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Some Success For Green And Gold

A respected sports-business analyst, Sport+Markt, has claimed that the green and gold campaign has made a significant impact on the revenue of the Glazers’.

“Our data show the club has lost retail revenue from the year 2009 to 2010 by around 10%,” said Dr Peter Rohlmann, the report’s author. “This is due to the fact that all the circumstances about the ownership and the behaviour of the Glazer family were not positive in the minds of Manchester United fans. This has had a direct impact on their merchandising spend.”

In the summer, RoM launched a ‘Dig Out Your Old Shirts‘ campaign where we encouraged fans to don shirts of years gone by instead of buying one of the new ones.

We wrote:

Nike signed a deal worth £303m with United which expires in 2015. Whilst presently, it is Nike’s pocket we will be hurting, not the Glazers’, it stands to reason that in 2015, the Glazers will be offered considerably less for the manufacturing contract with Nike.

Not only do Nike make the kits, but they are responsible for “Manchester United’s global retail operations”. This essentially means Nike spreads the United brand around the world.

Every penny that we can deny the Glazers is another reason for them to sell up. At present, they don’t have much of a reason to go, but if year on year they make less money from our club and they come to the conclusion that they are going to sell, they would need to do so sooner rather than later to get the best price. Every year that they wait and every year that the protests gain momentum, the less money they are going to make from us.

The Guardian has suggested today that this decrease in revenue could lead to a new deal being put in jeopardy.

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You’ve made your decision on renewal… now the shirt

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About Scott

Scott is the editor of Red Matters - 50 Years of Supporting Manchester United and an author of Play Like Fergie's Boys and Not Nineteen Forever. He writes for ESPN, The Metro and Bleacher Report. Follow @R_o_M on Twitter.

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271 Comments

  1. wakey says:

    @mattbw7

    Veron was one of the best players in the world at the time, 28mill was a bargin. He didn’t cut it in England sadly. Now 28mill gets you an Average player who doesn’t really add to the team.

    And we threw money away on Berba simply because it got to the point where spurs had us over the barrel and it had gone too far and we had to pay for him. The Sun screwed us with their badly researched story that claimed a fan site was an official site and saw spurs bump the £24mill fee that was pretty much agreed upto 28mill and then city got the last day money boost which pushed it up further.,

    On Toure do you not think it was Yaya greed that got in the way more? The clubs always been strict with its wage cap and yaya would have blown the roof off it, which would have seen some players have their wage clauses triggered and others looking to renew their contracts ask for much more.

    @Nobby

    If we weren’t paying the interest you could almost guarantee that it wouldn’t be available for players as the Glazers would almost certainly be taking the dividends they are entitled to. The only way it would be available would be if the Glazers did what Abramovich does and take his dividends still but OK the club to go massively into their overdraft.

    Its a major problem in the MUST/Anti Glazer argument as they assume the interest is money that would remain in the club without the interest when in effect the interest is just the Dividend payment to the investors that was always being paid and would still be paid. The only difference is the interest payments are a set amount where as Dividends would change in value depending on results so were lower in amount that the PLC paid but only because profit levels were lower

    And I’m not sure Schneijder would have ever been on our shopping list. Real were demanding over 20mill for most of the transfer window which for a player who failed to really make an impact in Spain is too high to be realistic. Inter actually had an offer for more than teh 12mill they paid rejected earlier in the window but Real got desperate and came back to the table. It seems to be the same with VdV and spurs, while there is no public confirmation of a bid being made by spurs Real were saying 20mill+ early on when we were being linked and all I can assume is Spurs made an enquiry as Spurs seem to be the only club offered the last minute 7mill deal.
    “Teams will have to “balance the books” with new signings.”

    Problem is next season it isn’t being fully implemented so balancing the books isn’t as important just yet. It could make the buying clubs have to pay more, just as Chelsea were forced to for Torres. Also clubs will see it as a quick way of balancing books at this point. I suspect we won’t see major impact from it for a few seasons

  2. wakey says:

    @mattbw7

    ” thier total lack of communication is stunning given that they originally said they would keep the fans informed on the direction of the club.”

