a match winner in January!We looked pathetic today.We need to sort this out on the training pitch asap.
Here’s one of football’s mysteries. We have lost Ronaldo and we are going through a transitional period as far as our attacking play is concerned. That is evident against big teams. Yet, with 54 goals in 28 games, we have one of our best attacking records in the past 10 years. How does that happen? We have plenty of games with 2,3 and 4 goals, yet very few with 1. What this goes to show in a way, is that we struggle to score the opening goal, but after that we have no problem scoring. It’s no surprise then that all 6 of our defeats are goaless on our behalf.
kidmeister – A matchwinner. Namely?
@ The Red C….brilliant post as usual.
Especially this part…..”I think we are going through a period where injuries at the back are obviously too much to cope with, but there is more to it than that. When United are confident, playing good football and pulling together we don’t seem as if we need a defence. We could certainly outscore practically anyone just a few seasons ago, even when we leaked goals the other end. It’s easy to just point at our injuries and blame them, but when have we actually looked stable, consistant, threatening this season?
We don’t look or feel like a team that can be consistantly dangerous, full of confidence and take a game by the scruff of the neck anymore. Todays game at Fulham, last weekend’s against Villa and even the game against Wolves 10 reserves and the first team goalie have seen us teetering on the brink. I hope we can pull it round, but I think SAF is financially hindered, at least for the moment”
I agree, ever since I became a united fan and watched United play we may not even score but we sure do create chances and 9/10 more chances than the opposition by a longshot! We never even looked like creating 1 chance in 90 mins of football and I have seen this far too many times this season and I must say it is really starting to worry me.
Yes we have defenders out, but I can guarantee United teams of yesteryear would of controlled the game and ensured the defence had as less to do as possible. Yes the formation did play its part in our players looking like they were in alien territory for 60 odd minutes and surely Fergie has learned his lesson here after the same debacle at aston Villa!
We looked a lot better in both games once we switched the formation back the favoured 4-4-2, yet Fergie wants to play three at the back, at least if we were wearing those horrid away shirts from the southampton defeat we could have claimed the players coul not see each other!!!
Please do not tell me Fergie has to play Carrick at centre back, what happened to Corry Evans and Reece Brown, both very highly rated and would do a damn sight better than a midfielder playing out of position. Please do not come out with some bollocks of there too young, if Moyes can play 16 and 17 year olds making their debuts in europe, then we can play these lads. As lets be honest Carrick looks pretty clueless in defence, he does not know whether to press or fall back, whether to attack the header or not and if I was a rival manager who we were going to play in the near future. I would play a big man upfront and two good wingers and long balls all game long, hell it worked for Villa and Fulham!!
@ Welbz19…… “Personally think it’s time for obertan and welbeck to be given a proper run in the team 20 mins here and there is enough think they could go on to be great players for the club just need a proper opportunity to prove it!”
I agree with you about Obertan, the boy is ready to be unleashed. Welbeck is nowhere near ready, he needs to bulk up, learn when to pass and stop being greedy, only then can he be considered for the first team.
@ King Eric
Match winner: David Villa
Not that I think its going to happen.
In my opinion, our matchwinners are Edwin, Nemanja and Rio. If we can get at least two of them fit for a run of games, we are not going to drop many points. Many say that Ronaldo carried the team in the last few seasons. Well take away the 3 aforomentioned players, and i doubt Ronaldo would have made much difference to the team.
Other teams play with the spine of their team almost every week, yet at United we haven’t done that for months and we have got used to it. Not to mention how much we have missed someone Owen Hargreaves.
Okay I’ve seen the first goal – More than Scholes loosing it it’s been taken away from him because Murphy has anticipated the pass from defence extremely quickly – that assumes to me that Scholes thought he had ample time to turn and play the ball – I can’t blame him for that
Yes although Scholsey did have a give away soon after – luckily nothing happened
Second goal was bad defending all around – Ritchie could have even batted the shot down – man that is inexperience – if Johnny Evans was there that goal would never have happened
Third goal again chest down and bang – no anticipation – players around not defenders
How many of these goals that were scored against us and even last week from Young’s cross – we just don’t concede them – unfortunate but it’s happened so chin up and yes I think we didn’t attack because I think they had an inkling they were going to get slaughtered.
