Having looked at the impact of Cristiano Ronaldo’s departure on the goalscoring of other players in the squad, and seeing the positive effect, I thought it would be interesting to compare like for like fixtures. The press wrote us off in the summer (but they did tip Liverpool to win the title, so we shouldn’t be too offended, and instead, comfort ourselves with the knowledge journos know fuck all, it seems) and our own fans have been grumbling about the performances and results, but how justified are the complaints?
Wigan vs United
08/09: 1-2 (Tevez, Carrick)
09/10: 0-5 (Rooney x 2, Berbatov, Owen, Nani)
United vs Arsenal
08/09: 0-0
09/10: 2-1 (Rooney, Diaby og)
Spurs vs United
08/09: 0-0
09/10: 1-3 (Giggs, Anderson, Rooney)
United vs City
08/09: 2-0 (Tevez, Ronaldo)
09/10: 4-3 (Rooney, Fletcher x 2, Owen)
Stoke vs United
08/09: 0-1 (Tevez)
09/10: 0-2 (Berbatov, O’Shea)
United vs Sunderland
08/09: 1-0 (Vidic)
09/10: 2-2 (Berbatov, A Ferdinand og)
United vs Bolton
08/09: 2-0 (Ronaldo, Rooney)
09/10: 2-1 (Knight og, Valencia)
Liverpool vs United
08/09: 2-1 (Tevez)
09/10: 2-0
United vs Blackburn
08/09: 2-1 (Ronaldo, Rooney)
09/10: 2-0 (Berbatov, Rooney)
Chelsea vs United
08/09: 1-1 (Park)
09/10: 1-0
United vs Everton
08/09: 1-0 (Ronaldo)
09/10: 3-0 (Fletcher, Carrick, Valencia)
08/09: Tevez (4), Ronaldo (4), Rooney (2), Carrick (1), Park (1), Vidic (1)
09/10: Rooney (6), Berbatov (4), Fletcher, (3), Owen (2), Valencia (2), Nani (1), Carrick (1), Anderson (1), Giggs (1), O’Shea (1)
Last season we’d had six different goalscorers in the corresponding fixtures to this season, where we’ve had ten different goalscorers.
Completely randomly, it just so happens that all but one of Tevez’s league goals were scored against the opponents we’ve already played this season. It is therefore fairly reassuring to see we have pretty much already replaced the goals he scored for us.
08/09: W7 D3 L1 GF13 GA5 GD8 Points: 24
09/10: W8 D1 L2 GF25 GA11 GD14 Points: 25
Of course, you can argue some teams are stronger/weaker than they were last season. You can argue the time of year the game is played can have an effect. It’s still interesting to see how we got in like for like games.
If you would rather look at the first 13 games of last season and compare them with this, regardless of the strength of opposition, it looks something like this…
08/09: W7 D4 L2 GF25 GA10 GD15 Points: 25
09/10: W9 D1 L3 GF26 GA12 GD14 Points: 28
To give us some perspective on what was going around us, we should look at how our main title rivals were doing at this point last year, compared to this year.
Liverpool 08/09: W10 D2 L1 GF21 GA8 GD13 Points: 32 (+7 on United)
Chelsea 09/10: W11 D0 L2 GF33 GA8 GD25 Points: 33 (+5 on United)
Feeling any better yet?
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Wow, great stats!
Interesting to know that we (and Chelski as well) are on par and will have a head on fight. Would be interesting to see where Arsenal were last year compared to this year. Any Arsenal numbers, Scott?
However, Liverpool will win the league this year because this is their year!
Long way to go. We are weaker too compared to last year.The only good thing this year is it looks like a 2 horse race while last year it was 3 teams at this stage. Plus with no club WC to come we can concentrate only on the league when the matches come thick and fast in christmas.Think things will become clearer when chelski have played arsenal and shitty. The gap may reduce provided we win our next 2 games at Pompey and west ham. However i cant see us getting back if the gap goes up to 8 points or more. Chelsea are and will be the favourites for the league. Our defence has to improve and maybe we will have to grind out some 1-0 wins because in all fairness we are not playing well. Missing too many chances and failing to create clear cut chances until we take the lead(it has taken us long time in many games to break down opposition defences this season). So its not all rosy, however there are many games to go so we can definitely be positive especially with certain players improving all the time. Hope we get rio back fully fit for the 2nd half of the season and owen can find his goal scoring touch and dispacth them more consistently.