    You can blame that on MUST on the whole. Their initial campaign was admirable BUT as soon as the Glazers were successful their duty as a mouthpiece for the fans was to give them chance. They stayed on the offensive however without anything to back up their claims and kept twisting anything the Glazers did say. They needed to be dealing in facts to fight for the fans rather than conjecture and borderline lies that they have been as its just alienated them from the Glazers and inturn caused the Glazers and the Fan base to become alienated.

    Its not just MUST that have this issue, alot of supporters groups seem to be run by the same idiots that run many of the trade unions who simple have no tact. They claim to be representing others interests but just go out of their way to wind the other side up so much that it starts a war which then makes the leaders of the groups build up their own sense of self importance.

    I have said it once and will say it again as United fans we need to make MUST aware we don’t want these fools representing us and we need a more progressive supporters group to represent us. Even then it will be hard to get the Glazers back to the table now but while MUST is the main mouthpiece then its never going to happen

    @Charlton’s Comb-over

    If you knew anything about business you would be aware that there is no way the decisions to freeze the ticket prices were made due to G&G. G&G didn’t start until the end of Jan 2010 which just doesn’t give the time to redo a complete business plan and finalise it before season tickets for 10/11 went on sale.

    It would have almost certainly been locked in before the G&G started with projections made based on that and the previous years trends and also the trend with the waiting list (People will say a waiting list doesn’t exist but I suspect it still does exist but much smaller. The problem with a waiting list however is its not a firm commitment. When you joined it you circumstances could be different or you may only be interested in certain seats that aren’t available)

    @Nobby

    “Merchandise sales are up 30% overall. The 10% down was just from the club store – this drop was attributed to less home games so far this season.

    Well that makes this post was f***ing pointless…”

    And even if some of the 10% is due to the boycott a 30% rise is more than enough for Nike and Others to want a new deal and united to receive even more. As the only money United get from shirt sales is rom the club shop and Nike get the rest and it doesn’t matter if those sales are from the club store or a JJB store in London to them. They may be taking a tiny amount out of the Glazers pocket but the deals structured as it is to account for that

  3. MANsuyUNITED says:

    @ Charlton’s

    My use of the phrase ‘get over yourselves’ was extremely arrogant. For that I apologize, it was my direct response to being told to ‘get over myself’ for caring about United from far away. I have tried to rectify my arrogance and apologized for it. I did, however, need to stimulate the debate.

    @ Nobby

    I’m far less concerned with shirt sales than I am the overall sentiment that this campaign has taken. With no figurehead other than some of the truth-benders at MUST, it has turned into all out mutiny which, in my eyes, is so very threatening to United. My posts are full of emotion and that is my focus. Clearly we all agree that this matter is dividing us. I do believe ST holders should be upset. Perhaps my posts will make them more sore about it, and for that I apologize. I do support the idea of the G&G campaign, just not its execution. It needs clear, defined motives with a figurehead to direct its affairs, in my opinion.

    We can throw facts and figures around all day until we are blue in the face, and so clearly we have. There is no reason to avoid the debt the Glazers have brought the club. No reason at all. But without a focus for this protest, it is turning into mutiny.

    @ wakey

    I chose my words correctly. I could care less. I do love this sight, as I have said repeatedly. I do care about our fans/supporters and our club. I care a whole lot. But I COULD care less if it meant my point got across. They are varying distinctions on a similar theme. I couldn’t care less means you don’t give a shit in the least bit. Well I am not out to be a villain, so I could care less.

    I really like your point about the ticket prices in all of football, however. I agree strongly with that and have been trying to etch something along those lines. Football is changing and the Glazers are elements of that change. They are working in the market they were given. That does not justify their actions, but it may help put them in perspective for a few people out there. I’ve been trying to keep numbers out of my posts because what I am most upset about is the overall sentiment and hatred which is inadvertently being transferred onto the club.

    Great point about everyone on here playing Football Manager with the whole thing. The disgusting thing is, all this doubt surrounding the club makes us look at EVERY SINGLE transfer in world football and say, “Oh, why didn’t we buy him?! WE’RE BROKE!” There is not enough trust in Sir Alex Ferguson. That makes me a strong combination of angry/sad.

