Ahead of kick off I said the most important thing today, the necessity, was to secure the point that would take us back to the top of the league. Spurs are a good side and to get a draw at their place has to be considered a good result and a win would be a bonus.
When Rafael was sent off with 17 minutes of normal time remaining, a point was looking better than ever, so credit to our lads for not doing what Spurs do when a decision goes against them. We got stuck in and fought for the draw by keeping our opponents out. The home side only had two shots on target all game, both of which went tamely in to the arms of Edwin Van der Sar.
It was a real shame that Rafael was the player to go off after he had put in such a good shift up until that point. His first yellow card saw him win the ball but a raised leg meant it was easy enough for Dean (who wrongly penalised him in the first leg of the League Cup against City last season, awarding a penalty for a foul on Bellamy outside of the box) to put him in the book. The second booking was ridiculous though, with Rafael merely trying to get back in to position, and if anything, avoid the collision that took place. Thankfully, our lads ensured we didn’t have to pay the price for Dean’s incompetency. I really like Rafael though and the fact that he’s only 20 should be a source of great excitement for us. Can you imagine how good he’ll be in even just two years time?
Maybe I misunderstand the role Michael Carrick is supposed to play in our side. He mopped up effectively today, putting in a solid defensive performance and stopping the supremely talented Modric and Van der Vaart from causing too much trouble. But I thought he was supposed to be the creative one? With Ando, who loves getting forward, and Scholes, who can ping the ball all over the park, on the bench, you’d think that Carrick, playing alongside the more robust Fletcher, would be the attacking element in our central midfield. If he’s not, who is, and why are we playing 442 away from home without someone assigned to being our creativity outlet from the centre of the park?
Dimitar Berbatov would have had to have been in the game to play badly. He hardly got a touch. Should he take as much responsibility for that as his team mates who failed to find him? Probably. Wayne Rooney, who I’d been excited about returning before kick-off, didn’t do anything either… other than his ‘bouncing the ball of the shins’ trick he’s seemed to develop since March. He had our best chances of the game though, one early on which flashed across the face of goal, and one later on which Gomes made a very good save to stop going in.
Our defence worked as a solid unit though, Nemanja Vidic leading the way like usual, so it’s just a shame the players ahead of them couldn’t do their job. Our midfield really is a concern, especially when even Nani isn’t showing up. Ideally, we’ll have Scholes and Ando in partnership for as much of the remaining season as possible.
Will we be able to win this league by continuing to win at home and continuing not to lose away? As it stands, we’re top of the league with games in hand. On the same points as City with two games in hand, two points clear of Arsenal and seven points clear of Chelsea with one game in hand. What a ridiculous season this is turning out to be.
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Everyone rants about when we get a decision in our favour but when something goes against us then nobody cares except us
‘Football, bloody hell.’
Couldnt agree more scott…. very well summed up the game.
Mike Dean is a cunt.
Other than that, your last sentence summed it up pretty well.
Fletcher was awful – again. carrick was much, much better in the second half, but he was poor in the first 45, and on two separate occasions he gifted Tottenham hospital balls, which could have led to goals – thankfully they didn’t.
The home side only had two shots on target all game, both of which went tamely in to the arms of Edwin Van der Sar.
Almost same words I told to One of my friend who hates united so much that he supports every opponent we play told me that Bale put more than 10 deadly cross n spurs were the team looked like winning the game….
@Dave – true that.
After the match the presenter tried to make of it like it’s not always necessary to have an intention in order to get yourself booked.
Sir Alex after the game:
“It was a tough game. Tottenham are in really good form but they did not make many chances against us. It was a decent point for us so I can’t complain. Our defenders were particularly good and a draw was a fair result.”
For once we did not look like scoring (till last shot of the match), but fuckin hell, we never looked conceding…Vidic is best CB in the world. Respect.
Well earned 1 pt, but could have been all 3… Referee clearly was a ABU tool…Referee did us n not the spurs…
I love Rafael, I can’t wait to see how good he will be in 2 years either Scott.
10 man with vidic on field is = 11 man on field.
They will all sleep with the fishes
Always thought Fletcher is more creative than Carrick. Carrick is always sitting back while Fletcher makes a lot of forward runs.
Crouch sleeping with a fish. That’s quite a sight. Thanks MG.
Boring Boring United
Modric showed our two CM how to pass a ball and receive the ball in tight areas of the pitch. He was the only danger for Spurs, the other 2 Bale and VDV, weren’t really in the game. Still unbeaten and top of the league, not too much to be unhappy about.
“Well earned 1 pt, but could have been all 3″
Right on the first bit – TOTALLY deluded on the last. Thought it was a really poor performance from utd and credit to Vidic & Ferdinand for earning the point..
With a decent striker Spurs could really contend in the Premiership, but probably not this year
Rafael is top drawer. Sending off was a joke. Fuck off Mike Dean you cunt.
Rafael was hugely impressive up until the second yellow, which wasnt deserved. He will be a great player soon..
This extends our unbeaten run against Spurs to 20 games (15 wins). Also 26 games in the Prem unbeaten, and 15 games on the road unbeaten.
But we need wins! Yes, but runs like these are only put together by dominant teams.
Spurs have recouped 16 points from losing positions this season. That’s a premiership record.
And yet they couldn’t show that resolve at home against 10 man United.
Of the contenders, we have achieved the best result this weekend.
19th beckons, come what may, we shall overcome!
Really pleased that 10man United pulled it together yet again. Rafael is our leader in red cards in important games. Champions league last year same thing. Lad has got to stop giving away the first yellow. He didn’t need to raise his leg for the first yellow, once Dean made the decision on the second he was off. Same story against Liverpool in the FA cup tie, unnecessary yellow which could have cost us.
Also, Rafael up the pitch has been a problem. Rooney was the last defender on one play because Rafael forgot he wasn’t a forward. 10man United had a chance because the lads knew they were owning the back line with 3 all game long. Mike Dean was typical crap. Only way he controls his game is by tossing out yellows and attitude. None of the players seem to respect him. Still, really really disappointed with Rafael (both yellows) and WR10 (yellow for arguing). This is not the United way. We should be better than that.
Sorry for the rant lads.
United have scored 12 goals more than Spurs in the league with a game less. Yeah, we are the boring ones.
Your first paragraph says all thats needed though I have for once no issue with anything you’ve written.
On the Carrick point I’ve been having the same thoughts but maybe thats just the way his game has developed as he matures, in order to stop clever players you need to be a bit clever yourself. I reckon he will get the more creative side of his game to the fore again but his defensive display today was really good.
Mike Phelan after the game.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/teams/m/man_utd/9363468.stm
All this game proves is that a real look should be taken at our midfield. Its amazing that Carrick isn’t allowed to be the creative part of a midfield two that comprises of him and Fletcher. For me it only says one thing Fletcher doesn’t have the tactical discipline to guard the back four.
Personally i’m disappointed with the performance and result. Sugar coat it any way you want but something has to be done about the way we’re playing at the moment. Nani didn’t show up today, Berba looked up for it but faded, Rooney is shite; 200k for this lad ? Lord have mercy. Fletcher having not having a good game as well. I’d also like to point out to the naysayers who scoffed at the idea of Modric playing well for Untied or in th league for that matter;”he’s too lightweight”, “Not strong/tough enough”, “Untied don’t play with attacking midfielders”. Utter rubbish, the days of playing with wingers bombing forward and as your main source of attack is in my opinion outdated. Having midfielders who always look to create and do something with the ball is almost required now and the only player we’ve got who can do it is Ando and he started on the bench. I’d much rather have started Ando with carrick with Hernandez on top with Berbatov
bad performance.
Carrick was awful, anderson should have started…
hernandez came on too late to make a difference…
rafeal should NOT have been sent off
C’mon Why the hell wont people recognise Wayne Rooney Fantastic input today?
He had excellent shots saved and missed 1 sitter. The shots he took was great and takes a really good keeper to save.
Work rate was amazing playing RB, counter attacking and defending.
Vidic & co at the back was in terminator mode.
Carrick was great apart from the 2 shit passes.
Giggsy deserves special praise as the greatest of all time for us. Lengendary performance.
yes yes rafa always gettting stuck in lol
Van der Sar after the game
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/teams/m/man_utd/9363472.stm
You where lucky to get a draw and Harry has got to take some of the blame for this goalless draw by not bringing Pavlyuchnco on and Jenas to give us extra attacking Utd where always a threat and a draw was a fair result knocking City Oilers of the top will do for me.
The EPL’s standards have gone down this season and if we are going to play with a sub-par midfield for one season, it is good that it is this one. Because I honestly cannot see any of the other top 5 being better than us over the course of 38 games. And all we’ll have to do is start winning some of theses games and get good results against Chelsea, Arsenal and City and we should get to 19. It’s not going to be easy but we are in the prime position for it anyways.
Europe might be a bit more difficult without at least getting Valencia back and Nani back to full fitness and Fletcher back to some sort of form. But I am sure Sir Alex has some sort of plan for our midfield in the summer whether it be in the form of youngsters coming through or one marquee signing who is going to make the difference. But I am sure that difference is not needed in determining whether we end up with the 19th in May or not.
http://www.tribune.ie/sport/soccer/article/2011/jan/16/fergusons-selections-keep-his-opponents-guessing-a/?
good article on Fergie’s rotation system. It’s for those who think Ando should start every fucking game.
How can you really disapointed with an away point at spurs!
Man u did what they needed to today to get a draw. Let’s be honest thad what you seemed to play for. Defenses were on top. We had the greater intent even before you went to to 10 with 15 mins to go. We had a few that went very close without being on target but gomes made a couple of decent saves. Overall fair point. Modric the best player on the pitch. Lots to be happy with for us with 60% possession which was same at OT. Just shows how good ferdinand and vidic are when they play together.
Bit of a confused blog this. On the one article you’re slagging off spurs fans (rightly so in some cases) for clinging on to past refereeeing blunders then spend half a paragraph whinging about Mike Dean’s past refereeing performances.
A point was fair enough though tbh, no real chances for either side in the match. I joked with my red mates beofre kick off that “Harry is deliberately throwing this match by starting Crouch” although he replied pointed out “Fergie’s doing the same by playing Flercher and Carrick” good mates those two
Well said Scott, to be honest I think we went there – not for a draw per se – but definitely to ‘not lose’ put it that way. Ando was sacrificed because we needed Carrick and Fletcher on the pitch to ‘not lose’, and it worked. The Gypsy and the Rat couldn’t really play their game.
True Fletcher still hasn’t hit form yet, and its frustrating because in games like last this season where we’re bogged down in the middle HE’D be the one to run the ball out into space and find a pass, then keep going to support the attack. Not today. Still he didn’t do too much wrong defensivily, which is clearly what Alec asked of him and the team, so no real complaints from me all round. I said I’d be happy with a tight game, just a shame we couldn’t nick it one nil.
Ando obviously wouldve added more creativity but at what cost? Like Alec said players in form need to get dropped sometimes for the greater good. He had two brief oppotunities to actually play the killer ball to snatch the game near the end but alas, it wasn’t to be. Still, as our most promising midfield prospect its good to see him out there getting minutes. But I do wish Hernandez would start ahead of Rooney, he’s got more goals in less games so he’s earned it mate. Lets not do the england thing of picking out of form players on past glory, thats why england cant win shit, they leave the top england goal scorers of the season at home and rely on pig entrails and tea leaves instead of good ole God given common fucking sense. Hernandez should start alongside Berbatov – End of Rant.