I hope they all get together and fight back – it was way too freaky what happened – and of course no defenders meant that Fulham exposed an aerial weakness..
@rewind think welbeck is mate but as a center forward he’s always gonna struggle on the wing! Really think welbeck will be a special player
Rewind … As much as you think Red C’s comment about “when we’re playing well it doesn’t look like we need a defence” that’s the whole point! We simply don’t have a defence at the moment and it’s because of that that we look so fragile going forward.
When the confidence is flowing, and United are looking invinceable winning 4-0 etc ….it’s because the defence is quietly doing it’s job, often un-noticed, and players like Rooney, Berbatov, Valencia etc can simply focus on scoring goals and making them for others.
Also, in United’s case you can’t ignore the impact an attacking Evra has. With Vida, Rio, Brown, Evans, O’Shea, Neville and the like lining up beside him he feels alot happier about pushing forward.
You have to accept that our crisis at the back is effecting the whole team and useless and unfair to pick on individual performances and / or team formations and suggest they are the reasons we lost today.
@Dave Mack:
Good point. It’s not easy going into battle knowing that your back isn’t covered properly. Take today’s game for instance. Until the Murphy goal, i thought we were settling down and starting to get control of the game. We concede the goal, and the whole team is shell schoked. And the same thing happened last season too. Murphy scores the penalty and for the rest of the first half Fulham are all over us. After the break we got hold of the game even with 10 men. Today, i thought that we would do the same, but more bad defending gifts them a 2 goal lead 20 sec after the break. Game over.
In five matches that we lost this season, we failed to score. Doesn’t this fact say a lot? Yes we are struggling with injuries at the back, but clearly everything is not down to the defense.
I would rather play reserve team central defenders, than senior midfield players out of position. It was embarrassing how easy Fulham scored 2nd and 3rd goals today.
@ Costas
I agree with you about Edwin, Rio and Vida being match winners and that we are missing the spine of our team. It is after all a team game. It would be very easy to blame everything on the defense, but the lack of creativity and inability to score against the better organized teams has been evident for quite some time.
I have never seen a United team as clueless in the attacking half as this team has been for the past few games. I want Berba to succeed as much as any United fan, but he can be so frustrating, brilliant at times and pathetic at others. Its unfair to criticize Rooney because of his overall work rate and he can’t be expected to carry United in every game. I don’t expect much more from Owen. This is a team in transition.
The quick and expensive solution, in my opinion, is Villa, Silva and Kjaer.
The other solution, that Sir Alex obviously prefers, is to invest in the youth. Hence, Playing Carrick and Fletcher in defense is not a solution. I would have been happier if we had played and lost with the likes of Cory Evans at the heart of the defense. That would have shown that we have a plan for the future. Playing a 3-5-2 system with the only established defender Evra playing in the midfield is crazy. If we have the faith in these youngsters then start with the likes of Obertan and Eikrem. The midfield is certainly lacking creativity and maybe these younger players can inject a bit of creativity and passion.
I know the regular contributors of this blog would consider this blasphemy, but I would say Sir Alex got it badly wrong today. The team management has to take the blame for the insipid display today.
I have not seen the match was out all day, saw a late showing of avatar, it is truly shocking what is going on at united. can someone tell me how bad the top sides have become, liverpool losing is no suprise but what in the hell has happened to united.
man utd a phew years back we were supposed to set a new era of total success but with certain signings and players leaving it is not working out, united would tear sides apart with such a venom attack with pace and awesome on the counter back in 2007, to a side now that has become powder puff in attack, crippled at the back and weak in the center, fergie has lost hope in berbatov which is a shame.
the sides attack which was built on ronaldos pace and power is now looking toothless and it has come home to roost, it cant be any suprise but certain players are not steping up to the plate and why isnt obertan not giving the starts he deserves. When anderson is on the left we are fucked on the wings, especially the left we miss giggs invention which we have benifited from.
@rooney the new king:
Hey mate. Looks like the developments at Shity kind of overshadowed us today. Thankfully. I don’t have much sympathy for Mark Hughes these days, but the Arabs treated him like crap.
Anyway. Today’s game was a long time coming in my opinion. If the Villa game showcased our problems in front of goal, this one exposed our defensive woes when Vidic, Rio and co are missing. Fergie played a 3-5-2 today with Evra covering the whole left side. Ando was one of the 3 central midfielders. To be honest, United never looked like scoring, but the goals were way too soft.