    @ mattbw7

    Addressing me directly and making an effort to understand my arguments would be a great start, mate. I am not pro-Glazer. I am pro-United. You can’t distinguish the two. Many fans can’t. That’s what upsets me.

    This is a great thread guys. We all want the same thing, United to succeed. And clearly we care about it a whole lot. I am proud to share this club with you guys. LU.

  4. Nobby says:

    @wakey Hello thar!

    So many talking points! I would like to take some time to answer you. So here goes:

    1. I said I would like it if they lowered ticket prices but I never in a million years think that the Glazer’s or anyone else ever would do such a think. It’s just a dream that I wish could happen. Football has gone mad. I know German teams don’t necessarily compete financially but they don’t do too badly. Real and Barca are bad examples I should have thought about that a bit more.

    2. UEFA financial fair play rules are not enforced this coming financial year but financial years 2012 and 2013 are to be taken into account.

    3. I agree negotiating individual TV rights would increase the amount of money the club would make but I am so vehemently against it. I believe that the Premier League is the best league in the world and it’s fundamental that the TV rights are negotiated as a league not by individual clubs.

    4. The fact is that if the debt wasn’t on the club there would still be more money available than with the current situation. If the club had remained a PLC the dividends it would have had to pay out would have been no way near the levels of interest payments.

    5. The Sneijders comment was because I like him as a player. He didn’t have a steller two seasons at Real Madrid but he wasn’t that bad. (And recently terribly under-looked for the FIFA Ballon d’Or award this year. Treble winner and world cup finalist.)

    6. I think you might have me wrong. I’m not for boycotting the shirt sales. I’m saying that the post was pointless because that 10% drop from the United club store was insignificant if world merchandise sales were up 30% this year.

    7. Nike operate the merchandise operation for United and the net profits from the sales are split evenly between Nike and United.

  5. Nobby says:

    @MANsuyUNITED

    Agreed. The Green and Gold campaign needed a clearer figurehead and a better agenda than just “Glazer’s out”.

    You mention us lot on here playing football manager. There’s no doubting that the debt hasn’t had some sort of effect on the transfers. And I think also it doesn’t help that this team is possibly the weakest (by United’s standards) that we’ve had for possibly decades. (That’s why if we do win the Premier League this year it should rank right up there with Fergie’s greatest achievements. – It doesn’t help when United is a team in flux as it appears to be right now.)

    I believe this is why we look at the transfers and ask questions as to why we haven’t bought some of these players.

  6. MANsuyUNITED says:

    @ Nobby

    I understand why we ask these questions. I understand completely. What I do not understand are the conclusions that are drawn from self-serving logic. Just because we didn’t buy a certain player does not mean the money wasn’t there. It means, we didn’t buy the player. How are we to know if SAF wanted that player, even on a free? He is the master at squad balance. Let’s leave it to him. Drawing the conclusion that we don’t have the money for the transfers, to quote SAF, is ‘absolute rubbish’. We cannot let fear take over our senses. It must be addressed, yes, but not at the expense of our trust in SAF. He has never once mentioned any dissatisfaction with the amount of money the Glazers have made available to him.

  7. Charlton's Comb-over says:

    MANsuyUNITED – well, you definitely managed to do that alright!

  8. wakey says:

    @MANsuyUNITED

    Not really the place for a discussion on the English Language but..

    You said “Let me fall the villain, I could care less.”. Unless I’m misreading this you are saying you don’t care if people here want to make out your the villain aka pro Glazer, you just care about the club

    So by saying “I could care less” you are saying that just a little bit you do care what people think of you on the site. “Couldn’t Care less” would be the right usuage because you don’t care if people try and portray you as the Villian

    A good video about the whole Couln’t/Could Care less issue can be seen at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=om7O0MFkmpw

    @Nobby

    1. They don’t do badly but they also don’t really do great. Only Bayern really have the chance to compete at the top level of Europe and they are helped alot by their legacy helping them and even then they generally make smart buys of players where intrest from other top teams is limited.

