Football has changed dramatically since the 1990′s. Whilst United have always prided themselves on their attacking football, the mentality that said you may score three but we will score four has gone.
We won the league by 18 points in the 1999-2000 season and conceded a massive 45 goals, an average of 1.2 goals per game. In our double winning year of 2007-2008 we conceded just 22 goals, an average of 0.6 goals per game.
Manchester United have now conceded as many goals as they had done all of last season, which is obviously having implications on our title challenge.
So, what’s going on?
Arsenal
Manuel Almunia – 22 out of 27
William Gallas – 26 out of 27
Thomas Vermalen – 27 out of 27
Total – 75 out of 81
All three together – 21 out of 27 (78%)
Goals conceded – 30
Chelsea
Petr Cech – 26 out of 27
John Terry – 27 out of 27
Ricardo Carvalho – 20 out of 27
Total – 73 out of 81
All three together – 19 out of 27 (70%)
Goals conceded – 22
Manchester United
Edwin Van der Sar – 11 out of 27
Rio Ferdinand – 6 out of 27
Nemanja Vidic – 13 out of 27
Total – 30 out of 81
All three together – 1 out of 27 (4%)
Goals conceded – 24
Manchester United 08-09
Edwin van der Sar – 25 out of first 27
Nemanja Vidic – 26 out of first 27
Rio Ferdinand – 21 out of first 27
Total – 72 out of 81
All three together – 18 out of 27 (67%)
Goals conceded – 12
This isn’t an excuse, merely some sort of an explanation for our more troubling defensive record this season. Given that we’ve had our first choice central defenders and goalkeeper available for just 4% of the season, whilst Chelsea have had theirs for 70%, it gives contest to the greater number of defeats we have suffered. Even just slightly better luck with our defensive injuries could see us top of the league, let alone a defensive injuries record that matched Chelsea’s.
Injuries are a part of football so this isn’t excusing our defensive form, rather an attempt to give a bit of clarity which could serve to soften the blow of our current position in the table.
Man Utd News 24/7
Fair point. However if Wayne Rooney was missing this season as much as Robin Van Persie where would your title challenge be now I wonder?
I dont agree.
We’ve been conceding in matches when Rio or Vida were playing as well. Remember 2-0 Liverpool anyone?
Now let us do a similar analysis for the attack as well.. Rooney vs Van Persie.
And we’ve still stuffed in equal number of goals as you mancs have..
Good points as an Arsenal fan im full of admiration at your success with practically playing with no defence for the whole of the season. I mean people can say what they want about Rooney but its a testimont to the skill of ferguson to get you guys that far with no defence
gerry gooner ur spot on .if we had rvp as much as rooney it could have been us sitting up top instead of chelsea and ferdinand and vidic have not been themselves this season at all .
Fair point Gerry. Drogba has missed a few for Chelsea too. However, missing the 3 most important players in your defence for such a vast chunk of the season destabilises the whole team. It has also impacted in other areas such as losing our most influential midfielder from that position to cover the defence. If our defence had been as settled as last season I’m sure we’d be in a better position. I’m pretty sure the Fulham game (with Carrick and Fletcher in the back 4) wouldn’t have panned out as it did. Lets be honest, with such a crisis at the back this season, we’re not in bad shape. We have to hold our hands up to the Liverpool, Fulham, Everton and Villa defeats….we were awful and deserved nothing. But Carrick slots his penalty against Burnley and the ref doesn’t have an abbiration at Chelsea and at the very least we’re joint top!
well done scott .. i’m totally agree with you , i think our defence is biggest differnt between this season and last season .. let’s hop chelsea will drop some pionts againts ( liverpool , man shitty , spurs and villa) while we have to do some great great jop againts ( liverpool , man shitty and spurs ) ana thats will be the only ways to reach our 19th trophy …
Stonedwasherman
Van Persie played 28 Prem games last season and United still scored the same as Arsenal, however, United still finished top and Arsenal still finished 18 points behind in 4th so what is your point? He also played in our match at the Emirates this season? I get your point but we’re looking at 3 key players missing at the same time for a large chunk of the season!
a bit of good news…..
http://www.football365.com/story/0,17033,8652_5963675,00.html
During the season we had about 8 players injured before every game. We have van Persie nad Gibbs injured for a very long time. May be we will not be champions but we will finish above you at the end.