United have dominated for 3 years now and in my opinion, in England you are very special if you can last that long. There’s a reason why no one has won 4 in a row. I remember the 01-02 season when we went for a 4th consecutive championship and it reminds me of this one in some ways. Leaking goals very easily, losing plenty of games before Christmas and not showing enough determination in big games. At least that season scoring goals wasn’t an issue. I think that we will be able to make a more fair assesment about how limited and predictable our attacking approach is, once we get a healthy back 5. For what it’s wort though, i thought Ritchie did very well.
And that’s it for me. I have to go to sleep and hopefully visions of Zamora and Gera won’t haunt me.Night.
just thought this might cheer some people up, and it’s probably old news by now, but citeh sacked hughes.
i don’t know why, but i’m actually happy for the man. maybe it’s because i can start seeing him as sparky again and not as “mark hughes- the twat who manages shitty.”
enormous fan of sparky growing up (can anyone volley a ball better than sparky?), hopefully this will go a long way in repairing the bridge he burnt with the united supporters, when he became their manager.
anyways, what a shit day of football. tried not to read too many posts after the loss out of fear of all the knee jerk whinging and player slagging, but i couldn’t resist. the usual suspects around here have been bang on in their analysis of the game, our injury situation, and team performance.
chin up mates! forget the glory hunters, we are united through the good and bad! we just need to ride out this wobble, get a bus load of players healthy, and trust that fergie knows how to fix the situation.
@ Costas well if players are on top of their game still in their prime they are still hungry then the titles will continue to be won.
I just think the decline of our defenders in terms of their fitness, the signings like anderson nani hargreaves berbatov have not worked out, in terms of how we expected a phew years back.
which is of many reasons why united look so out of sorts add ronaldo leaving, even for united that is one to many problems to overcome.
in 01/02 season united lost the hunger that is the big difference. united had the players but lost the hunger, I just feel now we dont have enough in some areas, and we so desperatly need another winger and a striker, because relying on rooney is really starting to show when berbatov and owen are not reliable enough and no one can deny that.
Grumbling about the formation is usually a sign that the grumbler has some sort of far-away look in his mind. Dreaming of olden times. Nostalgic for days gone bye.
But, for what it’s worth, UTD almost always play some version of a 3-5-2 system because it’s only with the greatest latitude that one can consider Patrice Evra to be a defender. He is usually higher up the pitch than the winger on his side of the field. Of course, when the “3″ are a healthy, fit, and sharp Rio/Vidic/Brown or O’Shea then that’s three central defenders; being backed up by a quality keeper like Edwin doesn’t hurt, either.
But, as they say, that was then and this is now – and “now” might be a vision of UTD’s future with a chronically-unfit Rio and Wesley, and an aged Edwin. Vidic’s stay in M/C is also uncertain despite the spin he sends out about loving the rain and his wife’s shopping restrictions.
It would appear that SAF has tried to work out some contingency plans to deal with these eventualities – signing Nani, Anderson, Hargreaves, Berbatov, and Valencia were supposed to provide cover for the departures of Ronaldo and the retirements of Scholes and Giggs. I am a fan of the ability of both Anderson and Nani – but neither one has been very consistent and, to be truthful, neither one has massively improved in the last three years. I am not a fan of Berbatov – despite his subtle, silky skills, he’s the wrong partner for Wayne Rooney. And, I blow hot-and-cold about Valencia – he’s predictable and one-footed. Owen Hargreaves is just a terribly unfortunate guy but we’ve seen flashes of what he would add to the team IF he could regain his fitness. So, not one of these guys has set the team on fire and for that reason I think that SAF’s “contingency plans” have not worked especially well even though – and this is a real contradiction – the team has had great success in the past three years.
The success of the past three years has largely been built on the earlier period of transition when Rooney and Ronaldo and Carrick and Tevez and Vidic and Evra and Carrick and Edwin were brought in to replace Ruud, Keane-o, PhilNev, Nicky Butt, and Beckham, while providing competition for Silly and Heinze.
After farting about with the likes of Bellion, DjembaDjemba, and Kleberson, SAF got things sorted in 2005-6 and that team went on to a series of great seasons. But that’s now coming to an end – SAF’s “teams” seem to have a life-cycle of about three years and the departure of Ronaldo obviously signalled a new period of transition even if the post-Ronaldo Lads are scoring more often – but they are leaking goals and not scoring consistently.
