“It depends what you call clever and what you call dirty,” said Wenger, who was asked whether he felt Scholes tackled unfairly. “Unfairly, of course, unfairly,” he replied. “How many times have you watched Paul Scholes? Have you seen only fair tackles from Paul Scholes? I don’t want to come out on one specifically but I can remember a few. [They are] a bit in the past, yes, but look at him playing now. He still doesn’t hide. No, I don’t [think his approach is OK]. You ask me about the quality of the player – who wouldn’t like a Paul Scholes in his team? You ask me: ‘Was he a fair player?’ I say: ‘No, I’m sorry, for me he was not a fair player.’ I just think I respect him highly as a quality player. I did not like some things he did on the football pitch and I have the right to say that. It’s not because you are older, suddenly, that you are a saint.”
Wenger then attempted to praise our player but couldn’t do so without again questioning his character.
“Paul Scholes is still one of the greatest football players in England and his contribution to the success of Manchester United is absolutely huge,” he continued. “The regret I have personally is he was not always the fairest player. There’s a little bit of a darker side in him, sometimes, that I did not like.”
Scholes makes some crappy tackles, Scholes makes some great tackles, but this isn’t a question of ability. Wenger isn’t saying Scholes is poor tackler, he is saying that Scholes has a side of him which is intentionally dirty. Wenger talks of Scholes’ “approach to the game”, not his ability to tackle or not. To say his approach to the game is unfair, is dirty, and isn’t OK, is an accusation over how Scholes chooses to play. If there is a “darker side” to him, then that is again accuses Scholes of intentionally playing in a less favourable way.
We’ve highlighted a selection of United and Arsenal players’ disciplinary record, looking at fouls and yellow cards. In brackets is also their “dirty” ranking in comparison to all the other players in the league.
There are some United and Arsenal players who have been omitted because it seemed pointless including every single player. For example, Dimitar Berbatov in 09/10 committed 36 fouls or Arshavin with 38 fouls, but neither of these really seem relevant to the discussion of “dirty” players.
However, every season, the player with the most yellow cards and most fouls has been included.
The player who has committed the most fouls and most yellow cards has been included for each season, just for the sake of interest.
Fouls 2009/2010
Kevin Davies – 103 (1)
Alex Song – 54 (21)
Vassiriki Diaby – 49 (28)
Antonio Valencia – 41 (50)
Patrice Evra – 36 (68)
Darren Fletcher – 35 (75)
Cesc Fabreagas – 30 (109)
Paul Scholes – 30 (109)
Yellow cards 2009/2010
Fabrice Muamba – 11 (1)
Alex Song – 10 (2)
Kevin Davies – 9 (3)
Paul Scholes – 9 (3)
Cesc Fabregas – 5 (66)
Patrice Evra – 5 (66)
Darren Fletcher – 5 (66)
Antonio Valencia – 3 (131)
Vassiriki Diaby – 2 (197)
Valencia was United’s “dirtiest” player last season and on average received 1 yellow card per 14 fouls. Song and Diaby were Arsenal’s “dirtiest” players and received 1 yellow card per 5 fouls and 25 fouls respectively. Fabregas committed as many fouls as Scholes but the United man received more yellow cards, on average 1 per 3 fouls.
Fouls 2008/2009
Kevin Davies – 110 (1)
Neves Denilson – 57 (12)
Robin van Persie – 46 (23)
Alex Song – 44 (30)
Nemanja Vidic – 39 (51)
Cesc Fabregas – 33 (84)
Vassiriki Diaby – 31 (96)
Darren Fletcher – 28 (121)
Paul Scholes – 17 (211)
Yellow cards 2008/2009
Marouane Fellaini – 12 (1)
Wilson Palacios – 12 (1)
Wayne Rooney – 8 (12)
Gael Clichy – 7 (24)
Cesc Fabregas – 7 (24)
Patrce Evra – 6 (44)
Alex Song – 6 (44)
Vassiriki Diaby – 5 (65)
Nemanja Vidic – 5 (65)
Robin van Persie – 5 (65)
Kevin Davies – 4 (91)
Darren Fletcher – 4 (91)
Neves Denilson – 3 (131)
Paul Scholes – 3 (131)
Vidic was United’s “dirtiest” player and received an average of 1 yellow card per 8 fouls. Denilson was Arsenal’s “dirtiest” player and received an average of 1 yellow per 19 fouls. Scholes received an average of 1 yellow per 6 fouls, Fabregas with 1 per 5 fouls.