It is a very good excuse for what has happened to our defence this season. The worrying thing is that this was to be expected. The triangle at the back has had 3 full seasons playing together. VDS is 39, Rio is 32 and Vida is 28-29. They don’t have many miles left in them. And I will take VDS out of the equation because he has appeared as much as possible. But the other two have been through the wars in recent seasons and in my opinion, we should have made the transition to a new back 5 from the summer.
Something else. Yes, in 99-00 we conceded a lot of goals. More than we will concede now. How many did we score though? 97. How many games did we lose? 3. How many points did we get? 91. Neither one of these 3 will happen this time. In fact, we are 3 points behind what we had for the corresponding 27 fixtures last year. And we can make that up if we beat the dippers next month, but I can’t see us getting 90 points this season.
The league will probably come down to those 3 league games at the end of March: Liverpool (h), Bolton (a) and Chelsea (h)
On another note. VDS signing for another season is great news. It also probably means that Foster and Kuszczak will leave in the summer. I can’t see them willing to lurk in the shadows for another year.
I think it’s time we moved past extending the contracts of our 30+ players and focus on what we will do with the likes of Rooney, Evra, Nani and Vidic. If they play well at the World Cup, extending their contracts will be more difficult.
People on this site From Scott to first time readers seem to be very knowledgeable soooooooooooooo
Can someone tell me that when United were a point behind chelsea the media was talking about Chelseas wonderful chance of doing a treble
`
now arsenal are 2 points behind United and the talk sport radio show here in ireland “live after 5 ” were all over United finishing 3rd at the end of the season and how united blew there chance of making history
I don’t get what you’re trying to say. Arsenal’s defence is crap BECAUSE we’ve had to play Almunia 22 games out of 27. Imagine how water-tight we would’ve been if we had a real ‘keeper.
thats a very good point gerry gooner its easy for football fans to get biased about their club man u fans are sometimes guilty of this . arsenal have had van persie inured for the rest of the season with the striker playin only about 3 months. where would we be without rooney?
injuries can be a problem to football teams and if any team is making the most out of their squad it has to be arsenal yes we have lost rio & vidic at certain point but i think arsenal still coped better and u never know they might win the league and if we dont win it i definately want arsenal to win it they are such a good attacking team. cant stand chelsea and i hope they dont win
Now bring on westham!!
I still think that the aim of the game is to score goals rather than not concede them. At the end of the day, as long as you win, it should not really matter whether it was 4:3 or 1:0. You play to win!
This season, of course we had a lot of defensive problems, bit we are only kidding ourselves if we use this as an excuse for our position not being better than it is. Our striker and midfielders are as guilty. Most of the matches that we lost this season we did not score at all.
Finally, I think that to have any chance of winning the title this season, we should really win all our remaining matches.
Portsmouth will beat chelsea
Where we are still in the league doesn’t really matter, points will be traded lost and gained with some more twists along the way.
You can just see the moment a team turns up like Barcelona, Everton, Liverpool where they really pressure every man on the ball, it gets forced back to the keeper or defender who forces a long ball and our possession is gone for the next 5 minutes. They’ll rinse repeat this all game long, get goal chances and minimise our efforts, frustrate our Rooney and force defensive errors.
When we are in great form, they’ll be pressing us, but it seems like a Scholes has so much time in the world to pick the pass through midfield, or a good long ball out wide, we retain possession, move up the field and dominate for a good spell. To be honest i’d be looking at our movement this match, maybe tiredness, as the main reason we looked so fragile.
Cus at the end of the day, if we still had Rio/Vida, maybe it would be more like last season where we won some games 1-0 in a boring fashion, but there still would be many questions about the forward play this game.