Still, not a Bad Point at all away from home considering we never really got going, and the Yids are supposed to be the best thing since Sex right now. But they didn’t really threaten VDS too much. we’re still unbeaten, didn’t concede, and back on top. Can’t complain!
Surely the ineptness of our midfield will get the surely have the boss knocking on David Gills door to open the cheque book… Fletch has been shit for months now
Hope nothing serious with Rio. He was looking hurt in extra time.
@Corea
It’s not about Anderson starting every game. Fletcher played against Liverpool instead of Anderson and wasn’t particulary good. And Anderson has been in good form since December. So it made sense that Ando got the nod today. Fletcher has played a lot of games and it’s reached the point where someone else has to be given a shot in midfield. Because Darren isn’t cutting it as he used to.
@Corea
Not every Fucking game. Just the games where he would be a real asset; like today. Sure you noticed the midfield and to a large extent the attack was not up to scratch today.
slim – I’m with you there mate on Modric, class act. That’s a debate for another day though, but no chance we’ll get him, while Levy is at spurs and our financial situation.
@Costas – yeah, some truth in that. But Fergie decided to go his own way.
ok every time a player shows a loss of form sell the cunt, some posts on here are just FUCKING LAUGHABLE
Good result. Hell of a game.
@Keanesmagichat, Yeah, but the same Fletcher scored the goal of the season last time around. It is just one of those seasons where nearly every one in our midfield is having a bad season. I still think one midfield signing is enough and that too as a replacement for Scholes. Fletcher will come good eventually but I have no idea what has gotten to him this season around. Carrick is still doing his job as a holding player but playing him there definitely curbs his passing ability which is bad. The problem with us is that we are still relying on Scholes for creativity and that is the only reason I feel we need one signing. Also, things will get better once Anto comes around for sure.
@slim – i think Ando was a great asset coming from the bench. I know we all have our opinions but i am satisfied with the result and the shift our players put. A draw is a good result against a dangerous team. It’s still early days in the season so Ando will play the right games.
Defensively we were outstanding..Vidic, Rio and VDS were just effin awesome..Carrick filled in brilliantly when we were down to 10 men..Fletch was defensively good but going forward offered very little..Rafa shouldn have been sent off but we have got away with murder before so justice done..
I worry if rio or vida gets injured we will b fucked the only reason we are unbeaten is the back 4 .In front of them we have no pace or creativity in midfield our midfield is a real concern now .We cant piss about in the summer and sign shite like bebe or obertan we have to sign top quality midfield players we cant have this no value shit any longer .Having said that i am happy with a point 3 yrs ago we would have there 3-0 the way spurs played
Maybe the Fletcher-Ando combo should be given a shot for one game.
@balaji, alright mate, you think the standard in the league has gone down?
Its a fair point, theres only two explanations as to ‘why’ the league is so open this year, but for me its because the qualitys gone up not down. Blackpool are a prime example, and Wolves and WBA and Wigan and Stoke. I don’t think its a coincidence all the top 6 teams (UTD, RentBoys, Shitty, L’arse, Yids, Dippers) have all found it hard against the lower half of the table. Meanwhile Bolton, Sunderland, Newcastle and the like are doing a good job staying put in the middle of the League. The 3-0 against Chelsea wasn’t so much because they are worse then last year, its more because with Gyan and Welbeck up front with Bent Sunderland are a much better side. Two ways to look at it really but I think the other teams are playing ALOT better and with less fear, so the top teams will need to up their game next season to bring back that dominance, but I think the league will stay open like this.
Am fucking staying out of this one. loonie Rooney, Mike Dean and all. There is too much in that article to get yeah angry!
Its not necessary, we are top and heading for our 19th title as far as i can see.
I would sack the manager, you know it makes sense!
@Corea
Early days ? i’m sorry i disagree with you. Sure its a good thing we got a point but its also a bad thing that we get called out and we don’t show up. i’ll repeat my self the level of football we’re showing is not good enough,certainly not something to be excited about. SAF came out during the week and said we should be getting respect so far in the season, i agree with him to an extent. Some of the dribble coming out of “football experts” is comical;however United can and should be playing better than what we’re being served these days
weve got a few tough games coming up, 5 in 15 days or something like that ? goin to need everyone fired up, and maybe that why Ando was rested ? either way, im sure SAF knows what hes doin, been in the job long enuff . . .
@mattbw7
Not sure anyone has asked for anyone to be sold. Although if you ask me how i feel about it – midfield situation; someone will probably have to leave, Our set up in the midfield as far as i’m concerned is not good enough, that my opinion on the matter
@slim – maybe winning the 19th is something we could suffer for ? We are getting the results staying on top and building all the necessary links between players. Fergie is building a new team and i don’t think you can name me a lot of teams the others built through the years and that did took them a lot lesser time to do it. We are spoiled i guess a bit. I know what you are talking about but i guess a bit patience is something some of us are due.
If you play 2 CM, then you go with the in form, no? The problem United have had this season, is that all our CM haven’t played at the top of their game. So, we have to mix and match and hope it comes off. I’m glad Gibbo wasn’t playing today, he would’ve got dogs abuse lol.
I think the “ineptness” in midfeild was deliberate lads, we were set up not to lose, meaning we were set up to regain top, and we did just that. Can’t go gung ho every game, especially when one of your strikers is in poor form and your 37y/o winger is starting back to back matches rather than sitting on the bench. With games in hand over City and Arsenal this point, plus not losing and not conceding, was exactly what we needed. Scholes was nearly ready to come on before that red card. Like Costas said him and Ando will soon be starting in the middle, probably for EUROPE. Its a funny season this year but the Manager is tiding things over very nicely – can’t expect him to send us out guns blazing when we’re under par, esp not at WHL against VDV, Bale, Modric even Crouch, Defoe, etc look at Pavelochenko snatching that goal against Chelsea? these players can PLAY so theres no need to go there and make it easy for them – this was a mature performance from everybody and its put us back on top without conceding. Its a good result lads, not the most exciting or emphatic, but still a good bloody result.
@Paul, I hand it to you mate and I think that is what makes EPL the most exciting league in the world right now. But I am also certain that the standards of the top 3 have definitely gone down and that has together enable lower teams to take the game to United, Chelsea and Arsenal. Good job by them of course and I am taking nothing away from them, but that does not hide the fact that the top 3 haven’t been at the top of their game this season.
Mike Dean is fucking useless. He gets so many big decisions wrong. Rafael has had a great season and was having another good game today until Dean got invoved. Hope this doesn’t hurt the lad as he has so much going for him. Overall draw is all we deserved today – our central midfield options are not good enough and if we some how manage to win the league this year with that midfield we are papering over the cracks.
yeah Redscot sack SAF get in FSW
This is the midfield thats gonna get us our 19..because I’m damn sure SAF has got something up his sleeve in the summer window..I truly believe there is a reason as to why SAF is sticking with this midfield..Our away performances haven been good and they wont get better unless something drastic happens..Its time for fans to accept that fact..this season its all about scrapping wins and getting the job done..if fans cant accept that then you are going to have a hard time watching Utd play..
I’m sure there have been worse Utd teams before and we will eventually come out of this rut as we always have..
Its Terrible that Man u went to spurs for a point, reminded me of Man city against arsenal. As pointed out earlier Carrick was a poor creative midfielder but was excellent the 5th defender, no wonder spurs only had a few attempts on target. Funny how mike dean is a cunt because he was a fair ref and not a man u fan or scared like the rest of them. Raphael new what he was doing, if he didnt want to clip him why run across him, happens so often but so clear what his intention was. Anyway another poor performance and cannot see how you are still top of the league, you wont finish top as you are a poor team and although you work well as a unit not good enough to win it.
@Corea
yes indeed. i hope there isn’t a feeling around the camp that everything is okay and things can’t be any better because they sure as hell can. We are spoiled yes but like the kids of wealthy parents they didn’t ask to be born by wealthy kids. For me its a standard to uphold thats how i see it not being spoiled. No disrespect to other teams in the league but they can sit and bask in glory if the win the league and say whatever they want, We are United and for me United represent the absolute best and must always strive to be the best,even when there is no money or players not willing to join us, whatever the circumstance we must always strive to the be best, never ever am i going to settle for anything less
besides, this seasons been “ugly” as fuck so far,
Just look at Mick McCarthy and Ian Holloway ffs LOL
if ever we really win a title UGLY this will be it. lads.
And I got no problem with that, it shows character, it can’t all be artsy fartsy and step overs all the time, So lets just grind out this 19th, the same one we were cheated out of last year, and move on.
@ Utd4life
Well thats one way of looking at it lol
Rafael shouldn’t have been sent off!
@slim – fair enough, we have our own perceptions. i don’t think today’s game against the top4 side is the game to cry upon. In rest agreed with your emotional part. I have written Sir before and the 06-07 season stands to the reason i am not going to dare to do it again.
@Paul Parker – amen pal.
Link to SAFs post match interview: Our manager is absolute class.
http://www.skysports.com/video/inline/0,26691,16460_6666714,00.html
think sir alex will make a move to bolster the midfield,wouldn’t surprise me if its diarra.fletch was poor again today even his control was poor. ilke costas i was suprised anderson didn’t start he’s been out best midfield player in recent weeks and adds alot more than fletch and carrick.lets take the point and move on.
@ Tony Bee, i guess we will forever be the piss takers.Its not important is it to digest and regurgitate decent performance from the lads.
That squad that the Spuds have assembled cost a fucking fortune in relation to what United have spent in the last 5 years.
We did the job and to me it was mission acomplished, we fight on and look down upon the pretenders for our crown the 19th.
I cant understand why the need to pick through the bones of a good result.
For me we move on and hail our lads that achieved that draw.
I still think its worth thinking about Sir Alex’s head on the chopping block! I mean its such a poor result at the Lane.
I see a hanging ahead.
off to the Pub.
Cmon you Reds.
Balaji exactly mate its a bit of both, top 3 haven’t been on their usual top form your right, but the others further down haven’t helped that by stepping their game up ALOT.
Plus can’t forget the World Cup factor – all the French and English players had a amazingly shitty summer, Drogba’s broken an arm and had Malaria in the last 12 months, theres been the TerryGate and RooneyGate scandals, Liverpools had 3 managers, Valencia had a horrible break, etc. Its all had an impact on the league and apart from Tony’s injury im enjoying how the seasons panning out. Its been interesting.
@slim
Mate, I get your point..we are not putting in vintage Utd performances except for the Blackburn game..But the players are giving their 100%..You gotta understand that its a really long season and sometimes its better to get something rather than nothing..Its a squad game..you cant always play your best 11 all the time..SAF has been there, done that..he has been through every possible situation..he knows our midfield isn the best but he believes that he can get the 19th with the current set of players..Just gotta ride the wave..Its gonna be one hell of a season..
True that this is an utterly ridiculous season but then again which season isn’t? It seems odd that we are still unbeaten, top of the crop and with games in hand on the back of largely tame performances thus far. We should, however, try to draw on the positives. Our defense continues to impress and frustrating Spurs at WHL in their current form and die-hard attacking mentality is certainly something to sing about. We can also take heart in past trends where we usually shift up a couple of gears around about this time of the season. While it is technically possible (albeit absurd- and I wouldn’t put it past this season judging by the look of things) we really should not hope to defend our way to the title! We definitely need to shift up because things wil not get any better and we need to get out of the non-losing mentality and into the winning mentality come the CL and the season run-in.
After doing ALL United’s hard work game in game out for 2+ years – whilst the club kidded itself Hargreaves would recover – Fletch is entitled to be burnt out. He deserves a long break, but I’d rather he didn’t take it in our starting XI.