    2. I know they are taken into account but for 2012/2013/2014 3 year period the rules are alot more relaxed. By the time they are fully in play and the real implications kick in 2012′s figures will mean nothing. Its still going to be a sellers market in the coming summer due to this unless a clubs really in problems (City and Chelsea for example may have to be selling clubs this summer)

    4. The PLC was regularry paying between 10-20mill in dividends. For its turnover this was ridicously high. Based on todays
    EBITD figure for the last 6 months the yearly
    EBITD is in the 121mill range. A dividend of 25% which is a fairly standard rate I believe would see a dividend of around £30mill so even if they scalled them back thats not too far from the Interest payments

    7. It depends if we are talking about the Shirt sales or complete merchandise. The Shirt deal pays United nothing other than the agreed fee and for ones sold in the club shop the retailers cut. The additional mechandise operation that Nike help with is split 50/50

    RE: Weakest Squad

    I’m not sure its that weak. There has been a world cup hangover with some players and a couple who are out of form for some unknown reason but if the teams the weakest its been in a long time I don’t believe we would be at the top of the table.

    I think what we are seeing as much as anything is a Premier League thats the most competative league in the world and a league where the teams are getting better and smarter tactically and more clinical when they get a chance.

    Otherwise if we say we have one of the weakest squads we have ever had then you would have to accuse the whole league of being weaker which i’m not sure is the case

    The worst thing I would say we have been guilty of has been switching off in defence. Something most of our rivals can’t say and with better defensive concentration we would be walking the league at this point

  9. wakey says:

    @MANsuyUNITED

    The biggest issue with the transfers is the way people forget about bids that it was confirmed we had made but the player choose elsewhere. Benzema and Villa are two players we bid £30mill+ for and had offers accepted but they opted for elsewhere. I suspect Ozil indicated he wanted to goto Real because all the evidence does suggest that SAF met with him/Werder’s Reps at Fulham as you don’t expect SAF to spend time like that unless he is interested.

    They also write off signings like Smalling as being cheap buys but in reality its alot of money for players wo are only potential at the time

  10. MANsuyUNITED says:

    @ Wakey

    I think you are in fact misunderstanding my intention. I do not want to be considered a villain. I care about being considered the villain. But, if I have to be the villain, I could care less about that if I had to. I do care though. That is, if I cared 8/10 about not being a villain, I would be willing to care 4/10 (as opposed to the 0/10 that ‘couldn’t care less’ represents). So yes, I used it correctly within my intentions. Interesting video and while English began in England, it has taken new forms all around the globe. I do believe semantics are important though, in every debate. Without common terms, poor value placement takes place. Not that you did that. You did the opposite and intended to get us on the same page. I hope we are now?

    @ Charlton’s

    I sincerely hope that you see what I was trying to do and why. These debates must continue until we all find common ground. ‘Those who make peaceful revolution impossible make violent revolution inevitable,’ to quote JFK — if i may. I guess, I hope you accept my apology and see my true intentions. Sometimes you must take a few steps backward to take a few forward, to quote a bland but true cliche – if I may. (This rhyme is getting obnoxious, haha.)

    I just love United. Though my methods may be in question, I am learning more each post from each of you. I am so grateful. I want us all to expose our truest beliefs and feelings about the club so that we all realize what common ground we all really share. Those who have told me that we cannot and will not unite. I say to you, so long as you believe that, you are right. I will just keep hoping you are wiling to rethink that.

  11. MANsuyUNITED says:

    @ Wakey

    What if, though, these players just preferred to join those clubs? What if money had nothing to do with it? Citeh offered those similar players tons of money and, for obvious reasons, those similar players went elsewhere.

    While we believe United is the best club in this world, not everyone else does. I think it is inappropriate to think that money is everything in these equations. As we have seen with Citeh, it is not.

  12. Nobby says:

    I’m not too worried about the ability to buy players. I’m just worried about some of the players we’ve bought. :D

  13. MANsuyUNITED says:

    And that’s a very fair thing to do. No one can deny that our performances this season have not been up to par with the creative, free-flowing football United typically sets out to showcase.

    My issue, and this is not an issue with you personally but with a larger contingent of the fanbase, is that SAF’s buys do not always pan out. That is not the Glazers’ fault. He came to them and said, ‘Hey, there’s this kid Bebe who I’ve never seen play before and he doesn’t even play in a top league, but I want him.’ The Glazers said, ‘Okay Alex, here’s your money.’