Time really changes fast. In January we were so confident that we can make up and win the league. Now everything change again. I couldn’t want and won’t predict who will go on to win the league. Feeling tired and breathless to argue we will win and yet once again slip off the chance. Just being a observer and keep mute is the best. Complacent is not the good way.
Interesting stats, but i think that you should include other things as well when you do stats like; for example, missing defensive midfielder, a defender and world class striker may be more damaging. Also, conceding a lot of goals cannot always be translated as lost point. You won a high scoring match against Citeh, against Aston Villa, Sunderland and other examples could follow. I also think historical conclusions are not useful in analysing football results fluctuations and movement. For example you mentioned high conceding season of 99-00, but you forget that at the time only smaller club than ManU which is Arsenal was only competing with them. and that Arsenal were in reconstruction period. But now you have Chelsea who have a stronger squad on paper. But, still ManU have big chance and injuries are affecting as well as the abscence of Sir Ronaldo.
Unlucky for United, they have to play Arsenal only …two times a season. And now they will falter against the traditionally organised clubs with strong tackling defences and nicking goals capabilities.
BTW, this stats above are so well manipulated to hide the fact that the Mancs are far from great this season – even against AC they had the stroke of luck and an unexpected “teammate” in the form Ronaldinho – a selfish clown
No excuses.injuries are part and parcel of the game.arsenal have injuries every season.chelsea had their problems in dec 06-07 when we went comfortably ahead of them.you expect your centrebacks to head the ball better than give it straight to opposition players and do better than hoof long balls forward aimlessly.we were fortunate with injuries in the last 3 years.they are going to catch up at some stage.
@gerry gooner
united would have been fighting with liverpool and the rest for 3rd and 4th spots had rooney been injured,not the title.
Spot on Scott but we can say fuck all because people just say we are making excuses which to an extent we are. However lets see how we do when we get back at least Rio and Vidic. You can just see the confidence in the team when those two are playing or at least one of them.
Costas – Hello mate. I liked the fact in your first post you are kinda saying Edwin should be taken out the equation then you obviously read the news that Edwin has signed another deal or close to!! That is fantastic news.
I see that fat cunt Danny Kelly is saying on talkshite we are a one man team. He reckons the fact Rooney was “stopped” yesterday meant United were fucked. Bollocks. It is the fact that Wazza and the entire team just did not turn up. Its not like Rentboys rely on Drogba or the dippers Torres or Barca Messi. Cunts.
Costas – I am sure mate that Fergie and Gill have “thought about” players contracts . If not then summat is definately wrong!!
aig – Bollocks pal. Of course it makes a difference. For fuck sake did the Chav’s have to play Fat Frank and Ballack as centre halves all December?
WE have not been “fortunate” with injuries the last 3 years . We have had defensive problems in Rio. Hargo out for 18 months. Ronaldo out for 3 months last season, Rooney injured. need I go on?
Well Arsenal lost Nasri, Rosicky, Cesc, Clichy, RVP, Theo, Bendtner and Eduardo for lengthy periods this season but they are joint top scorers in league and still in the title race. Vermaelen is currently playing with an injured leg and Arshavin has been playing with an injured ankle since the begining of the season.
We all have injury problems mate, we just have to suck it up and deal with it.
A great read from Fergie. Says Rooney comes up to him all the time with his “team” for the match! The most important thing to me is that Fergie says “winning the 19th title is IN MY SOUL”. He will make sure the players do their jobs till the end of the season to get this title. Fucking LEGEND.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2010/feb/21/sir-alex-ferguson-manchester-united-interview
Sorry for the multiple posts but I am on one today. Fucking genius line from Fergie about Citeh.
“This is a club with so much wealth they could buy every player in the world, but can they buy a team, can they buy a Manchester United spirit?
obviously if your team is not consistant with having fit players they wont be consistant in their results level and performances.