Thought da Silva gave the referee the option to be honest, as did Cesspool’s offenders against us last week. And I think the furore over Webb influenced Dean’s approach considerably. Redknapp’s said it wasn’t a red though – very civilised of him, unlike our boy for waving an imaginary card at the referee. A revolting gesture I don’t ever want to see United players making.
In the scheme of things the 0-0 we played for (and let’s face it, that’s United all over this season) was a very useful result. What really irritated me was Father Time being out there for 90 minutes when he was off the pace from kick-off (turning it on against the Scouse is not the same as doing it against a good team like Spurs) whilst Hernandez sat on the bench. Seems to me the Mexican is the first of the bargain punts we’re reduced to these days that’s come up game-changing trumps from the get-go, no “investing in youth” period of learning the game required; he’s starting XI quality. So start him.
you guys are slagging rooney saying berbatov should start with hernandez but berbatov never even had a shot off target but rooney did.giggs runs with the ball like a headless chicken then gives it away and waves his arms.he doesn’t go for a ball 1m away from him.brilliant tackle from hernandez.fletchtheman you surprise me, you expect a 20 year old to be perfect.fletcher is the one who is shit.here comes oshea next game
RedScot – Do you part own this pub? lol.
We must look to the Sunderland away and Villa away games when we want to have a go at our team in terms of the quality of football but even these games can be justified by the simple idea that bad days happen. Like someone said the important thing is that we put 100% and we grind out the results even playing poorly. We didn’t give spurs a lot of chances today and it’s a top4 team. A solid display without getting any sort of flair going in attack unfortunately.
You know, when you see first 55-60 minutes you suddenly understand that this is not your day in terms of going forward.
@Utd4life
well said mate, well said. Sure United could win the title this year without reaching the heavenly heights;don’t have a problem with that. What worries me is that we may start to think its all come good and that we’re fine. In some ways i think the players just want to get the 19th title out of the way;who knows maybe they’d relax and show what they’re really made of if we can get the 19th wrapped up this season. Here hoping boys
there no doubt everyone should be satisfied with the draw but when my team get dominated like that i cant honestly say that enjoyed that game am sure if it wasnt for our defence everyone would been moaning about how crap we was especialy in the middle of the park
All ranting and bitching aside, i have to say Vidic in immense and is a monster, easily my man of the match
I’ll take a boring 19th title. The thing to remember, this isn’t a vintage season, nor is it a vintage United side. I doubt in all Liverpool’s title successes, It wasn’t all vintage football. We’ve also got Chelsea’s billions and City’s multi billions to contend with. IMO, our CM is the weakest It’s been in a while, so I don’t expect United to blow teams away anymore. Some might disagree with that, but that’s my opinion.
Goodnight to all.
Corea – I was trying to forget the Sunderland away performance lol. That was bad and we really didn’t have any excuses either.
@slim
yeah, lets just get the 19th..I’m sure SAF will bring in the reinforcements next summer..
And I’m sorry but I have to disagree about the spurs domination part..Of course you would expect spurs to throw the kitchen sink at us when we are down to 10 men but yet they created fuck all..We defended brilliantly so give credit where its due..We might not have a world class midfield but in terms of discipline and commitment this midfield is right up there with the best..
the bale ass kissing made me puke..he is a good player..give him space and he will cut you to ribbons..but any half decent winger would do that so please don call him world class after just 20 games..let him do that for the rest of the season and then maybe, just maybe we could call him that..
rooney is almost like beckham of 2002/03, had a bad injury in march/april, rushed back for the final phew games. Not totaly fit for the world cup, and you are left with a player with no pre season and looking miles off the pace. Rooney was one of the very phew players to take on the spurs defence and test gomez. Carrick Nani and berbatov again show their poor away form, that is when all 11 were on the field.
I am still not sold on carrick, he is a very immoblile midfielder, yes he is good shielding the defence. But much like mascherano he plays to deep for a quality united midfielder. All the great united midfielders can do it all, go box to box, pass allot quicker and more forward and have the ability to score some crackeing goals or just goals. Unless united invest in 2 midfielders, a wide player and fantastic CM we are going to struggle in these big games away from home, and away games in general because we do not seem to have the ability to take games to other teams.
Cora, Hmm, never said I expected Rafael to be perfect. In all truth, I think he was of our best emerging talents. What I was saying is that he needs to cut out these petulant yellows. A full back for United needs to be able to know when a foul is required. The first yellow was unnecessary. There was plenty of support all the way across the field. If it was a professional foul then you understand it and I as a fan of the game would never complain. But this first yellow, and the one against Liverpool the other game, just have to be cut back on. Maybe you are new. I don’t slag players for not being on their game. Not that kind of poster. But I am just concerned that such a talent is consistenly putting the himself in a compromising position when, perhaps, he could use his brain and not give away as many unnecessary fouls. Full credit to the defense thought. Rio, Vida and VDS had top top games today. Don’t think VDS had a difficult save the entire match. Loved the end to end action. Was on the edge of my seat the entire game.
Cheers.
Looked like Rio did his back again early doors? Vida and Rafa were immense. And as usual, Mike Dean is a prick! Why do the premier league continue to appoint this scouse git to our games?
Our lack of creativity is alarming. Carrick and Fletch does not work. And it’s clear if Rooney’s out of form and not settin em up for Berba, he’s clueless.
Utd4life – bale is a fantastic midfielder it is when PPL compare him with the greatest players then he is overrated, he no messi or CR7 but bale is along with nani the best 2 out and out wingers in the world. Bale has 11 goals to his name and that is a great return for a winger that is only 21, he is the best freekicker on a teqnical level I have seen since beckham. So to say he is just a good player when at times he has ripped fullbacks apart is very bitter it seems. He defiantly had rafeal on the ropes at times, he will get better and I would love him in a united shirt but we all know that will never happen
our midfield is our problem, how can a team like united have the worst midfield amongst the big 4. you may say whatever you want for carrick or fletcher but they are not utd stuff. we lack creativity, please do something about it fergie
Any fan who is disappointed that we don’t have a 10 point lead in
the Premiership is always going to be disappointed.
We think it’s the strongest league, we are away to a team in 5th, down to 10 men,
and everyone is apportioning blame. For what? Not scoring 5? Fuck that.
If you want to see your team dominate every week, try Ranger/Celtic or Real/Barca.
We want the 19th, that is all.
Glory to Manchester United.
Agreed Willirednut, about this not being vintage United and about the CM situation. Im happy for both issues to play themselves out as they undoubtly will. Next season with Cleverly, Welbeck, Diouf and maybe Kiko back we’ll look completely different, and if the CM doesn’t sort itself by then Alec will bring in somebody like he always does, hopefully for Smalling/Hernandez money, they’ll link up with Anderson and we’ll be off again.
@FusilliJerry – don’t worry about Rafa the Scrappa waving the card, Rio clipped him round the earhole asap and told him pack it in. The same thing that makes him so good also makes him hotheaded, but he’ll learn.
@Gora, I’d rather see Hernandez with Berb than Rooney at the Mo. True he had those two saved shots but beyond that his link up play was lacking – unlike Berbs. There were quite a few times Rooney either lost the ball as play was building or his final ball wasn’t good enough. Berb was the focal point/main striker so without delivery he’s not gonna get many shots off. Rooney isn’t in form, and Hernandez clearly is, its just calling a spade a spade mate, no room for sentimentals. If somebody is playing shit AND you have somebody else in red hot form, you have to do the obvious. Alec will probably stick with Rooney hoping he clicks back into last seasons form, but I’d rather see Hernandez getting more playing time with Berbatov. Rooney’s lost more than his touch, he’s lost his hunger and desire to chase every ball – we didn’t miss Tevez because Rooney showed the same energy on the pitch, but he hasn’t done it all season – Hernandez meanwhile did it as soon as he came on today. What possible reason is there for starting Rooney ahead of Hernandez when the Mexican has more goals in less games? Still expect Alec to stick with Rooney but I know who I’d rather see.
coomy – the irony is united still have one of the strongest midfields for depth. All it is missing is a top class CM to bring it all together. you have pieces like anderson fletcher anders carrick all reliable but they are not a scholes who can run a midfield and create something out of complete nothing. But chelsea still have the thinest midfield, beyond essien and lampard they have awful backup. Same with spurs, beyonf modric and palacios who do they have that can help them out
@ coomy
you’ve definitely got a point there with regards to midfield – i’d fucking put ando and Rafael in middle! Yeh that’s right – pure samba football with menacing tackles to match!
damn I spelt anderson twice, once I spelt it all wrong.
Paul Parker – hernandes is still better has an impact sub, both berbatov and rooney had average games so they were no lesser than the 2 evils
@Utd4life
I think i can comfortably say i’ve never called Bale a world class player. In fact i really don’t care what he is. all i’m concerned about is United and how we do on the pitch. i did give credit at least to Vidic anyway but you’re right the defence was good and the organisation in midfield was fantastic;maybe thats why i yanking my hair out, we’re so close to becoming the total package the last thing i want is to see us regress
FITB – you think we need a wide player AND a centre mid? We got Welbeck coming back, he plays wide, so does Diouf, not forgetting Valecia and Nani, or Park and Giggs… or Obertan or even Cleverly. We absolutely do not need anymore wide men / attacking wingers / flank men / touchline boys whatever they’re called nowadays. Definetely not they’re coming out our ears. A centre mid maybe, but imo not in Januarys window – win or lose we’ve got enough to give it a good go this season without buying anyone else. Might be wrong but I think Alec will probably wait till summer so he can have a good look at his team, he hasn’t shifted the central midfield in years, mainly due to waiting out the Scholes and Anderson situation, but by this summer he’ll be ready to move im sure.
One thing about Alec you HAVE to respect, he’s no knee jerk Rafa pissing funds up the wall
plain straight and simple we dont have the midfield to play 4-4-2 against top opposition, or best formation is 4-5-1
I also think It’s important to say, that the teams below United haven’t exactly been great to watch either. United have played some poor football at times this season, but we’re up there and still unbeaten. I wouldn’t swap our position for anyone else’s, that’s for blinking sure.
Sometimes, when I get really pessimistic, I say to myself: “The only reason we’re leading the league is because we’re less bad than everybody else.”
And then I think: so what? We’re a team in transition. Have been for a couple of years, and it’s probably gonna take another couple of years before we get there. But when everything clicks, when it falls into place, what a team we’re going be. In the meantime, if this is as bad as it gets — going to Spurs and coming away with a point, winning ugly in other matches, top of the league in the New Year with two games in hand — then I can live with that.
Scott, don’t suppose you have any information on/can confirm that an Everton fan was killed after the derby?
willierednut
Kudos to you for warning us many times this week about Modric. Obviously everyone knows that he is important to Spurs, but I felt we failed to deal with him. Bale, on the other hand was never more than a potential threat.
I know people are saying that this was a big game and that we did well and that’s fair enough but this has been our whole story away from home this season.
Personally I think we someone like Modric and to bring Tom Cleverley back someone who can play and score goals (unlike Gibson)….. However, were unlikely to sign anyone this window or bring back Tom due to his injury so I personally believe Anderson should be a fixture in the team till the end of the season and when he’s not playing then Scholes instead off him. Carrick has lost much of his ability to piss out great passes since Rome 09 but he’s still a good anchorman and works well with Anderson… So I think Anderson and Carrick should be our first choice cm pairing…. with fletcher coming for tough away games.