It seems to me that behind the terrible injury crisis in the back four and the appalling lack of consistency among the strikers, deeper “structural” problems are now coming to the surface. A few weeks ago it seemed that the ten fixtures in December and January looked like dead-certs but UTD have conspired to lose to both Aston Villa and Fulham – not exactly Puskas and De Stefano, eh ? I suppose that if – somehow, against the odds and defying all logic – the ‘ammers can beat the RentBoyz tomorrow that the EPL-table won’t look so bad but that would be a deceptive appearance.
As I’m waiting for my dinner, I can just imagine a NEWUnited beginning the 2010/2011 season without significant contriubtions from Edwin, Rio, Wesley, Vidic, RedNev, LittleMikey and Dimmy, Scholes, and Giggs even if some of those guys might be in uniform but they (i.e., Edwin, RedNev, Scholes, and Giggs) are getting really old and they are not exactly likely to be getting any better. Rio and Wesley and Owen Hargreaves are a niggle away from being declared “unfit to continue” while Little Mikey and Dimmy are now living on borrowed time.
If you plan for the worst – even while hoping for the best – then the future might even be “now”. So, all this talk about a 2009/2010 being a “transition” might be more serious than any of us would like to contemplate.
I’m trying to look on the bright side but the dulcet tones of my bride is informing me that my dinner’s ready so I have to sign off – for now.
Rewind – Reece Brown and Evans are injured aren’t they? They would struggle mate in a high pressure game at Craven Cottage.Different league to the reserves. Against an inform Zamora as well. Fergie is looking for experience. Fucking hell man, bit harsh on Carrick. He has done ok.
Costas – Spot on mate. For the first twenty minutes United DID control the game. Were unlucky not to get a penalty actually after a push on Valencia and it could have been a very different game. Even Trevor Francis said “No matter how many players United are missing it is still the same, pass and move”. We looked comfortable. Its a funny old game. One question. Why the fuck does Danny YSB Murphy always play a blinder against United? He is a decent mid fielder to be fair.
denton davey I think you are spot on, on redcafe.net one topic discused was have we had value for money from hargreaves nani and berbatov the answer is for me no way. the players you have said vds neville brown ferdinand vidic scholes giggs berbatov owen like you said are getting old. do they have a real future in 2 3 years time doubt it, so we need the new generation to step up fast or it is another dry spell for the club if so oh well I can live with it.
arij – I think we both know mate that Fergie ain’t gonna lash out seventy or eighty million on Villa and Silva. And rightly so.
From:http://www.mufcweb.com/2009/12/19/united-boss-fails-to-blame-players-after-3-0-defeat/
Manchester United boss Sir Alex Ferguson refused to blame his players for the embarrasing 3-0 defeat at Fulham.
“There was a fragility at the back and we couldn’t do anything about that,” he said.
“You have to have sympathy for the players in that respect.
“It’s difficult to play midfielders at centre back and Ritchie de Laet is only 21 years of age. He’s not got the experience yet needed for these type of matches.
“Of course it was a terribly soft goal for the first one and that gave them the platform to build on.
“The goal after half-time took care of us. It was a poor decision by the referee for the third goal.
“We couldn’t get behind Fulham at all and their defence is very well organised and it was a difficult day for us.
“The first goal was important for them but it was a bad one for us. It was an uphill fight after that.
“To concede 20 seconds into the second-half killed the game. We didn’t anticipate that.
“The players are maybe feeling a bit sorry for themselves at the moment because of the situation they’re in.
“But the quality of the football wasn’t as good as it normally is.
King Eric but you cant deny the fact that united need a couple of forwards, like a new winger and a new striker. owen and berbatov are just not reliable enough.
I think we need some creativity players like i said a few weeks back. I said we need some players like Giggs ability to find space and pass to win the match. Yesterday prove i am right. There are no one who can pick up the pass. Rooney is not at fault as no one can pass him the ball nicely. Berbatov before injury is good but i guess now he is a bit out of form. Owen is the type of player in the penalty area which can give you goal. He seldom score outside of the penalty area. Scholes was at fault for the first goal but given the fulham strong midfield i thought gibson should be more available in midfield. Without being available in midfield, scholes is given to much task to handle. Sol Campbell i thought was a good signing but Sir Alex said he can’t see to buy him and now our defense is leaking goals. I wonder if we still can win any trophies as our team is not strong to compete. Given that all those defenders coming back, they will need several weeks or matches to regain their fitness and form, i wonder if we will get back on form.