@King Eric
We have been more fortunate than the others in the last few years. As i said injuries are a part of the game. You cant complain about that.Our problems havent been as bad as the others. Vidic was fit the last year and he was our best player. Ronaldo was fit the years before that and he was our best player. Rio and vidics fitness levels were pretty good for the last 2-3 years so at some stage injuries were going to catch up with them, especially Vidic.
I wont be making excuses if we dont win the league. The better team wins it, so whoever wins it is better, End of story.
And Chelsea better not forget to share the trophy with our excellent medical staff for the brilliant work they have done
Compared to chelseas 22 the number of goals conceded isnt bad but we have failed to keep clean sheets in games that matter.
Chelsea
Arsenal twice
Spurs
VIlla twice
Everton
Liverpool
Man City
Fulham
We may have won some of these games but ideally these are the games in which we would need to keep clean sheets and we havent
OFF THE POINT BUT MR. LIVERPOOL MY BALLBAG…. http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11669_5966053,00.html
Le Gooner – yes, all teams have injuries. I’ve just looked at three positions and their injuries because those three positions have the biggest impact on the defence, something we have struggled with in comparison to last season.
Given that Patrice Evra is our only defender not to have been injured this season and we were playing for several weeks with Michael Carrick and Darren Fletcher as our centre backs suggests that we’ve had far more injuries than just those three players.
Out of interest, Nasri, Rosicky, Fabregas, Bendtner and Eduardo have ALL played more games than Van der Sar, Rio and Vidic this season. RvP has played in as many games as Vidic.
@King Eric
Hey mate. In regards to Edwin, I meant that he has always been there for us and hasn’t encountered any chronic injury problems. He is still reliable despite his age(although that will stop him from playing every game). And to be honest, if I was asked who from our current goalkeeping trio I would like to see at United next season, it would be Edwin at 39-40. I didn’t mean that we shouldn’t play him. I meant that he is not injury prone like the other two.
Costas – Oh I didn’t mean anything funny mate. I just like the way you had discussed him then obviously read that link from “long john o’shea”!!
To all the arse fans on here, banging about RvP not playing, where the fuck would your team be if you had sold Fabregas and Bendtner?
And @ AIG, no, we wouldn’t have been fighting for fourth spot. We have Berba and Owen on the pay roll for a reason. If Rooney was out injured all season, Owen would have played more and would have had 20 goals by now, probably on his way to the WC. I love your confidence in us. But even for a ‘pessimist” you are awfully annoying!
@Anon
oh why not. Both of them are in such great form arent they?.20 goals for Owen. Are you kidding me. he needs 5 chances to score 1 goal. Its common sense United wont be anywhere near where we are without Rooney. Its good to be optimistic but it would be great if you be a bit realistic rather than making a fool of yourself saying silly thing like that.
How many games has Owen started? How many consecutive matches has he played?
Compare that to Rooney?
Not deriding Rooney, he is special, but to say we are as good as Liverpool without him is stupid!
Many of Rooney’s goals have been simple tap ins, and no one finishes better in this team than Owen.
If he played five games back to back he will be back to his clinical ways.
Rooney does a lot for us, but even if he wasn’t there, while we will lose out on some aspects of his game, to say we will be shite is rubbish!
Realism eh? Bull shit! The only realism I see is us being called a one man team by a supposed fan. Fletcher, Evra and Valencia have all been as good and as important as Rooney this season, and it’s about time the myth of the one man team is squandered.
and yeah
“he needs 5 chances to score 1 goal”
you are the only one making a fool of yourself mate. Are you seriously going to judge Owen completely on the basis of a few games he has played for us? Bizarre.
When he has started week in week out he has scored goals, for every team in every competition. So let’s not get ahead of ourselves.
@Anon
The question is why dosent owen start then?. for 2 reasons because he can play a limited amount of games and because whenever Berba and Owen have partnered Rooney in the tricky games they have struggled while a 4-5-1 has been our best formation where we have had the best performances adn the best results
Its just that SAF dosent have that much faith in Owen and given the number of chances he has missed in some of the games i dont blame SAF.Otherwise he would have definitely started more games.