great stats Scott, I think over the past number of games we have began to come into a lot more, very good against chelsea and everton was basically a training game (everton showed no interest in winning that game at all) however chelsea is a better team this year, had they not have beaten us I would have really taught we would have pushed on but they have the confidence up now, they are not great by any stretch but if they do get 8 or more ahead they will be tough to get back. united are more than capable of catching them and have the players to do so
aig – It will always be difficult to break down defences when they have ten behind the ball a la Bolton, Blackburn , Everton etc. Even with Ronaldo in the team we often struggled to break down teams hence the number of 1-0 wins. Personally I think the defence has been alot better the last couple of games. Wesley is getting back to his form of the 08/09 season and Evans gets better each game. Vidic was excellent against Everton. The lads are more determined than ever it would seem to prove all the cunt’s in the media wrong and get that 4th title. I thought the last couple of games we have looked much better. Fast tempo , great one and two touch passing . Like you say our main weakness at the minute is how lethal we are in front of goal. Fergie is well aware of this though and will be working on it. We are never gonna get back to the champagne football of the 90′s as since our defeat to the Fascists in Europe in I think 01/02 Fergie has gone about setting the team up differently both in Europe and domestically. Not as gung ho. Thought a couple of our counters on Saturday were bang on.
These stats are nice to see, especially the bit about all of Tevez’s goals being replaced.
aig- Mate don’t worry. Relax and enjoy the ride. Even if we don’t win it this year, remember that we’re in transition and we’ve just won 3 in a row before this.
Happy birthday, King Eric and GHTT!
Er no because Ronnie was injured the first part of the season.
theboogeyman and King Eric.
i agree there that teams put so 10 men behind the ball and itmakes difficult for us but we are United, we are expected to set the standards so we have to find new ways of breaking defences open. Also no offence to any of our strikers but we need a van nistelrooy type striker now because as i have said before apart from owen who wont play many games we dont have an out and out centre forward as berba and rooney like to drop deep and link up play between midfield and forward line. However i am sure our defence will be back to its best soon adn we will keep more clean sheets.
also boogeyman i know it is not possible to win every season,so i am ready to be patient as we are in a phase where we are adopting a new style of play. Its not easy to get immediate success.
yeah we didn’t play Birmingham, but you could replace them with the 19th team last season – Middlesbrough and that was a 1-0 with Berbatov scoring the goal.
While we are’nt doing badly, i wouldn’t expect us to have done any worse at this stage of the season with 28 points from a possible 39. I feel we have to work very hard for our goals sometimes and could do with another matchwinner if we are to win the champions league again.
No, we don’t NEED a van Nistelrooy type striker. That would be ideal in the sense that any team can improve its squad.
Unless this is a club in decline – which statistics and common sense conclusively prove it isn’t – transfer market musings are essentially superfluous for the foreseeable future.
Gud Stats !!
King Eric: “The lads are more determined than ever it would seem to prove all the cunt’s in the media wrong and get that 4th title.”
Excellent point – the top teams are so closely bunched that this kind of “intangible” is often overlooked and/or ignored.
The ways in which injuries (to UTD and to opponents) happen and how the schedule unfolds are other unpredictable elements. And, then, of course, there’s also the completely bizarre way in which the officials make (or don’t make) decisions.
Overall, I’m sure that SAF is reasonably pleased with the team’s evolution so far but, I am also sure, that the recognizes that there are elements which need improvement. It would also seem that SAF believes that he has the elements in place and that it’s just a matter of seeing them gel into a more coherent defence and a more dynamic attack.
denton – Spot on. Fergie was only saying I think a few days ago that we weren’t killing teams off. He put it down to the players lnow they will get plenty of chances so they try and walk it in the net knowing another opportunity will come soon. Don’t believe that myself but for some reason there has been a real reluctancy to shoot .
* know
Great stats… Wes Brown has improved. i think he has played more games this season than any other season in the last 5seasons if am not wrong, mainly due to injury. On average, he played around 6 games per season…. so its good to see he’s managing to stay injury free.
Looking forward to tonights game… want to see how Obertan plays after a full game… i think this kid in time is the real deal.
Rafael has improved as well… did you check him in the Everton game?
Believe me that I am not trying to irritate anyone and I can see Scott has made an effort with this topic but these stats are as near to meaningless as you can get. Whilst it is stated and admitted that one could argue about team changes/time of the season, I would go further to suggest that those factors and others drive a coach and horses through the worth and validity of the points being made.
For example Ronaldo didn’t play start against Chelsea or Liverpool last season and was subbed off before the hour in one other game iirc. Three of the goals from this years total are own goals. If you compare last years start for this years start we had 12 goalscorers this time last year, 10 this year. Last years game against Wigan was crunch match, tense and close. The Arsenal game, insofar as we only needed a point was nearly a dead rubber. This year the matches have taken on a totally different character.
People are easily impressed by statistics.
oh, ronny was injured early in the season huh?
uh, yeah, we’ve achieved all of this without ronny in the squad AT ALL..
and we haven’t even got to comparing our back 4 from last season, we didn’t have so many injuries early on did we?
and the reds go marching on.
God bless Anton Ferdinand I say. merci.