It still staggers me how where top of the table…and how a team can be so boring yet so exciting at the time.
Paul Parker – unless welbeck and cleverly are given a chance then it is needed.ovbertan I am not sold on. But outstanding CM is desperatly needed, and not just any someone who can go in there and grab hold of a game. We are doing ok, but wilie said the rest are garbage. Diouff no chance he is a CF, if cleverly and welbeck both make it then my fears are blown out of the water especially the wide area’s. Valencia I do worry for, he could become injury prone after this bad injury
MIssed some of the comments. As willie said, I am of the opinion that you play the in form duo. And it’s not just about the midfield. When Berb was misfiring, I said that Kiko or Hernandez should get a run out for a game. It’s been obvious for the last month and a half who’s our in form midfielder. And to not play him in the last two crucial games has been weird imo. We’ve scored just once in these games and that was from the spot. And in fairness, haven’t looked too convincing. So maybe it’s time to try out something different in midfield.
Costas – it frustrates me like 2007/08 when anderson was dropped for scholes when anders was on fire
smartalex – He’s a top player mate, but we coped well with him in the second half I thought. We’ll never get him to United of course, that’s a pipe dream. Bale showed glimpses of class, but Rafa stuck to his task, until the sending off. VDV was disappointing all game, bar that header in the first half and the shot he had in the second half.
what a joke Nani is in bad form he was fukin flying a few weeks ago and Fletcher the problem is you where out played by a better midfield and when Nani who i admit had a quite game went off i sighed a big relief because quality can strike in the last seconds. We missed Tom Huddlestone today and Palacios was the weak link especially when he tried to emulate Hudds shooting and passing. One thing i was not pleased with was Bales performance followed by Rooneys shirt over his bare chest wasthis to polish is car with or a fantasy of his girlfriend who wants to be shagged while Bale wares Rooneys shirt. Fuck of your not getting him its for Davids lad who thinks Roony is American because he trains there
Sack SAF
Sign Sam Allardyce
Root one football – in the air – knock on – goal!
Sorted
Don’t think Macheda is coming back, he’s already gone on the record saying he wants to play there next season too. The whole reason he chose an Italian club when the likes of Birmingham and Everton were lining up to take him til May was to put himself in the Serie A shop window – he’d grown sick of watching Rooney always get picked however badly he played, and knew that 10 minutes action a month wasn’t going to result in his producing the form to stay in the side.
The less critical contributors to these threads will never allow it – “he wasn’t the right quality, Fergie knows what he’s doing, it’s Welbeck that’s the real deal “, etc etc – but I fear here another Pique-type failure to realise the huge potential already on our books.
As for our only needing 1 new central midfielder: I’d say try 4. Whilst Macheda is to my mind the latest one that got away, Anderson “couldn’t score in a brothel” is still altewrnating fair performances with stinkers.
DAVSPURS
In English?
Anyone watching the Barca game on Sky now thats a creative Midfield fucking amazing
Felt back 4 was excellent today Vidic Superb
But the midfield is a worry just hope it doesnt bite us on the arse later on in the run in would worry if could break teams down in tight games
For me, Vidic won you guys the game – absolute class act. Ferdinand was good too, but nowhere near Vidic. Also, I think karma came back and bit Rafael on the behind – it’s a real pet hate of mine, players waving imaginary cards at the ref – save it for the continent, tbh.
Having said that, the ref was pretty shocking in general, I’d have been steaming if that had been one of our players sent off for those tackles.
Was Fletcher even playing?! He and Carrick really didn’t do it for me – Giggs wasn’t great either, and when you add Rooney and Berbatov having off days, a point was a good result for you.
Disappointed Crouch wasn’t substituted – I think he won ONE header against Vidic all game. The guy just cannot jump. Would have liked to see Pav on to try to change things around.
Good game though, enjoyed it a lot, although my fingernails took a bit of a battering the last 15 minutes or so.
We are top of the league.2 games in hand ,just got a draw at a team that’s supposed to be the dogs bollocks ,and we have Paul Scholes back fit happy days
FusilliJerry – do you watch united games, anderson has been fantastic he is getting forward winning the tackles and giving united the legs to dominate games. All united need is 1 CM so get that through your thick head
I’m just happy we got ourselves an amazing back 4. Rafael performances this seasons have been amazing. Today he was unfortunate, and he’s till learning positioning and awareness…but the kid is great.
Glad our Right Back situation has been assessed. We have found G. Neville’s replacement
FITB – dont worry so much mate!
Wide Positions are already covered, we’re just fucked with Valencia’s injury and Park in Asia. Thats just how it goes sometimes but next Season will seem like we’ve spent tens of millions – Welbeck is proven as a wide man and Cleverly has proved what he can do out wide as well as in the middle. Also Diouf doesn’t always play CF for Blackburn they have him out wide too, maybe thats changed under the Chicken men but I’ve seen him in a 4-3-3 playing the wide role and he looked good – pace, strength, passing.
As for central mid, its a bit tricky mate, but I can see Alec messing around with his existing players before he splashes big cash on anybody. Valencia could get a run there for all we know like he does for his country. `but I wouldn’t be surprised if Alec waits till Scholes retires either, that would give Anderson time to really make the midfield his own and give Alec time to see other youngsters in the same position. But don’t worry Pal its like StatesideAussie said this could take years so don’t hold your breath! As long as we win the 19th this year and our boys give it a good go in Europe and for the FA Cup I don’t mind waiting mate. It will be worth it. But next August with Diouf, Welbeck, Clevery and Kiko coming back? If we sold them thats easily 60 Million worth of talent right there! Deep breaths mate deep breaths! Its gonna be alright!
Alright thats it im off – Take it Easy fellas!
@FITB
I wasn’t around ROM at the time, but that was bothering me a lot too. Here’s the deal. Anderson has lacked consistency ever since he came to the club. But when he is on a spell of good form, you might as well take advantage because he’s a difference maker.
@slim
Mate, the rest of my comment wasn’t intended for you..that was in response to another comment..
To all spurs fans..you guys have got a good team but don’t think it will last for long so enjoy it while it lasts..
Anyways we got Brum next..would like to put 4 or 5 past Ben-see-what-you-are-missing-Foster..Think we will see Ando and Scholesy start that one..GGMU!!!
Paul Parker – im not worryed. I am just annoyed to hell that we have got an engine room that is getting shown up against smaller teams. Selling welbeck and cleverly would be a disaster move by fergie, even kiko if he has a blinder with his loan club would be another disaster to sell him, especially if owen is let go. Diouff I could see getting sold and obertan sent onloan if cleverly and welbeck are given proper runs in the team next season, with rooney berbatov and hernandes owning the CF births and kiko coming through there is no room for diouff.
It would have been so much fun if Paul Scholes had come on for the last 20 min
It was never to be…
At the end – how the hell are we going to replace him – because we’ve lived without Keane – we’ve managed without Hargreaves – but Paul Scholes is that one footballer that you cannot live without.
Fergie is the boss – think you see what you want to see – just as you spell as you want to spell – that is, the games where Anderson’s alright, which confirm the conclusion you’ve already reached, whilst being totally blind to recent games where he’s been lousy – West Ham, West Brom, Birmingham – because they don’t fit the picture you so badly need to believe.
If you think 1 single midfield purchase will result in our holding off Mansour and overthrowing Barcelona – I wish.
Vidic was just fantastic and Rafael is just crazy. The way he goes in to 50-50 balls is awesome but should perhaps sometimes take a chill pill since the refs seem to give him bookings quite easily. He is immense going forward and the way he went past 3-4 of their players would have resulted in massive orgies from the commentators had it been Bale. I recon most of you said Nani had a bad game against Stoke, that untill he popped up with the winner in some style. I’m not sure why he was subbed and thought Berba/Rooney should have made way for Ando instead. Crazy to think that we could have nicked it at the end, but I guess that one will be used against Shitty at home.
I can just imagine Scholesy sitting there, ready to come on the pitch, thinking to himself, I’m better than all these mugs lol.
Paul Parker is right and I’m of the opinion if you say something often enough it will definately turn out to be fact.The reason I say this is Rooney is not playing well but because so many people are saying he’ll play better Next week then it must be true he is obviously going to play better Next week.
@willie
Palacios’ shooting is better than Scholes’.
FusilliJerry
You are sadly mistaken if you believe that United are not up to scratch compared to city or Barca
Antonio Valencia and Owen Hargreaves the latter especially have been sorely missed – these are United players and unfortunately shit happens which means because of injuries a team has to be built and played accordingly
United are still there – still working – still trying – that is also admirable –
city are buying themselves out of any trouble
Barca are blessed that they are in a position that their youth has grown up
In some years the likes of Welbeck Pogba Morrison will do exactly the same
It’s a shame you don’t see that
When United came back in 06/07 we notably only signed Carrick
He did the job – whatever has happened to him now maybe one of those life’s little mysteries but their you go shit happens
United have the means to change but it will take time again – just like it did when we gave Rooney and Ronaldo time to grow – so please cut the bullshit – much obliged.
I am pissed with the Way the Season s gone,in Media ways… Spurs are the “Media-Darlings”…remember the geordies in 96…everything on them is Class-As the Sky-pundits told us… No respect for our Team who is still unbeaten…anyway…fuck them all-we re United!!!!!
I do think we will sign a marquee player next summer and this guy might be the missing link..And even if we don’t then I’m fine with it..The solution to our problem wont be found by splurging cash but finding that all important player..I’m sure if Hargo and Valencia were available at the moment then we wouldn’t have had this midfield crisis..We just gotta grind out the 19th..thats it..Doesn’t matter if we play ugly and nick it..
Next season, with likes of Tom, Welbeck and hopefully Kiko back..we won’t have such a problem..
Which ever way we look at it, today’s point was a good one – a result that keeps the team well away from the chasers. Not great football by any means, but a great defensive display particularly from the Footballer of the Year in waiting, Nemanja Vidic. Surely one of Fergie’s most inspirational buys.
During the past few months UTD have been linked – through the press – with some of the Spurs players and today was an opportunity to have a good look at them. Players mentioned were Palacios, Huddleston, Modric, and Bale.
My opinion is forget them. They’re not up to UTD standard. Bale might make it but at the moment he’s definitely over-rated. For £15m the price would be about right – the funny money that Harry wants is ridiculous. If Fergie feels that UTD need a LW then I’d like to see him use Fabio on the left next week v Brom.. After all as a junior and left back Fabio used to score a goal every 3 games. He should be tried there before Fergie resorts to the transfer market.
@MG
Well said Mate..People just don’t get the big picture..SAF’s clearly looking at the long term prospect..And in this rebuilding process they are bound to be a few hiccups but rest assured when the final product comes together it’s gonna be BEAUTIFUL..
Not vintage United, but a bloody solid point. If City, Arsenal or Chelsea were playing Spurs away we’d see that as a good chance for them to lose and us to pull further away from them.
All 3 of those clubs would have seen this as one of those games for us, a potential defeat.
We didn’t lose, despite being down to 10 men (I don’t even want to get started on that)
In fact, we didn’t even look like losing, they managed just 2 shots on target.
Anyone who wouldn’t have taken a point before kick off is deluding themselves, of course we want to win every game but it’s not possible and avoiding defeats in difficult away games like this is good enough.
We keep hearing the young lads will get a chance, but more often than not, there farmed out to some other club. IMO, Cleverley should have been involved in the first team squad this season. Wilshere is younger than Tom, but that hasn’t stopped the whinger from playing him most weeks in the premiership. @Costas His shooting was poor, just like old John Jo last week, for the dippers.