Fletcher,Valencia and Evra have been great but they wont score goals in bucketloads like Rooney.united are not a one man team but like he is the MAIN MAN for our club and without him its obvious we would have struggled big time and definitely not been in the title race.There is a difference between a one man team and a player being your main man. United definitely arent the same team without Rooney
Just as i ask you, are you doubting SAF that he hasnt given Owen and Berba more games?. he has a reason and i dont think we should doubt it.
Comedy!
Erm… if Rooney is our “main man”, and we are playing a 4-5-1, how the heck do you expect SAF to play Owen? Bonkers much?
Doubting SAF? That’s your job, ain’t it?
Not enough faith? Then why do you think he signed him? Does he just like to spend time with Owen, or is it the horse racing?
Get a grip mate. Owen is a world class striker, who can’t get a sniff in the first team because of Rooney’s form, and our formation which limits the number of first team strikers to one. Not to mention our poor defense this season which means that Fergie can’t afford the rotation policy that he had in place last season.
Scoring goals is just the final piece of the puzzle. And no one contributes to it more than Fletch, Valencia and Evra. If you have an iota of a football brain you would know that. It was the same with Ronnie last season, and the same with Rooney this season, any player playing through the middle at United is flanked by some of the best players in the world. Fletcher right behind you, Evra to your left, Valencia to your right, you would have to stunningly bad finisher not to grab a goal every two games. Or every 180 minutes.
Rooney’s strong points are holding the ball up and bringing his team mates into play. If he held the ball up only for it to be squandered by his teammates, we would be as shit as the Scousers.
Owen won’t shore up the ball, but in my opinion, he doesn’t need to.
He is an old school stirker, he will get the ball and look for an opening to strike, which Rooney won’t.
We can play Rooney in a 4-5-1 because of players like Valencia and Fletch and Evra. If they weren’t there, Rooney wouldn’t be scoring goals galore as he is.
Goals are important, but at United, goals are created right throughout the team, and we have more than just one guy who can put the away.
If next season we start with Owen instead of Rooney, barring injuries, I see Owen getting 30+ for the season. Hypothetical situation, yes, but extremely probable.
And now onto your last bit, no, Rooney isn’t our main man, he just plays at the most important position for us. Stick Berba up there, and he will be our main man, just like Ronaldo was the main man for us last season.
Stick Evra up there, and he will be our main man.
No one plays for United if they aren’t good enough. Not one of our players is average. Even the likes of Sheasy and Park who get slated for being average, are actually gifted players, but they look average in front of the likes of Ferdinand and Brown and Vidic and Evra.
So yeah, therefore, my very balanced and accounted for Realism states that we would still be fighting it out for the league title if Rooney were missing for large parts of the season.
Thankfully he wasn’t, and is still around, but even if he wasn’t, we would still get the goals.
osi – You are just making things up mate. High scoring wins against Sunderland and Villa. When were these like? Being that much of a liar surely you are a Citeh fan.
Anon – Spot on fella. I really cannot help it but I too have found myself getting annoyed on here of late.
“5 chances to score a goal”. Coley did not do too bad pal.
Owen isnt a world class striker,he WAS a world class striker ddn because he and Berba are mostly passengers when they start the tricky games SAF prefers a 4-5-1 formation.
Cant believe some people cant be a bit more realistic. Would love to see Rooney rested against Milan and then lets see what Berbatov and owen can do or possibly give Rooney a 4-5 game break and lets play Berbatov and owen so that they can get some games and well see how good they are
Anon – fair point.
Last year we were one man team with Ronaldo, now we are one man team with Rooney. Typical bullshit and illogical.
King Eric- The excuse of innate pessimism is wearing thin mate. Either some ppl on here just suffer from inferiority complex and hence cannot cope with the ups and downs of the PL or are simply deluded bitters who like to wind us up!
ok conspiracy theories aside, I would not want my supporters to predict my doom whenevr I go out to play.