I hope the best that we can get from yesterday’s awful game is to make SAF realise — when we are depleted and off form in scoring, it’s disaster in making..
And make SAF realise we NEED badly to exercise some cheques in January!
I still believe as always, that if MU cannot score, not so much on leaking goals or defenders missing, it’s seriously a CRISIS!
we lost today but theres not muCh we can do with the injurys we got and i doubt any other team would be able to cope with 8 defenders out, 2 wingers and a keeper plus there 2 best midfielders in defence, we was doing fine before we got all these injurys, i still think were win the leauge, chelsea are slipping up abit and lose most of there best players in january and i think by the end of january were top, just hope we get some defenders back soon.
p.s king eric where ever you are are you joined to the redcafe mate??? or anyone else on here??
Let’s just get behind the team.And pray for the injuries to ease and just concentrate on ourselves all the way.
Sure our defence was poor yesterday but we didn’t even create a single chance upfront.Just what does our defensive frailities got to do with creating chances upfront?
@Ashish
Defensive frailties suck up the best/experienced midfielders to starve the strikers and hence chances up front.
Though what we really need is a new hero. Either rooney will realise who he is someone else will emerge/be brought. Till then it’s just wait and watch.
I really hate fergie’s formation for that match.He seems to favour gibson and scholes.Scholes is shit.He want to play week in and out but he doesnt perform well.I miss the old days where players play despite slight injury.I think ppl like ferdinand is a pussy.He must be scared for his fitness to not to miss the world cup
Over or not, UNITED I STAND, UNITED I LOVE, UNITED TILL I DIE!
i was actually singing with the fans, and jumping, dancing around… there an inspiration. You must think im crazy, but im proud to be a red!
truth be told, we have been VERY poor this whole season. we have alot of defenders injured, but the defensive stability should be back once they return. more worrying however, is the fact that we lack obvious incision and creativity in the final third. it’s too predictable right now: pass the ball to the flanks and they swing the crosses in. not to mention we don’t have a decent header of the ball in our attack so the crosses and corners are mostly useless. we need a world class attacking midfielder badly.
Good morning/afternoon everbody – nice to back wth a cooler head after yesterday’s disappointment . @MG – sorry I cussed you, but I was in an absolute foul mood whole week (my sister is going through a messy divorce), and yesterday’s defeat did little to cheer me up. I am not sure how many of today’s footballers realize this, but to a lot of fans, their team’s performance is one of the little things that keep them going on a depresssing Sunday night.
Read about Hughes – its a bit of a shame you know, bitter rivalries aside, I thought he was a good manager. I think SAF mentioned in one of his interviews, that his sucess was also due to the temperamant of Utd. management over the years, who were patient in their aim to build a lasting legacy. This impatience is such a bad sign of the times – you see the same mentality in business, sports, media and even within families.
About us, here’s my frank, neutral assessment:
What is really hitting us is the fact that with the golden generation moving on, the youngsters still aren’t ready to take their place. As a natural process, some will fall by the waysisde, that is to be expected. But the ones who show such brilliant promise are not there yet. As I said, fuck Ronaldo, we seem to be dead wthout Giggsy. More than just footballing talent, it is the sheer mental strength that comes out of braving a thousand storms that seems to be mising. One of the frustrating patterns for this season, is that if we score a goal in the first 30 minutes, we usually tear the opposition apart. If we don’t, we seem to losse our composure. Prme example – in the ManCity match, what really turned it in our favour, was Giggs stepping up the gears. Nobody, mark my word, abosulutely nobody else (well, maybe apart from Scholes) in the current team would have the composure to pick that pass to Owen in the final minute of injury time. Unfortunately, there is no short term solution to this. We just have to be patient and stick it out. No amount of money can buy what we are missing, and there is very little of interest in the market in any case.