Wierd. Usually I agree with you Scott, but this post it both more positive and negative about play today. Berba had some neat flicks, but the midfield never really stamped control. The wingbacks had a rough day initially and I thought Raphael looked his age in the first half. The red card was unquestionably a result of the shit Dean had to take the past week, but Raphael wasn’t a brilliant martyr in defense. He was though great as usually pushing forward and provided some much needed width.
Fletcher does not get enough opprobrium in your post either. Rooney provided the majority of our decent shots on goal. He doesnt have the same gleam to his play any more, but he looked decent enough.
Carrick… Carrick t.t neither much in the way of great passing or shutting down the opposition.
Odd sentiment after the game. I think the Red card might have made some of us a touch more defensive than we would be normally assessing this kind of game. We didn’t look as hungry as Tottenham for the majority of the game. Meh. It happens.
I see even good old ‘Arry Redknapp says Rafae;s red card was harsh. According to the Telegraph, ‘Arry said: “He was just running and he has clipped Benoît’s heels. He has not broken his stride and stuck a leg out, saying ‘I’ll trip him’. He was trying to get out of the way.” Wonder if that will shut his dickhead supporters up.
I would like to see SAF try the ‘Arry experiment i.e., play Fabio on the wing..it could just work..The boy needs games if he is to come to the level of his Bro Rafael..
willirednut
I agree on TC he should have been at OT – I think he’s more than capable – if anything being around Scholesy would have done him the world of good – no other better benchmark than the master himself
Rafa has seen 2 unfortunate and harsh reds in his career at the age of 20. I remember a similar thing happening to Fletch at VIlla Park in 04 and at the Riverside in 05. I like it when our youngsters are so commited to the cause.
@willie
Shelby is a legend, lol.
I watched the ‘carrington revealed’ videos, intriguing. Especially the analysis centre, which we saw from the outside only. Rio called them ‘the brains trust’ and said ‘that’s where the magic happens”. All very exciting I tell you! Anyway, it is reasonable to assume that our brains trust are making the difference at the moment. Our performance (and away results) are not as we’d like, but our position is perfect, top of the league etc etc.
I believe that our ‘plan’ was always to bring Anderson on for the last 20 minutes to get the win. Unfortunately we lost raphael, which changed our priorities. I don’t know why we didn’t just start with Anderson, that is the Brains secret plan.
an excerpt from the SAF interview linked by FletchTHEMAN:
“I thought our defenders were particularly good you know. I think that when we brought Anderson on he’s attacked the back four 4 times, maybe could’ve shot or had a better pass but I think a draw was a fair result.”
Alright, I’ll continue my idiocy by reminding you that Vidic the Red Reigns!
http://www.blog.joelx.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/05/tallest-cow-record.gif
Yep, I also think Tom C should have stayed with us this year. And Utd4Life — I agree we could try Fabio on the wing, especially with Tony V out.
Seriously…fletcher has got to be flogged for his display today…he was always not alert enough..and always a second late to the ball…hesitant to go in for tackles…our midfield of carrick and fletch..just does not work in games like this. We should’ve started ando and maybe carrick..coz scholesy was just back after a long lay off..so might be rusty…carrick was also offtoday..i have said this time and time again…our midfield is the weakest link..and have nearly cost us on so many occasions..to me..fletch has just gone down..from last season..!! period!! he needs to buck up…more action then just talk..is what he needs to do!!
The other thing i noticed today…and for the last few games too..is that some of our players, in a game of this magnitude..tend to be a little too casual when the opponents are pressing and hurrying you…seriously..look at the last opportunity of the game that came our way after some good work by chicha…and iigsy if i;m not mistaken…and rooney just went for it very casually…there were so many moments in the game..when our players were just a tad too casual…it really made my blood boil…why is there no urgency from our players..when the opposition is taking the game to us..if they can do that..why can’t we step up our game and show them who is the boss??….we are man utd…our players are supposed to be the creme of the crop…technically and ability wise…we are known for determination..so why the fucking casual display at times..just beats me…
our defence was top notch..Vidic was a rock for us…rio’s calmness and cool defending was superb…rafa and pat..was fantastic….my own personal view is that the strikers can’t be blamed for not really performing..coz strikers won’t really perform if the midfield just does not create…there was no vision..or creativity in our midfield..let alone ball control…fletch was awful…
Frustrating thing about Fletcher and Carrick is that we all know they can play better but they haven’t had the best of seasons. I’ve never seen Fletcher dwindle on the ball for so long completely unaware with whats going on around him. He’s being hustled the way he was doing it to people the last 2 seasons and I’m not going to mince my words it riles me because it can be completely avoided with great ease. There were times today where it actually seemed he wanted to give the ball away. Carrick seems to have changed roles now and just sits in front of the back four and doesn’t play those killer balls as often. Also for some reason in the vast majority of the games this season seems to play a lot better 2nd half than he does the 1st and I can’t understand why
A lot of people putting high hopes on Cleverly he hasn’t pulled on the red shirt yet and its likely theres going to be a bedding in period when if he finally does to get used to how Carrick, Fletcher, Scholes and Ando play. Its all well and good on the training ground but we all know game time will be different and what if he sinks like Foster. He does need the chance though and I’m bemused as to why he’s not even played a league cup game when we’ve had him in the past.
That’s the point though, we don’t know if he can cut it at the top level, until we actually see him in the first team. I’m not saying play him every game, but if wilshere, who’s younger than tom by a few years, is playing every week, then Cleverley should be involved in the squad at least.
offtopic
this has to do with the merseyside derby today, i had 3 mates over for the match and they rang me from a pub in liverpool telling me that a fan had ben stabbed to death after the game, if its true its an absoulute travesity that someone has to lose their life over a simple game, no doubt alcohol fulled rage of somesort…
on topic
great point for united and when are we going to hit our best form lol, this time last year we beat the arse and that started us on a great run, im just hoping and praying we kick into gear very soon….on that note i thought we defended brillianlty today esp our captain vidic he was imense. ONE LOVE
United have been dreadful to watch for quite a while now. Good European teams will make United look like Wimbledon. Wazza is a dickhead – I hope him and Owen are gone by the end of the summer, can’t support either of them.
As for this site, it’s turned into a hate filled apologists arena dominated by a handful of bores. So long nobjockeys!
Who’s the virgin? ^
FusilliJerry – go support shitty then idiot, and barcelona do not play in our league so jog on. United’s bulk of their squad is set, you put a xavi or a keane in his prime united go from a good side to a great side again. you have upfront 3 balanced strikers in rooney berbatov and hernandes, anderson and fletcher when they are on form are a handfull for any midfield. out wide in nani you one of the best wide players in the world. Say welbeck and cleverly return and are given a chance and they take it you have 2 more sources of goals and midfield spots taken. All united are missing is a outstanding midfielder, and oh yea 2006/07 we signed one midfielder and won the title so there is your retarded view destroyed. I guarentee you were one of those guys in the summer 2006 who said we are finished. with the special one in charge and romans millions we are DOOOOMED. You know I do not give 2 shits how its spelt
His boyfriend called him back, so we will never know.
GaydanBarai – your post is has gay has your name, piss off and get off ROM
Gaydan
You say we angrily explain controversy in a boring way. Powerful.
…and, they are so long, not surprised you were looking.
fergie is the boss
5 O’s in DOOOOOMED
Thought I remembered, Goat said it best.
MAY 13, 2010 AT 13:30
GoatinaUnitedShirt says:
@GayDanBarai
You are describing yourself good man – your describing civilisation.
You are describing the parasite that is you, a parasite to your parents. For an ill thought out knee trembler behind the bins at Fonzies rock and roll night club your parents have been sponging out the redies in a one sided deal ever since. Boo to your socialist moraly judgemental attitude and look in the mirror.
Some light relief from the banality that is.
Adrian Mutu was seen at The Lane on Sunday.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/jpinlac/4011553975/lightbox/
i think the problem is clear for everyone to see. OUR MIDFIELD. our defence is superb. our strike force would be better than what they are now if we had a midfield who could create things for us. how can you play two defensive minded midfielders in the midfield and expect us to beat spurs? never gonna happen. scholes and Anderson should play in the midfield permanently. ( carrick could come in at times) fletch needs a trip to oregon for rehabilitation. he was shocking today.
Spot on Scott! A bloody ridiculous season!!
Carrick & fletcher are similar. While the former is a cover for the defence, fletcher is the bundle of energy. But both of them offer nothing offensively. It is therefore harsh to criticize our forwards who didnt get any service whatsoever
I had a major take away from the game, and that was how much more classy Spurs is than the other 3 (Ch/Ar/MC). They didn’t play rough and start flying into tackles, they extend a hand to our players to help them up from the pitch when they’re down after a challenge or a tackle, and they sure didn’t crowd the ref at every single opportunity to get him to award cards against our players.
There appeared to be a lot of respect between the two sets of players on the pitch, and neither side got over-zealous in their tackles, except Rafael dS. Thankfully he didn’t cost us the game.
But both teams looked like they were happy to play a draw and sneak in a win – Spurs prodding left/right/centre and hoping our defence slipped up, while we were hoping to take them on the break.
Our attacking players looked… sluggish and devoid of ideas.
I’ll take that point and run,we played pretty poorly and our passing,again,was shite!
Carrick needs to be sent out to pasture,he is not a United player.
Good point. I really respect Spurs though. They’ve got a good side, good players. Vidic is a total ROCK. Magnificent defender. He has to win defender of the year,seriously man. Apart from him, Rafael had a great game i thought. His dismissal against bayern was daft on his part, but it was the stupid ref fault this time. He’s a terrific RB.
I’d disagree about Rooney though. I thought he did better today, although some of his first touches were poor and passing still a little off. He did force a few good stops for gomez. I’ve read that we were offensively poor. I don’t think so. We have to understand that we’re playing a spurs side that is of top 4 quality and in these sort of games, chances don’t come thick and fast. I thought we had a good balance, but defensively we were immense.
My key takeaway from the game was that till we get our midfield colossus, and till the real Wayne Rooney stands up, we should go 4-5-1 for games like these which are going to be fast, furious, and the opposition has a fair bit of skill and flair. I would still go 4-4-2 against the likes of Chelsea, but against Arse, Spurs or Barca (not saying Arse are as good as Barca), maybe 4-5-1 would be better? Ando instead of Rooney for the full 90 might have meant a different game yesterday. And let;s please not start another Berba(de)bate out of this.
@YorYor: Agreed. I have far more liking and respect for Spurs than Arse or Cheski….they play without fear, mix up skill and strength, and usually dont seem to whinge or dive a lot. Still got some despicable/laughable characters like the crouching lamp-post & big-ball gallas, but generally, I like their lot, not least bcos they never win against us!!!
Yes, Rooney was average yesterday to be honest. Btu maybe we just forget the fact that he missed a couple of games when his game started to click and it should have made the difference.
I think Fergie knows what he is doing. Remember Arshavin and his heroics at Anfield and look at him now. I know Fergie has his soft spots and i won’t argue against it but i still think Hernandez should be kept as an impact sub and who knows maybe his second season will turn out to be even better.
As for Rooney not chasing balls and players i think it’s not right. He just wasn’t 100% himself yesterday, the reason for this i dunno exactly. Our offensive play just didn’t click yesterday and that’s all.
I am happy with a point.I predicted to be 0-0 draw when i saw fletch-carrick combo.But overall our performance was ok.I bet if it waas chelski or arsenal they would have lost.