So likewise, I try not to think about bad stuff happening to the team out there. Of course they fuck up sometimes, but to use those few moments to justify doing so before every game is stupid and frustrating for readers who come on here, not just to read the blog but to get to read the fans’ views and get a feel of the atmosphere.
I am not an eternal optimist either, but I always look for your (King Eric) and GHTT’s posts coz they give me something to look forward to during the game.
But there are some others who just make me want to shut down the tv and go to bed!
AIG: again you missed the point. Of course if we bring Berba and Owen in for the Milan game out of the blue, they are going to be rusty, Owen anyway.
I remember a CL group game, don’t remember against whom, but Berba and Owen were linking up phenomenally throughout the game. IT was stunning, and led to some people on here say that Owen should start ahead of Rooney!
To say he is finished as a world class striker is not just stupid and short-sighted, it shows you up for the fair weather fan that you are.
To show a slight parallel, to prove my point, back in 06-07, there were a lot of people slagging a very good sportsperson off. He was FINISHED, apparently. Then he came back from injury, played a whole year without a break, and guess what, he was back as world number one in january 2008. Do you know who I am talking about? Doesn’t matter. Not saying Michael Owen is a Tendulkar, but the old adage, form is temporary, class is permanent, rests true with someone who just turned 30, and has barely played for a year!
Not saying we need to bench Rooney and start with Owen, but if (touchwood) something happens to Roon, we have a very reliable striker whom we can rely on, even in a 4-5-1, whom I have immense faith in to get the goals, and you don’t.
LOL
Mourinho just can’t lose a home game. Now with 9 men.
@Anon
Owen cant play week in week out,thats the first point. Secondly his finishing has become a bit rusty.Berbatov dosent suit our best formation and if they play in the absence of Rooney they may score but not as many as now and we will struggle badly for sure and owen isnt the fittest either, he himself can get injured any time. Berbatov is a great player who i have never criticized and never will but he himself is playing despite an injury so playing week in week out is putting more pressure and risk on him. Need diouf to make it into the regular plans as soon as possible. So far he is doing very well.Also Berba and owen arent the youngest
“Owen cant play week in week out,thats the first point.”
You would know that because? Have we TRIED playing him week in week out? Stupid assumpsions without facts!
“Secondly his finishing has become a bit rusty.”
Again, rusty, doesn’t mean he has lost it. Of course it is going to be rusty, the man has hardly played regularly!
“Berbatov dosent suit our best formation…”
So how many times have we played Berba in a 4-5-1 exactly?
” …and if they play in the absence of Rooney they may score but not as many as now and we will struggle badly for sure…”
Again, conclusions without any basis, what so ever!
” …and owen isnt the fittest either, he himself can get injured any time.”
Again, how do we know this? He had a problem with his groin once, but nothing since. He may be injury prone, he may not be, but we don’t know either way for sure. Unless you are his personal physio in disguise?
“Berbatov is a great player who i have never criticized and never will but he himself is playing despite an injury so playing week in week out is putting more pressure and risk on him.”
I have not even mentioned berbs once in any of my posts! Your obsession with slating him indirectly is pretty evident. “Owen and Berba this”, “Owen and Berba that”. Fine, I get it! They aren’t fit to lace Rooney’s boots! That’s why each is recognized in world football as quality players. That’s why Berbatov was so sought after by SAF and why Owen has 40 odd goals for England, apart from a couple of hundred for the dippers!
“Need diouf to make it into the regular plans as soon as possible. So far he is doing very well.”
You just contradicted yourself with that statement! If we have a talented lad like Diouf in the reserves, how can we conclude we would be sturggling to make 4th without Rooney?
“Also Berba and owen arent the youngest”
WOW! Nice. Did you use the carbon dating technique to find that out? Heard of Pipo Inzaghi? How about Totti? Berba is just 29. Owen is 30. They are not even the oldest players in the team. Berba is a year older than Evra and Vidic.
Owen is two younger than Rio. Granted requirements for a CB differ vastly from that of the striker, but Owen is also 3 or 4 years younger than Raul! And I always fancied Owen to be better than Raul anyway!