At a more specific level, what we really seem to be lacking is the spark, the extra something. Teams playing us come prepared to put eleven players behind the ball for 70 minutes, and hope to get one smash and grab with a big striker upfront (Carew, Abgonlaor, Bent, Zamora…you know that type). Wth more and more success, it is logical to beleive that teams will make it more difficult for us to unlock their defences. I would imagine that only Giggs and Obertan have that ability in the current team, and well Barba to an extent. I don’t know whether that “magic” can be bought or not. At best, such a purchase will help us tide over the current crisis, but the only real solution to our problems seems to be time, and that, unfortunately, cant be bought, as Hughes has discovered.
wouldn’t call agbonlahor a big striker..
@jeet
Good read fella.
I think Hughes going might be the naivety of the Owners of City why Hughes went.
I have always been a fan of hughes which ever club he managed or played for to some extent!
I can remember the year at school where hughes was bought, I can remember the Goals against Oldham im the Semi Final of the Fa Cup 1991, the Goals against Palace in the Fa Cup final to force a replay and his goals against Barcelona in the Eurpoean cup the following year.
I know some of Hughes signing havent yet gelled or worked out, but on paper i think he has spent their money wisely. I would rather have had Benitez at City he certainly would have wasted most of that and certainly not be as strong as they are now!
Why is city not top of the table or in the top 4?…………… Well for me any championship winning team needs consistancy and for a team to reach the consistancy stage they have to become a team! A team of allstars do not become a Team over night!…In a team each player knows where they are supposed to be on the pitch every situation! A team Most players know what their team mates are going to do, Spot their runs instantly, Work together and when the chips are down up their effort! A team bounce back from defeat in the correct way and work harder in the next match!
A team of allstars is no way a team!….I am greatful for the city board cause i feel hughes although nothing special tacticaly as a manger in my eyes. But what he does offer and do well for me is that he organises his players and makes them into a team! Maybe one dymensional, but solid and playing as a team none the less. You give him time and he gets to that stage with the players he has got, he certainly would have made the Top 4.
Now the city Derby!…… Hughes for me added a bit of spice to the city derby! He new what they were about and i think this added to the players motivation!..> Now that he is gone i am not as worried as our previous game! Might be in the head i dont know!
Mancini……. Great! I love nothing less than an Inesperienced manager taking over who doesnt know the premiership!…
I will just say one thing. I hope the rumors about a 5mil pound move for Ben Arfa are rubbish. Of we have money to spend, we should get a defender.
@Costas
What kinda money would you spend on a defender and what value would we get out of him?
Who would want to move?
I am against spending 10 mil on cover just for this season, ok we dont win the league this year but its all about the bigger picture! All teams have building years, we might just have a bad run but we are still in the FA Cup & Champions League! Still alot to play for!
Any defender we buy would just play for 1 to 2 months then sit in our reserves for the next few years what is the point in that!
Get Arfa at 5 mil migth prove a real bargain!.. a few years ago he was hot property! and quoted prices of 10 – 20 mil.
It looks so far that Nani isnt working still has a bit of time left to prove his worth. Obertan looks good and has a chance! Id be happy if we got Arfa to be honest!
We have good strikers, after yesterdays game one thing was obvious was that we did lack a little creativty. Maybe due to low performances i know!
@Trevor:
I don’t know if Ben Arfa could help. His case reminds me that of Obertan. He is someone talented, who has lost his way a bit. Maybe Fergie feels that he can reignite his career. I said that a defender should be our priority because the defensive problems don’t look like letting up. I think that for 5 million we could bring in someone. I don’t know who, but there are always bargains out there. Or maybe even a loan deal like the Larsson one. Something short term that will get us through the season. I wouldn’t spend more than 5 illion for cover either.
In January of 04, when Rio got suspended, we made a similar choice. We went for an attacking player(Saha) instead of someone who could replace Rio short term. I remember that Southgate was an option at the time. Even though Saha was a good player for us, at the time it was the wrong choice.
Finally, i think that our attacking will be ok, once there is a solid back 5 behind it. We might not have the flair we had when Ronaldo was here, but United always score…
Costas – Ben Arfa for 5 mln ? I will take it. We are short of left wingers, no ?
Corea: It’s a rumor that i have heard in Greece mate. Olympiacos want him, but his agent says no because reportedly United are interested. They even say that Cantona recommended him to Sir Alex. Maybe it’s lies that the reporters over here have made up so that they have an excude if he turns down Olympiacos. He is a good player, it’s just that our priorities are different.