Rafael’s red was very harsh butwe also get some favour from the refs so justice done but have to say rafael is a class player.Should improve his defending though.
After yesterdays game i have a bit respect for spurs team.They showed the character and i loved that.
To conclude i will say take a bow vidic and rio especially vida the captian.
UNITED FOR #19 WILL HAPPEN THIS SEASON.
B.E.L.I.E.V.E
At the 3/4 mark I thought we were looking good to nick a win. Of course that professional twit Mike Dean had to have a say. After that sending off I think we did very well to grab a point. Normally this season when we have come away with a draw it has felt as if we had lost 2pts but this time it felt as if we had won 1pt.
Our midfield though, as usual (and we been saying this way to often) was just beyond rubbish in an offensive sense.
Carrick was okay with his covering duties but yet again he seems incapable or unwilling to play a positive pass. It pisses me off deeply ‘coz I know he has buckets of ability in that area.
Fletcher has developed a habit of getting caught in possesion and some of his passing was sloppy. He is a shadow of the player he was last season.
I know you can’t expect a player to start every game but surely Anderson who has shown his intent this season to play positively and drive forward would have been a better option in midfield.
When I saw the midfield we were starting with I just knew that our forwards were going to be lacking service.
Anyway I am happy that we are still on course for number 19. I just wish our boys would start putting on performances worthy of a Manchester United team. Honestly the class of 2011 reminds me of the old style boring, boring Arsenal.
@KingOfStretfordEnd – yeah. we all have different perceptions.
What Fergie said about our offensive play:
“We had one or two good opportunities at times when we got to the last third of the field but we just didn’t quite have the cutting edge.”
Some last balls from Giggs, Rooney were not good enough in the final third. Maybe the nerve of the game was at fault. We were more preoccupied with keeping our goal intact, subconsciously or because of the pre-match adjustments i dunno.
@smartalex
Damn man, you are keeping files on all of us, lol? Maybe you were part of Stazi too.
I didn’t even know Gaydar had been here before.
this was awfoul yesterday. I can’t believe we’re top of the table. with this display, I just can’t see us win the trophy at the end of the year. we are more than lucky to be at the top. I don’t care about being unbeaten: we should start to win matches away from our home, and more important, start to play some football, because this is not gonna be enough.
@ Ash
“But overall our performance was ok.”
was it? then, not being effective all the way along is ‘OK’ for you. we never really managed to keep possession on the ball. then, when we did, we just couldn’t bring it forward. the players weren’t moving as a team, but as individuals. there were many technical errors as well but it was so obvious that nothing was built up yesterday. we started with long balls in the 5th minute…
Couple of points to make:
1. United really need to buck up their away form – I know this was one of the tougher away games we’ve had this season, but we didn’t ever really look like scoring and two wins away from home is an absolutely shoddy record. Yes, once again “we didn’t lose” – but it’s better to lose half your games and win half your games than draw them all.
2. Scott, when has Michael Carrick ever really been our creative one? He’s always billed as that, but even in his best years for us Scholesy was the creative one. Only once has he had more than 3 assists in a season (with an impressive 8 in 09).
3. There seems to be a worrying trend growing amongst our fans, and it’s one we’ve seen before – making Fletcher a scapegoat. Maybe the lad isn’t playing as well as he did last season (when he was one of our top 3 players IMO), but cut him a bit of slack – the whole team in general has looked pretty shit most of the time. Fletch has played some good football and showed some real precise passing that while Scholes is missing, no one else has provided.
Also on the Fletcher point it should be noted that he put in an important shift at right-back when he had to and cleaned up well in the box a few times.
@gio
Our performance yesterday compared to many games we have played this season was ok.We started the game decently.Yeah spurs were better but we were not awful.
You know why i wont say this as a awful performance because we were more awful and pathetic in many other games.Villa away,sunderland away even stoke away,wolves home etc we were more awful.We were never great but comparatively we were not that bad.
But yeah our midfield is very poor and Sir alex need to do something about our midfield
United paly has become slow, boring, at times clueless and predictable.
Thankfully other teams have dropped a level or two as well and we somehow are at the top of the league.
United of a few seasons ago would have had the title of this truly ridiculous season wrapped up by now!!
You know the more annoying part is that we are not really giving the youngsters chance to play.Helll even now we are depending on giggs.I would be happy if the likes of bebe and obertan play and then we play like this.So atleast the youngsters would be given some chance.
Apart from rafael there has been no positives for us this season so far.
Fletch’s best spell yesterday did come when he switched to right back. Don’t know to be honest. denton davey made a good post at the other thread about Fletch being caught up between two minds nowdays and it has seemed that way the entire season. He is a box to box midfielder, but right now, he is not playing in front of the back 4 and he is not making late runs in the box either. I don’t say he should be benched as punishment or anything, but we have a big squad and we should be utilizing it appropriately. On current form, it’s a shame Anderson isn’t starting.
By the way, if Wes is fit, I really hope we don’t see Gary Nev, Fabio or Fletch deputise for Rafa next week.
gio @ 8:43
Actually I do see us winning the EPL this year. To be honest this years EPL has been mediocre.
Chelsea started well but thanx to them for weakening their squad, injuries to key players and an owner who just can’t leave what works alone they have contrived to derail themselves.
Arsenal can play some pretty football but they are held back by a manager (who is a good manager) who keeps failing to fix up their suspect defence or invest in a world class keeper.
Manchester City may have spent well over the odds on players but our squad is still stronger than theirs. Plus having a manager who goes out looking for draws at home against his nearest rivals is a bit of a handicap.
Spurs may be easy on the eye but they give away too many goals to be a real contender.
We have the strongest defence in Europe and unless we have an injury crisis that is all we should need this season to see us home.
we need PARk….the flow of this game is similar to the arse game at OT..the difference is Park header…
No one gave a us a chance.
Everyone wanted us to lose.
And in the end ,the team showed resillience,always certain players standing out and we had the luck with us.
Fergie has sorted out the defence,goalkeeping to an extend,now for midfield and the fowards.
Fletch is better now but still way off his true levels.
Patience ,belief and how we use this week on top of last week ,having time to rest and get players back in before it gets busy again.
@walk in the park
We’ve missed him. No doubt about it in my mind.
I know you cant tell a teenager that hes wrong or they’ll never admit it let alone listen to you but you younger fans out there have to realise that there are fans on here that have been watching the game all their lives. If there are 30,40, 50 year old on here talking football day in and day out then they should be listened too. They are the ones that DIDNT give up on the game and liked the wife. DIDNT lose interest and hold down a career driving up and down the M5 selling Dysons to make Mr Slackbottom rich so his permatanned shriveled up old cunt of a wife can spend another sodding week in Corfu. The fan that DIDNT say of course your mother can stay and of course she can watch Three Weddings and a Funeral on SkyPlus Gold Shite+ whilst the match is on. On here we have the decent fan who knows what they are talking about. The one that watches the match WITH Beer, the one that wipes his arse on his wifes chin whilst shes sleeping, the one that takes the rubbish out cant be arsed to go to the bin but chucks it over into the neighbours garden only to watch his burly knuckled neighbour come round and punch his wifes head in after telling him it was her and that shes fed up with his dog shitting in our garden.
Hes (sometimes she (lol)) should be listened to when he says everythings ok, we played ok, keeps things in perspective and reminds you that we played Spurs away and other so called top teams didnt fair as well as we did. If anything I thought we were composed, played smartly and if you took the pace of tottenham away they have 11 palacious’, not that good really. If it wasnt all the oooos and aaaahs of the mockneys then they would be half the team. We did well.
2 games now and twice Rafael has made the next thing since sliced bread Bale look average, yesterday limiting him to one cross all match. Our Rafael impresses me more every time I watch him, showed exceptional skills going forward too.
@ cedars
Very good point regards young Rafa – with just a little more composure those forward rampages could really be a potent threat.
Have to say I was overall disappointed with yesterdays performance – but when assessing who we were playing and their capabilities this season I suppose reducing them to just 2 half chances shows a very good defensive display but my major concern was the service up front and the fact that Berbs and Rooney didnt look like they had been introduced to each other let alone played together!
All that said – a quick look at the stats shows we have taken more points in the last 6 games than any other team so whilst not blowing anyone away or playing eye catching stuff we must remain reasonably content.
OUR MIDFIELD IS SHIT
BigPhil – Spot on about Fletcher. Someone said further up he should be sold. Fucking prick. He has been immense for 2 or 3 seasons has a bad couple of months and everyone is on his case.
shit tactics again. Fletch and carrick dont work together especially as fletch looks poor at the moment. Was poor last weekend vs Liverpool too. Should have been a 4-5-1 with Anderson, Scholes and Carrick in the middle and Rooney up front on his own. It largely was the preferred formation away from home last season. Neither Carrick nor Fletch can keep the ball, hence Scholes is essential. He dominated Spurs at WHL last season and that despite us playing a 4-4-2.
Modric was immense for Spurs. Wish he played for us. bale and VDV get all the plaudits but he is a top player
jay – Its exactly the same midfield that won us three titles and got us to two European Cup Finals. Yeah we arent playing swashbuckling football but as Arry said we are very very hard to beat and that will stand us in good stead in Europe. Anyway Paul is back now to boss the tricky games.
Goat – Spot on fella.
Ps good to see Baby Ronaldo and his cronies bitching yesterday when struggling to a draw with the la liga’s bottom club.
@Goat: Yeah, ok…generally get your drift, though you must understand that you are at risk of being “accolyzed” with that post LOL
Somebody said that this would probably be our most difficult prem match of the season, and I would tend to agree. I wont go overboard with criticicim of yesterday’s performance, though there were obvious areas for improvement.
Having said that, I would contest the claim that “everything’s ok. Everything’s not ok by the United standards defined over the last 20 years (and I apologise for the fact that I am not 40+ old). Everything’s not ok by European standards. Just because Chelsea have regressed, Arsenal have made snail-ish progress, and Liverpool arent even worth talking about now, Bayern, Barca, Real, Inter (now that they have lost the fsw) grow stronger everyday. I am not saying we need a wholesale revamp, I can see the bigger picture of what’s developing in the academy, but you have to admit there are legitimate doubts about our ability to take on the best in Europe, or to match the best United seen over the last decade or so. We need minor tweaks, as the gaffer has pointed out, but when those will we see those tweaks??? Or are we (the fans) and the club even thinking of the same tweaks???
aig – Hello mate. Yeah Scholes did dominate last year till he got sent off!
Jeet – Did you see Madrid last night? They are well beatable. Take Alonso and Ronnie out and they are fucking awful.
@King Eric : Really? I dont follow La Liga very regularly, but when I see that front three of Ronaldo, Ozil and DiMaria, it does look great. I hope you are right:)
Jeet
fergie just wants to win the league this season. i am sure we will see 5-6 players leave in the summer and 2-3 arrivals. by exits i mean Wes, hargo, neville and some utility players.
They are the utility players lol.
Every team in the top 6 has a better midfield than us. Our midfield is completely appalling we need a creative midfielder and we need one desperately. I still don’t understand why SAF does not play Berbatov and Hernandez up front with Rooney behind them, he is not scoring right now so use him as playmaker which he is excellent at doing. It must be a bit frustrating for Hernandez who has done well for us to be benched for someone who is not scoring I hope he doesn’t do a Macheda. If we don’t win the title it will be because of our midfield.
Jeet – Di Maria is inconsistent . Ronnie is their main man. Ozil lasts about 80 minutes and is fucked. Khedira is poor and their back 4 are shite in the main. As I say they almost lost to the bottom club. Watched most of their games and as I say they are beatable. We both know Rafa , Vida, Rio andPat are more than capable of dealing with those three.