Owen is injury prone.Check out his injury records when he played regularly for newcastle. 40 goals for England came when he was in his prime, he is still good but not good enough to start week in week out and score goals with the same consistency. The 4-5-1 formation is more about quick passing and staying up front which Rooney did well. Berbatov cant do that because he dosent have the pace and at times drops way too deep. if you bother to come here a bit regularly yo will know i have always defended Berbatov.
As for Diouf he is good enough but cant expect him to make an impact straight away. He will need some first team games. Scoring in reserve games is very different to playing against Everton or Villa away.
United could do well without Rooney too but commonsense will tell you we wont be the same force without him. Thats the reason why SAF dosent rest him and played him even in the carling cup games. Pretty sure he wont be rested on Tuesday.
if Owen was that good he would have started against the likes of Burnley and in the Carling Cup against City.
First off, I do come here regularly. Just because I don’t feel the need to shout at the top voice every time doesn’t mean that I only come here once a week!
And 2, “not the same force” is a far cry from battling for the 4th! Is that you changing your tune?
And I don’t get how any of what you say is a proper argument against my points?
You again say Berba isn’t fit for a 4-5-1 when we haven’t really seen him play in that role and again slag Owen for his record at Newcastle, but ignore his record before and after that stint!
Either you are just really thick, or just don’t get the game!
And you keep referencing SAF as if you know what is going on in his head! How the hell do you know the reasons for any of Fergie’s decisions? Is that some psychic ability you were born with along with your pessimism?
Your whole post is a series of ramblings and I am not even sure you yourself believe what you are saying!
Your point: We suck without Rooney, as good as Liverpool, who are effectively 6th right now.
My point: That’s bullshit, and we would still be competing with Chelsea for the title if Rooney was out of the picture all season.
None of your arguments have proved me wrong. So I don’t really see the point of arguing with you, as I can get a better dialogue going with a wall.
You were the one who started it.. We arent a force without Rooney and its obvious. If owen hasnt started many games there must be a reason. Just stating all his achievements in the past dosent mean he is that good now.
How do you know either that Owen can score goals or 20 goals as you say when he isnt deemed good enough to start 2 games in a row. An assumption that you are making that. he was only signed because we couldnt get the main player we wanted and hence settled for a short term arrangement in case of an emergency or if anything happens to Rooney.
Cant believe you have not an iota of commonsense to see United would be much worse off without Rooney. If we are in this position 4 points off and he has hardly missed any games and none of our defeats without him we would be atleast 5-6 points off where we are now.
If you remember Berba played in a 4-5-1 in Moscow in a 1-0 win and all he did was yelling at others throughout the game
“How do you know either that Owen can score goals or 20 goals as you say when he isnt deemed good enough to start 2 games in a row. An assumption that you are making that.”
Err… what exactly was Owen’s scoring rate at Liverpool and Madrid? And exactly what is the goals/min rate that he has at OT? If you take a look at one of Scot’s earlier posts, or even look at his current goals to minutes played ratio, you would know the basis of my argument is strong. Sorry I do my research before talking.
” he was only signed because we couldnt get the main player we wanted and hence settled for a short term arrangement in case of an emergency or if anything happens to Rooney.”
True, which is why I believe even if something had happened to Rooney, Owen would have seen us through. Obviously a player who is 29 wouldn’t by SAF’s top priority. But he was signed because he CAN do a job if told to. You are saying he will NOT BE ABLE to do the job when called upon, which is stupid.
“Cant believe you have not an iota of commonsense to see United would be much worse off without Rooney. If we are in this position 4 points off and he has hardly missed any games and none of our defeats without him we would be atleast 5-6 points off where we are now.”
Erm, sorry can’t really make out what you are saying here, apart from the fact that we will be 5-6 points worse off without Rooney, and sorry I can’t see that.