If we go for cover at left wing, i would like that Di Maria kid. I don’t know how much he would cost though. I think Obertan can also help on the left. And that way, maybe Nani can get a game on the right.
Costas – only lefty is Giggsy. Apart from him only right-footed players, mate. You can’t call Ben Arfa a cover.
Corea, pure left wingers are hard to find anyway. Apart from Ryan, we didn’t have anyone last season either. Ronaldo was good with both feet, but he didn’t stay on the wing for too long. However, if a right footed player knows hot to dribble and cut in, then he can be helpful on the left too. Obertan for example.
I remember Ben Arfa from his Lyon days. He was viewed as one of their greatest talents along with Benzema. But i think he has stalled in the last few years. A move to OT could motivate him.
It bewilders me how people are still blaming the defence for our poor attacking play. Only recently have we really had an injury struck defence, yes we’ve had injuries earlier in the season but we’ve still been able to have 4 good defenders playing. Yet for more or less the whole season you cannot compare our attacking play to any of the recent seasons, we just lack that edge, sharpness and threat we’ve been used to all these years.
As for Ben Arfa, I think he’d definitely be worth a punt, was considered to be a huge emerging talent not so long ago, always used to hear plenty of rumours about him along with Benzema. Although Fergie said he won’t be I think Nani will be sold in January, if not definitely the summer. He’s rarely even got a place on the bench recently and with Obertan’s progress I think we can say bye bye to him.
Costas and that is why valencia is one dimensional, wingers who stay on the wings are so outdated. the best wide players like ronaldo messi ribery all have more veriaty in their game they interchange.
@ rooney the new king ….”Costas and that is why valencia is one dimensional, wingers who stay on the wings are so outdated. the best wide players like ronaldo messi ribery all have more veriaty in their game they interchange.”
Agreed, but what makes him so one dimensional is his inability to use his left foot, I have never seen someone who uses thier right foot in every situation they find themselves in, its criminal and makes Valencia so predictable that I can tell you what he is going to do before he does it!
If I was Sir Alex, I would get the guy training with his left all the time, I cannot believe he has played professional football and trained at. (I would assume decent football academies from a young age) who have allowed him to use his right foot only.
Rewind: “what makes him so one dimensional is his inability to use his left foot, I have never seen someone who uses thier right foot in every situation they find themselves in, its criminal and makes Valencia so predictable that I can tell you what he is going to do before he does it!”
I’m in total agreement with that – yesterday he had a half-chance to blast it at the goal but shifted the ball onto his right foot = the half-chance was gone and he then passed the ball sideways. Typical.
Dave Mac, I couldn’t disagree with you more mate
Seriously, I think you’ve got the wrong end of the stick. What I mean by looking like we don’t need a defense when we are playing well is simply that when we are on song, defense starts with the attackers and midfield. We keep the pressure on the other team and we pen them back in their own half.
When we are in that mode, as we have seen many times, we impose ourselves in such a way that even the odd glaring defensive mistake is usually rectified because there are only rare passages of play we are under any consistant pressure and opposing attackers are isolated, having to not only try and make something out of any mistake but are being closed down from all sides. In fact mostly our defenders are usually just tidying up or linking play.When we are playing like that we can afford to put O’Shea in goal for the last 15 minutes, or play with only ten men for the last 5, change the whole defense round from one game to the next – things like that.
Now, of course we have injuries and I appreciate the point that this will affect things but the rest of the team is not functioning as it should be and for me that has been obvious before these injuries have underlined this problem. I am absolutely sure that a United team firing like we were two seasons ago could have played me and you in the back four and we would have got away with it because we would hardly have seen the ball. If you want a more detailed opinion regarding exactly where I think things are wrong, I will give that in a more relevant thread, because I am sure we will have many opportunities to second guess how Sir Alex will put things right and where we feel things are not working out.
But I am sure Dave that things are not entirely right at the moment. I’ve been watching United for more than 40 years and I learnt to recognise andsense these things, believe me!