@AIG: Ok, then. I hope to hell (being a devil, we cant hope to heaven, can we?!) Wes stays, and so does O’Shea…simply because of their versatility. If both of them go, you need to buy a CM, RB and LB…that’s crazy.
The other thing I worry about is how the fuck are we going to blood our youngssters like Obertan, Cleverly, Wellbeck, Diouf and the reserves? Loaning is a double edged sword – they may discover their potential, and never come back. It’s actually a great problem to have because it means we got a lot of youth talent, but I guess I am one greedy bastard and want it all!
King Eric
Actually 2 shockers in La piss poor Liga yesterday , one that Real failed to win and second Messi did not score ! lol
aig – Spoke to Fergie have you and he s told you he just wants the league? You seriously think he doesn’t wnat Europe? Its a cup competition. Anything can happen . Don’t underestimate our lads in Europe. As we know they know how to get a two legged tie won.
jay – How many of those top six midfields jave bossed ours this season?
City? No
Arsenal? Definately No
Rentboys? – Only played at Wembley and Scholes and Carrick bossed them
Spurs – Take out Modric and No
Don’t even know the other two teams as I don’t follow the league THAT low down.
to be specific i think Wes, Neville, Owen , Hargo, VDS are the ones who will leave. Cleverley and Welbeck will be back. SAF will buy a few midfielders.
Cedars – Hello mate. Yeah true . He didn’t.
To tell we are lucky that Chelsea started to have a very bad spell because if they had won most of their games they would probably be ten points ahead of us. United really need to take advantage of the fact that our rival are faltering or else they will soon catch up with us. It is not guaranteed that we will win our games in hand.
“A few midfielders” How can he accomodate them all? He will buy One in my opinion.
king eric
will be happy with the league. anything else is a bonus. we can win but takes some luck to win the competitions.
i mean win the cup competitions
jay – Yeah but ya cannot say that . Its like saying if United hadn’t dropped silly points at Fulham, Everton and Bolton we would be 12 clear. Or if Arsenal has beat us they would be infront. We Didn’t, they didn’t and Chelsea didnt The league does not lie.
aig – Oh I agree mate.
Cleverley should have been brought back, to cope with the loss of Park. Seeing Rooney out on the wing, does my head in. He’ll never be a winger in a million years. Now do fans see the importance Park? How much we miss his energy and his tracking back. If Danny comes back next season, he might be playing on the wing, so I don’t know were that leaves Obertan, with Valencia coming back from injury as well.
king eric
or if you are looking at the way Bayern munich got to the finals last season, you need more luck and need to play less football
morning firstly as some on here know my biggest pet peeve and one of the main problems with the game today imo is the system of refs.giving one guy control to influence games is wrong,whether a subconscious dislike for teams or certain players,incompetence,or money problems that could lead to fixing.week after week game after game some team is getting fucked over by bad refs and it has to stop.i’d like to see a list of refs and a list of teams to see if bad calls are consistent against the same teams.it cost us the fucking prem last year and rafael’s sending off against bayern was a fucking joke it should have been a foul on him,him getting sent off was a huge turning point in the game.how many bad decisions went against utd after sir alex called the ref fat it seemed to me lots.
looking through the comments see we have the barca lovers again,i’m fucking sick of this, different league,different competition half the time it looks like exhibition,i’d like to see how great that midfield would be playing in cold weather on heavy pitchs getting the shit kicked out of them by the likes of stoke etc.what i get really pissed about these fuckers had to take a bank loan out to pay wages yet their always being linked with big money signings.today barca are going to make a summer move for rafael,fabregas looks like he’ll be going in the summer.this fucking team is pretty well bankrupt and yet have millions each year to spend on players.seems to me the fair rules are going to affect barca and real more than anyone
@King Eric and Jay: That’s exactly the pt. – I want us to stop comparing ourselves with Chelsea and Arsenal. We know their problems, lets fuck them and forget them – end of. This is a unique opportunity for us to widen, and I mean really widen the gap in england and take the europe bull by the horns – and I am getting impatient!
on the hargo front read yesterday could be put on pay as you play contract
@wayne: Trust me, I’m not a barca fan, and I hate their ability to pick up players left, right and center. Their financial model makes me want to puke too. But, the fact is, that irrespective of which league they play in, you have to admit that they have been more succesful in europe than us over the last couple of years. If I were a neutral and somebody held a gun to my head and asked me to put a fiver on either us or barca for the CL, I would chose barca (but then I am not a neutral, so – he he he). Rome still hurts, mate, and I want our revenge -hot or cold, I dont effing care. I guess you and I are on the same page – I want us to put out this barca lovefest, and put it out in style.
Surprise fucking surprise……
Andy Townsend reckons that our Rafael was ‘stupid’ with his second challenge and deserved to go… Andy the idiot fucking expert thinks that Rafael could have avoided the challenge and he had every intention of taking the player………
Gets better and better hey?
You reading this King Eric?
I don’t think Barcelona have been more successful than us in the Champions League, we have won and got to the final the next season and we were a goal away from the semi final last season. I think United has done quite well in Europe. Whether we can do it this year is another thing. People keep going on about how beautiful and how deadly Barcelona are, yes they have done extremely well in La Liga but they were finding it difficult early on in the Champions League, in fact Real Madrid who had harder opposition were doing better that than Barcelona. Barcelona can be dismantled very easily which is pace and power, they cannot deal with pace and only know how to play one way. If you get at them straight away with pace and unsettle them, and score a couple of goals early on they resort to diving and kicking and I have seen this happen when they are not getting their own way. We just don’t see it a lot because they tend to win most of the time.
I love Rafael he is one of our best youngsters along with Hernandez, I still remember when he had Ribery in his pocket and the idiot got him sent off because he could not deal with him. But he does need to curb his rash tackling and his temper or else that will land him in more trouble than he needs but I guess he will learn as he matures.
Don’t think we should be looking at Chelsea and Arsenal, and comparing ourselves with them. We got our own problems to think about, like passing to players, with the same colour of shirt. Too many aimless balls yesterday, from Rooney, Giggs, Carrick and Fletcher. The build up of play, is far too slow, It’s bordering on turgid at times. I accept we’ve changed our style, but I don’t think It’s necessarily a good thing.
@Jeet thats my point though is barca played in the prem don’t think they would be the greatest team ever or whatever fucking label gets given them it would become a grind and wear them out,think most of them would have a problem dealing with the pace,toughness and weather week after week.
thats another thing that really pisses me off the spanish goverment gives foriegn players tax breaks think its 25%,british jacked the tax rate to 50%,don’t know if clubs in england absorb some of that but it puts us behind the 8 ball trying to compete for players,let alone the weather difference.
i think these fair play rules is going to be a big advantage to utd,teams like barca,chelsea,city are in trouble don’t know how it works for real.
@Willie and jay: both of you hit the nail on the head – Barca can be beaten with pace and direct play, and willie pointed out that this is exactly what we lack in our buildup.
Watching yeaterday play unitred i feel we could do well in europe also with this defense.
One more thing i hope we dont see a 4-4-2 with a midfield combo of fletcher and carrick.Next season we willl see many changes in midfield.I wont be surprised if fergie decides to buy 2 mid fielders and i mean a quality mf players.You know what works in our favor for #19 is the fact that other clubs dont have the balls to win it.Arsenal will do a arsenal in march like they do every season and chelsea (wow they call them self champions) have given up their hope of winning the tittle.Cutys main aim is to finish in top 4 so they wont win it and spurs will be confused of where to concentrate whether in Europe or in league.
So i bet we will win the league even with this poor midfield.But really we have become a boring team to watch this season.
I think to be fair also, 2 seasons ago, we were boring to watch, even with Ronaldo in the team.
@Ash: I am not sure about whether we will do well in Europe, but I think yesterday’s match showed us what’s our best midfield in Europe. To me its Park-Scholes-Carrick-Ando-Nani. Damned if I know who should be the frontman – on current form, I would actually say Berba over Rooney
@willierednut – Nail on the head, United were a shadow of their 06/08 selves in 08/09, despite winning the league. To be honest I was more impressed with our play in 2009-10 than this season or 08/09.
Sir Alex’s Slender Squad Selection
http://www.theunitedreligion.com/2011/01/sir-alexs-slender-squad-selection.html
aig – Re Bayern . Yeah very true mate!
Cedars – Why won’t Townsend the medaless cunt fuck off and die? Big nosed tosser.
More sickening was seeing Mick fat quinn punching the air on skysports when the dippers went a goal up.
@willie
Yup. 08-09 was the one season where we scored less away goals on average than we have this year. But, we won 12 away games. I’ll be happy if we win 6 in total given some of the away games we have left.
Fact vs Theory (As per the experts)
We have been poor this season vs We have been poor this season
Lucky not to lose vs Lucky not to lose
Weakest squad in the top 4 vs weakest squad in the top 4
Spurs have the best squad vs Spurs have the best squad
Arsenal play the game vs Arsenal play the game
Rafael is average vs Rafael is Average
How much do know I am a mere mortal compared to Andy T and Paul Walsh
Stare at my hunchback if you will, but I’ve got that winning feeling again.
Sir Alex is going to win this year. What makes this achievement so special, is that we’re not quite ready. SAF believes that 3 to 4 years at the top is the most you can expect from a team. We had our 3 (nearly 4) years, and now it looks like we’re already back to silverware winning ways. And our next team isn’t quite ready yet.
@ (thatmantheyquietlycallcostasbecauseitsreallyacodeforcostasticiakebabelos)
..—.-…-..-.-….—.-.-.–..
=-…,.-,.=,-…..=,,.,.,.-..,.,==. willierednut.=–.-.–===.
+-”;…Cedars..=-=..,
…,===–==….RoM..–..,.MG…’..etc,etc…
Delete after reading.
Rafael was amazing yesterday. One of our better attacking players, some of his dribbling was a real sight for sore eyes.
Once again he has been punished by incompetent refereeing, but that should not over shadow just how good he was.
He’s really coming on leaps and bounds. As a defender you’re always going to be liable to give away the odd free kick, or pick up some cards along the way, especially given Rafael’s energetic approach to the game. Keep it up lad, you have a bright future i think.
My eyes, my eyes! lol. Away form is a concern, but if we win the league, with say only, 4/5 away wins, don’t think anyone will be unhappy. I wonder who’s won the league with the least away wins? Any ideas Costas? It is a tough one mate.
Troy
I can see us too winning the league, but we really need to improve. The results are OK, most of the time but our display is below par. we’ve been lucky, we’ve been unlucky too, but generally, I think we can be satisfied with the amounts of points we have. yeah, we threw it away at Fulham, Everton and Birmingham, but also climbed back from 0-2 against Villa, equalised 2 times against Bolton, won in the last minutes against Wolves. so we can not say we are unlucky to draw many our games, that’s what I wanted to say.
winning the league will be difficult but it’s going to be a close one.
Ash @ 12:47: “I wont be surprised if fergie decides to buy 2 mid fielders and i mean a quality mf players.”
Gotta disagree with that statement – I would be astonished if SAF bought TWO midfielders. One quality addition is quite likely but with Pogba and Tunnicliffe (trusting King Eric on this), his investment in youth will start to show itself in the near future.