Would we be struggling to find the back of the net? Nope. Would we miss his work rate in winning the ball back and in defense. Yes. But our defense has been such a shambles this season, it would have hardly made a difference. Worst case scenario would be we would have conceded more goals, but that in no way translates to 11 points off the top. May be a worse GD, but if Owen had played all those games that Rooney played, with the kind of qulaity service provided by the world class unit that is the United team, he would have got the goals to keep us afloat. I dare say he would have been your hero, the fickle sort that you are.
“If you remember Berba played in a 4-5-1 in Moscow in a 1-0 win and all he did was yelling at others throughout the game”
Again, you base your argument on one game. Nice to see you don’t change much. How many times did Rooney play in a 4-5-1 in the last few seasons only to be left frustrated? Do you recall how many games it took him to gel in this formation? And you decide that one game is enough to judge Berba’s ability in a 4-5-1. If he hadn’t had the problem with his knee this season, we would have seen a lot more rotation at the head, with Berbs and Rooney alternating. And your gob would have been shut. I agree this right here is an assumption, but I base mine on belief, you base yours on fear. There is a difference.
lol. owens scoring rate at Madrid and liverpool. We dont live in the past mate. he has lost his pace since and has also lost out on fitness to play games week in week out..The qualities Berbatov has clearly arent suited to a 4-5-1 formation. he needs someone to partner him and therefore is always used in a 4-4-2 formation.Owen wouldnt have finished all the chances Rooney did. Rooneys finishing has improved a hell lot this season. he isnt as wasteful as before and he also gets involved in a lot of build up play.
Would be interesting if we play or are unfortunately forced to play with berbatov and Owen for sometime. That will settle everything.
I have nothing against owen but its clear he is past it now.We need to buy a striker so that we can go with Rooney, Berbatov, Diouf and someone else next season. Who, i dont know but we need someone.
Anyways, off to sleep.Dont know how you feel but it was good to have a chat with you.
@King Eric
You can straight away say it mate that my comments are annoying you.Sorry i am not as optimistic as you guys.If that annoys with you ill be off from here for good so that things can be looked at in a more positive way rather than my negative comments.
Anyways hope United justify your faith and we win the league.
may be it is a good thing that VDS+Rio+Vidic aren’t playing together ha ha … the one time they did, it was a disaster against Liverpool lol
For the people who are saying we would be fucked without Rooney, do remember that we have been called a one man team before. Ruud was our one man, he left, and we scored more goals the following season. Then Ronaldo was our one man, he left, and we’re scoring more goals the following season.
aig – You don’t annoy me in the slightest mate but sometimes your comments do but certain comments are bound to annoy certain people. I am sure I annoy people with my constant swearing. It is all about opinions . If we all agreed it would be dull. Just little things annoy me like for example when you said the other week you bet against United. That to me is bizarre. But no I don’t want you to go away, not at all. I enjoy your posts to be honest aig. Alot of it is as well that when I get sick of hearing the abu cunt’s in the media etc I come on here only to find people being negative on here. That sometimes winds me up but that is my issue nobody else is to blame. Sorry if I upset you .
Got to say though on this matter Anon talks alot of sense. I am sure that if Owen were to be given regular game time I have no doubt he would bang goals in. Thats what he does. You never lose that. 30 is NOT old . He could have another 4 years at the top level in him. You only have to look at certain finishes this season to know he still has it. Citeh for one. NOBODY else could have put that in with such ease having not been on the pitch long in a local derby in the last seconds. Class finish. Wigan away. Third goal at Wolfsburg. Goal at Oakwell. I have said all along he will have a huge part to play for United at some stage in the run in as will Berbatov.
Doh, we would be well on top miles( points).AHEADS christ ony crazy fuck knows our back four as been goosed, for most of the season. I GIVE UP
cmon Lads lets SHOUT LIKE FUCK…. Get behind our team
@ Redscot
Easy on the drink mate….I know things are not so well with us at the moment but geeze…you could be a bit more coherent when you put things in black and white…
@ AIG
I have sent you an e-mail mate….just have a read…
Good posts anon, @AIG come back mate, no need to be that guy.
Would Jack Rodwelll come to United next season ?
well said anon.