Of course the defense is being highlighted now and I too have tried to take comfort from the various opinions that no team could cope with these defensive injuries, But I have been hearing excuses, or reasons we will improve for the whole of this season. Owen needs to get fit, we would have won at Burnley if the team selection had been different, we started with a run of hard games, now we should have a good run until the other side of Christmas, Foster let us down, we are missing Rio, Vidic will sort it out for us, Nani is not doing it, Anderson needs a run of games, we have the two Brazilians when they are fit, Hargreaves will be like a new signing when he comes back, Carrick’s not playing well – he must have fell out with Fergie, Berbatov will be a lot better this season…
It goes on and on, but what we all need to say is simple. We are not looking as strong as we did last season and no where near as strong as we were two seasons ago. In that respect it is extremely supprising that we have not brought in the kind of player we expect to replace our older or frequently injured players.
We can’t have it both ways. we can’t say what fabulous players Ronaldo and Hargreaves are and then accept that we don’t find equally good players to replace them, or at least in Hargreaves case an equally good addition because the Hargreaves we bought is lost to United. Although I really hope he manages to play for us, he will never be the same Hargreaves we briefly saw, and he has lost out on two years of development. God knows how good he could have been by now, but that is another story.
Niether can we talk about the obvious looming departures from the first team of Giggs, VDS, Scholes, Neville and now even Rio and then talk about buying players as ‘buying our way out of trouble’.
As I said in my original post, too many things seem to be happening at once for my liking. Loss of form. too many injuries, too many vital players talking about retirement, too little activity in finding replacements, too little impact being made from our young hopefuls, too few games where we look and feel in total command, too few goals, too many losses, too big a debt, too many strange and even unacceptable actions in the way our club is doing things, too little activity in the transfer market – regarding the normal rebuilding and strengthening strategy, too much activity in the business and marketing areas (some have said, in regards to becoming far too commercial and much less the family club we once were), too little info from the Glazers regarding the debt, transfer funds and the whereabouts of the 94 million euros from the sale of the best player in the world, too many sales of the best player in the world :=) … I’m getting a little dramatic I know, but you get my drift I am sure.
I feel that this January will give a few answers that are outstanding. If we do not buy a couple of handy players, that have a feasable future in our first team – and especially now with the injury list being used as a reason by Fergie for our slightly disappointing first phase of this years EPL (although I can remember us starting a season with 7 players on the operating table not so long ago and that has been a trend that has continued up until now) then I feel that the writing is most definately on the wall and that this club is in big, unmanageable financial trouble. I mean unmanageable in the sense of staying at the top of the tree.
It might be that plans are in place to get on top of that problem and that the Glazers have every intention of strengthening the team at the first possible moment, but then they need to trust us, the supporters on this and just come clean. It may be that they feel that would damage the very activities they are trying to expand, and thereby ensure a larger income stream, but I fear they may have got Sir Alex and others involved in such a way that it would seiously damage their integrity if a cover up is now proved. I would absolutely be sick to the stomach if Sir Alex or Sir Bobby were implicated in pulling the wool over the fans eyes in an attempt to protect the club from the Glazers or their financial mess.
Enough said, I am writing too many novels of late. Normally I enjoy writing a few lines on how fu*king great we are, but the last six months have changed me and I am sensing something serious in the air…sorry about that.
jeet Said
Great read and I think you are hitting the points I have made over the last six months. I’m just being a little ‘darker’ than you I suppose, because I see the lack of impact being made by our youngsters in relation to the attention the club has allowed to be turned on them.
The last two seasons we have been asked to believe that the youngsters at this club were good enough, wheras I have been coming to the rapid opinion that if they were indeed good enough they would be playing week in week out, and the fact that they are not making the desired impact (Jonny Evans apart) is now doubly counter productive because it is not just contradicting the club line about them being good enough, it is also deeply underlining our lack of investment in young, quality first team players. I don’t mean the Andersons and Nanis of this world either.
They were youngsters we took a big gamble on. They were in their teens or just reaching 20 when we first bought them and had done nothing of real importance. The large …no make that redicuously huge…amounts we had to pay for those two seems ironic when now set beside Sir Alex’s comments of not getting involved in inflated markets.
We need some experienced and quality, world class 23-27 year olds in the team, guys who have shown they can play on big stages in big teams, for a number of games and years. Guys who have developed some maturity, strength and consistancy but still have youth on their side. Rooney is about the only one I am seeing at United – I would still tend to argue against Fletcher being world class level at the moment.
And then of course come all the questions as to why that is the case? I feel the lack of activity in this kind of market for the last two summers has to be questioned and the reasons behind it exposed. It might not even have anything to do with the main suspects. It might be bad judgement and management?