Ash @
maybe “awful” is an overreaction, OK, but honestly, yesterday we were just so hopeless in midfield. I just don’t understand why don’t we strengthen that area. an MC and a winger would both be great additions to the squad. with a decent, creative midfielder and a fast winger this league would be an easy one to win…
and just one qestion: what happened to our wonder midfielder, Fletcher? he was worse than ever yesterday. technical errors, bad positioning, given away balls… oh my god. I hope he can leave this poor form behind. now we need a good Carrick and Scholes more than ever.
@gio – we already have an MC – Alan Keegan, I think he’s doing a fine job.
Lol, that code is something between smartalex and me. How we will rid ROM of those who only come to post FIRST.
@willie
Arsenal in 98 and United in 99 had the least amount of away wins: 8. Can we win the league with 78 or 79 points like those teams? Not completely out of the question. For the record, Chelsea in 05 had the most amount of away wins with 15. No shock there..
SmartAlex @ 14:02: “Sir Alex is going to win this year. What makes this achievement so special, is that we’re not quite ready. SAF believes that 3 to 4 years at the top is the most you can expect from a team. We had our 3 (nearly 4) years, and now it looks like we’re already back to silverware winning ways. And our next team isn’t quite ready yet.”
Exactly ! It’s not too bad when last year’s team-in-transition came second in the EPL – as a result of diabolical refereeing in the two matches v. RentBoyz – and within a whisker of another CL final. This year’s work-in=progress “might just” win the EPL – FIRST, unbeaten, games in hand, best goal difference – and the CL/FACup are lotteries so ya never know.
The other point you could make is that all this success has tended to spoil our fans by giving them a false sense of entitlement. For all the talk about “crap invincibles”, all four EPL clubs are in the final 16 of the CL – the level of competition in the EPL is higher than in Spain, Italy or Germany. So, to be FIRST, unbeaten, games in hand, while having the best goal difference is one fucking-impressive achievement. Enjoy the ride !
@Denton
Dude do you think pogba or tunnicliffe(yeah this lad is great) would be a starter for us next season.I dont think so.They would be playing maybe in couple of years but not next season.We need a replacement for hargreaves and even scholes.I cant see carrick impoving at this age so i wont be surprised if we see two new mf players.
@gio
Yeah i agree with you we need to strengthen our midfield.
Jeet
Yeah i amy sound a very optimistic but we can reach the semis if our defence is good.Seriously speaking i would want the premier league and the fa cup to be won.If we win these two then we can say we had a great season.
Ash – maybe Pogba and Tunnicliffe won’t be “starters” but that’s not the point. SAF runs a squad system with some notable exceptions – even Anderson and DimitarBerbatov aren’t automatic “starters”. Let’s assume that Pogba and Tunnicliffe are the real deal, they will be integrated into the first-team slowly – just like Rafael. And, if they’re as good at what they do as Rafael, then they might be “automatic starters” in a few years’ time. I know it’s hard, but you have to let go of notions of a fixed-first-eleven and/or a fixed-formation – SAF doesn’t work like that, he plays for the long game – the whole season – and tries to “coddle” his players so that they can be fresh/healthy in April/May. It almost worked last year except that WayneRooney twisted his ankle in a completely unexpected moment at the end of the first Bayern match. From my vantage-point, it would seem that the only “automatic starters” on this team are the defensive triangle – VDS, Rio, Vidic in addition to Patrice Evra and, probably (?), WayneRooney. In the Spurs match, the top-scorer (DimitarBerbatov) and the best attacking player (Nani) were BOTH substituted – that would never have happened ten years ago when the first-eleven were played game-after-game until they dropped. It’s a new game nowadays.
Darren Bent is going to Aston Villa so what is going to happen with Welbeck. Will he come back to us or now stay at Sunderland where he is guaranteed to get games. Will Steve Bruce put in a bid for him, will SAF sell Welbeck one of our best prospects, will Welbeck do a Rossi, Pique and a Macheda because lets be honest Macheda is not coming back.
@denton
The point was about mid field and not about the whole squad.You have to accept our current mid field is very weak and the man who is the best scholes isnt getting younger.
Next season we will have a mid field of anderson who i think would be the main man
then we have fletcher who has been very poor this season maybe he will find his form next season
Then there is carrick who as i said has past his peak and is a weak link for us.
The other three are scholes,hargreaves and gibson
Maybe scholes would play one more season but it wont solve our mid field problem as he is not getting any younger
Hargreaves i have no hope and its very sad that hargo has to go like this but its more or less over for him.So we need a replacement for hargo
Then gibson.Cmonn i Dont think a player who is aged 23 and will turn 24 still to be called as a youngster.Its clear he will be sold.
Even if we integrate two academy players we still are short of two quality mid fielders .Thats why i said I wont be surprised that fergie buys 2 mid fielders.
Whatever it will be an interesting summer this year for us in transfer market.
Just watched the 101gg video (RoM link top of page) on Bale’s contribution.
It consists of less than 10 seconds of actual Bale involvement, resulting in 1 quasi half chance.
Paul Parker has it right when he rates Obertan as a much better winger for United next year.
Ash @ 15:30: “You have to accept our current mid field is very weak”
I don’t accept that – it’s not great but it’s certainly not “very weak”. I’ve banged on for a while about getting a real difference-maker such as Daniele Di Rossi of Sebatstian Schweinsteiger, guys who would make a huge impact but that doesn’t seem likely. Henderson/Rodwell are just over-hyped – especially Rodwell who doesn’t start even when Pienaar doesn’t feel up for it and Cahill is away. Part of the “problem”, as I have written before, stems from using a formation that is problematic – 4-4-2 is a recipe for getting over-run in the middle of the park which is why SAF plays some version of a 4-5-1 or 4-3-3 in almost all the big games. Yesterday, SAF wanted to play two wingers to help clamp down on Bale/Lennon; that worked well but it left the middle of the field understaffed against VDV/Modric/Palacios. He could have kept the two wingers and played with Anderson but that would have meant leaving out one of WayneRooney or DimitarBerbatov and, for whatever reason he had, he didn’t do that.
But, we have to recognize that UTD’s midfield is something of a square pegs/round holes issue, too. DarrenFletcherinho excels at harrying and harrassing the opposition but he’s not a real creative force; MichaelCarrick excels at shielding the back four but he’s a timid player; Anderson is dynamic but he’s not yet found real consistency – although it was evident that after Rafael was sent off and Fletcherinho was shifted to right back that there was more drive and dynamism behind the two forwards. Paul Scholes excels when he’s got time on the ball; he doesn’t do so well when the opposition set out to close him down with a vigourous “fore-check”. I happen to think that whichever combination of three would be selected would provide a much stronger platform for a lone striker and two wingers, abetted by two attacking full-backs but, hey, that’s not rocket science since three are more likely to do better than two !
My opinion, for waht it’s worth, is that IF SAF is going to play both DimitarBerbatov and WayneRooney then things work better when Berbatov is played centrally and forward while Rooney is given license to roam, essentially playing as an attacking midfielder. I’m not convinced by DimitarBerbatov as a lone striker and, most certainly, Dimmy loses his edge when he’s roaming about as an attacking midfielder/support striker.
All of this is a very, very long-winded way of saying that I dnn’t agree that the midfield is “very weak” but I do think that the team functions at its best when SAF uses three of them.
I like Bastin, not sure about Di Rossi. But, both are unproven in English football. Neither will ever sign for United anyway. The boss seems to like Henderson, but I don’t get the fuss over Rodwell, who can’t get into the Everton team at this present time. Pogba and Tunnicliffe are 3/4 years away from threatening the first team squad, so a CM is a must in the summer.
With all of the talk about how poor the passing in central midfield was today per Carrick and Fletcher, with Giggs rarely out wide left having floated more centrally, Nani doing just about enough to get hauled off in the 2nd half, Rooney’s touch sort of lacking and Berbatov not being the type of player to ever really make runs… Who exactly were they supposed to pass the ball to?
WillieRedNut @ 20:43: “I don’t get the fuss over Rodwell, who can’t get into the Everton team at this present time. Pogba and Tunnicliffe are 3/4 years away from threatening the first team squad,”
Completely agree with you assessment about Rodwell.
Not so sure about Pogba/Tunnicliffe – if they’re really “special” then they should break through to the first-team squad before they’re 20; if they’re “marginal” then, like Tom Cleverley, they will go out on loan and – maybe – return as squad players. These two guys – plus Ravel Morrison – are supposedly the “truly special” talents among the youngsters (leaving aside Rafael/Fabio). “If you good enough, then you’re old enough”. Time will tell.
I don’t disagree that one new CM signing seems on the cards – Scholes ain’t getting any younger, Hargreaves ain’t getting any healthier, and Gibson ain’t getting any better. I think that both Darren Fletcherhio and Anderson would be fine; MichaelCarrick is something of an odd duck in that he does an unglamourous job very well. A truly-serious upgrade on Carrick would be one hell of a player I’m hoping that SAF plays the “go big or go home” card. I’m relatively confident that the money is there to sign a true ‘difference maker” but it’s not altogether clear to me who that might be. I am sure, though, that it won’t be Luca Modric !
If I was looking for a difference maker, I wouldn’t banging on Roma’s door, to buy Di Rossi. Yes, he’d be a step up on Carrick, but I would argue Modric is far more creative than Di Rossi and could make the difference for United, particularly in Europe, were you need something different to unlock defenses. Disagree on Pogba and Tunnicliffe, If there in the first team squad by the age of twenty, I’ll be very surprised. We don’t know if there special yet, but I’m hoping that is indeed the case.
Also denton, unless the Glazers sell United, we won’t be spending big on anyone mate. If they do give Sir Alex money to flutter on whoever, I’ll hands my hands up, but I won’t be holding my breath either! By the way, I did watch Pastore on sunday, not the answer either lol.
WillieRedNut @ 22:10 – I don’t agree with you about the Glazers’ “refusal” to allow SAF to spend money. I’d phrase this differently – “SAF needs to convince the Glazers that MrX can be the difference between winning and coming close” BUT SAF has won AND come close while selling off his best player so that would be a hard argument for him to make.
think that the “business plan” is pretty clear – buy youngsters with loads of talent and HOPE that some of them can step up to the first-team. If not, recoup the purchase price and move on with some new guys. Keep the talent flowing into the training ground so that there is constant turnover and constant transition while remaining in serious contention for the big prizes.
I only have this to say: Rooney got to step up NOW, NOW, NOW, NOW, NOW. Even if he starts scoring in the next games, it is for what he has not done in previous games. I say it again, Rooney has got to score bucketful of goals NOW, NOW, NOW, NOW. Assists are fine, but they’re not enough. Score some bloody goals, NOW, Rooney!
In all honesty who’s midfield engine was stronger on Sunday? Ours that consisted of Giggsy, Fletch, Carrick, and Nani? Or there’s with Bale, Modric, Palacios, and Lennon? Pretty even but like you point out Scott who is supposed to be our creative spark? Carrick? God forbid he starts attempting through balls like he used to do. And to play 4-4-2 we need a midfield destroyer.. fletch used to be that man but he’s gone off the boil.. Hargreaves is forever injured and Carrick, well, he just isn’t. Carrick’s strength is his passing and like you mention it’s not hard to pass sideways and backwards. For me Ando and Scholesy are our creativity. Ando should be on the pitch ahead of both Carrick and Fletch IMO. If you combine Fletcher and Carrick in the form they’re in right now, which if we’re honest is pretty mediocre, you get a player called Modric.. a player we must make a move for in the summer to complete our midfield and finally start playing an effective 4-4-2 when necessary.
Here’s a link for the video highlights of Tottenham Hotspurs and United
http://www.theredevilspot.com/2011/01/this-is-why-we-are-champions.html