    They have backed him fully in the transfer market to date. It will be telling what happens in these upcoming markets. But as of now, he has gotten every penny he’s asked for. Even when he makes a buy on a player he’s never seen before! The Glazers clearly trust him to provide success on the pitch as their futures are so deeply tied to it. While they might be doing a some harm to this club, at least they trust in our manager. It’s tough to deny that claim. But I’m sure someone will try…

    The question is, does that harm outweigh the reward? Do the ends justify the means? Well this question is for the more philosophical amongst us. And here I will admit my philosophy of United is very different constitutionally than your average Mancunian. However, United as a club are becoming global. That was going to happen regardless. It is not a small time club with small time aspirations. It seeks to be the best in the world. Not the best in Manchester. By being the best in the world, we obviously are the best in Manchester. Long may that be our aim.

  14. Charlton's Comb-over says:

    MANsuyUNITED – no problem here, let’s hope for a good result and a great match tomorrow. No away ticket for me, so let’s also hope for a good internet connection!

  15. MANsuyUNITED says:

    @ Wakey

    Serious question of semantics that perhaps you could answer:

    Is it HEAR HEAR or HERE HERE?

    Because Charlton’s, HEAR HERE!

    LU.

  16. wakey says:

    Its Hear Hear I believe

  17. Nobby says:

    Yeah I don’t think anyone would say that the performance of players once they get to United is nothing to do with the Glazer’s. Fergie’s bought some terrible players before and will continue to do so in the future.

    Even though the Glazer’s appear to have fully backed him we don’t know how much wrangling there is behind the scenes. Nor do we know whether the idea of spending too much is part of what Sir Alex is thinking about when he looks to buy a player. Like we’ve come to realise it’s all about United doing well to work the finances, so I wonder whether this has any degree of effect on the transfers if any at all!

    I really hope Wigan don’t pull one out of the hat tomorrow! It would be just like them to do that. We’ve won the last 12 games and the aggregated scores of those games is 37-4! HAHAHAHA! I’m hoping for United to really get into gear at the Wigan game and kick on. But I’ve been hoping for that all season.

    Come on United!

    United We Stand, Divided We Fall.

  18. MANsuyUNITED says:

    HEAR HEAR Nobbers!

  19. mattbw7 says:

    Wakey you as selective with your facts as most are, for your information there is no capitalism in China that is not authorised by the state to say you dont buy anything from china is just bollocks if you have a laptop, ipod tv digi radio clothes its highly likely they where sourced in china, a place where you still get shot if you demonstrate against the government, whether you are aware of it or not. The fact that you deny such is total bollocks, the fact they dont own UTD is totally irrellevant by buying chinese products the taxes the state takes from these companies helps to keep the state going. So in a general argument about human rights you cant just exclude china cos they dont own utd, of course if you dont own anything from china you are a better man than me.

  20. wakey says:

    @mattbw7

    No capitalism in china? Are you sure about that?

    You do realise what capitalism means don’t you? It doesn’t matter if the companies that operate in China need state authorisation, every country is like that. Yes China’s rules to be allowed to operate in the country are alot stricter than alot of others but the companiies operating in China are not all state controlled where the profits go back to the state, they have alot of private owned companies including the likes of MacDonalds operating where the profit goes to the owners/shareolders not the Chinese state.

    And I didn’t say I didn’t own anything that parts of it were made in China. I said I try not to knowingly buy items from china (especially from State owned firms)

    And China’s Human Right record IS IRRELEVANT because we are having a discussion not on Human Rights BUT on Uniteds ownership. If it was a private individual/company from Qatar then the Human Rights issue wouldn’t be a factor, its only a factor because Qatari Holdings is a state owned company. As such the human rights issues of Qatari would become a United issue because our owners are the people allowing the human rights issues t go on.

    Its a MAJOR difference between the Qataris and for example currently being owned by Americans. No matter what you want to sling at the Glazers they DON’T have any control over Americas political policies. Bush illegally detaining people, allowing them to be tortured and the likes is wrong and should rightfully be looked down on by the international community but it was the Bush Administration that ok’d it and allowed it not Private individual such as the Glazers. As such they aren’t responsible for them and we aren’t dragged into it

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