Fouls 2007/2008
John Carew – 93 (1)
Emmanuel Adebayor – 57 (15)
Mathieu Flamini – 56 (17)
Wes Brown – 47 (30)
Gael Clichy – 39 (52)
Patrice Evra – 36 (65)
Nemanja Vidic – 35 (73)
Paul Scholes – 31 (100)
Francesc Fabregas – 29 (114)
Yellow cards 2007/2008
Michael Brown – 11 (1)
Nicky Butt – 11 (1)
El-Hadji Diouf – 11 (1)
Cesc Fabregas – 9 (8)
Wes Brown – 8 (13)
Wayne Rooney – 8 (13)
Gael Clichy – 6 (33)
Mathieu Flamini – 5 (56)
Nemanja Vidic – 5 (56)
Patrice Evra – 4 (100)
Emmanuel Adebayor – 3 (139)
Paul Scholes – 3 (139)
Wes Brown was United’s “dirtiest” player and collected on average 1 yellow per 5 fouls. Adebayor was Arsenal’s and collected on average 1 yellow per 19 fouls. Scholes was given 1 yellow per 10 fouls, Fabregas 1 yellow per 3 fouls.
Fouls 2006-2007
Kevin Davies – 88 (1)
Wayne Rooney – 48 (33)
Cesc Fabregass- 45 (43)
Paul Scholes – 43 (48)
Nemanja Vidic – 36 (73)
Gilberto – 34 (83)
Gabriel Heinze – 28 (107)
Kolo Toure – 27 (119)
Yellow cards 2006-2007
Nigel Reo-Coker – 13 (1)
Jens Lehmann – 8 (17)
Robin van Persie – 8 (17)
Paul Scholes – 8 (17)
Cesc Fabregas – 7 (27)
Nemanja Vidic – 7 (27)
Wayne Rooney – 6 (40)
Kolo Toure – 6 (40)
Gabriel Heinze – 5 (60)
Patrice Evra – 4 (91)
Rooney was United’s “dirtiest” player and picked up 1 yellow per 8 fouls. Fabregas was Arsenal’s “dirtiest” player and picked up 1 yellow per 6 fouls. Scholes was United’s second “dirtiest” player and earned 1 yellow per 5 fouls.
Fouls 2005-2006
Kevin Davies – 108 (1)
Gilberto – 55 (24)
Wayne Rooney – 50 (33)
Alan Smith – 47 (39)
Cesc Fabregas – 44 (47)
Ruud van Nistelroy – 44 (47)
Jose Antonio Reyes – 41 (56)
Darren Fletcher – 32 (97)
Thierry Henry – 32 (97)
Lauren – 30 (113)
Gary Neville – 30 (113)
Paul Scholes – 25 (162)
Yellow cards 2005-2006
Phil Neville – 12 (1)
Wayne Rooney – 8 (15)
Lauren – 6 (38)
Cesc Fabregas – 5 (48)
Jose Antonio Reyes – 5 (48)
Gilberto – 5 (48)
Ruud van Nistelrooy – 5 (48)
Alan Smith – 4 (84)
Darren Fletcher – 3 (136)
Gary Neville – 3 (136)
Paul Scholes – 3 (136)
Thierry Henry – 2 (188)
Rooney was our “dirtiest” player and was given 1 yellow per 6 fouls. Gilberto was Arsenal’s “dirtiest” player and was given 1 yellow per 11 fouls. Scholes collected 1 yellow per 8 fouls.
Fouls 2004-2005
Kevin Davies – 95 (1)
Patrick Vieira – 89 (2)
Alan Smith – 45 (39)
Paul Scholes – 44 (43)
Gabriel Heinze – 38 (76)
Ashley Cole – 36 (84)
Kolou Toure – 35 (88)
Roy Keane – 34 (89)
Jose Antonio Reyes – 32 (107)
Dennis Bergkamp – 30 (119)
Francesc Fabregas – 28 (140)
John O’Shea – 28 (140)
Ruud van Nistelrooy – 25 (160)
Thierry Henry – 24 (169)
Yellow cards 2004-2005
Ray Parlour – 11 (1)
Patrick Vieira – 9 (4)
Roy Keane – 9 (4)
Ashley Cole – 7 (18)
Wayne Rooney – 7 (18)
Cesc Fabregas – 4 (67)
Gabriel Heinze – 4 (67)
Paul Scholes – 4 (67)
Jose Antonio Reyes – 3 (111)
Alan Smith – 3 (111)
Thierry Henry – 2 (175)
Dennis Bergkamp – 1 (240)
Patrick Vieira was Arsenal’s “dirtiest” player and collected 1 yellow per 10 fouls. Alan Smith was United’s “dirtiest” player and collected 1 yellow per 15 fouls. Scholes picked up 1 yellow per 11 fouls. Dennis Bergkamp on average picked up 1 yellow per 30 fouls.
Fouls 2003-2004
Patrick Vieira – 93 (1)
Phil Neville – 51 (23)
Gilberto – 50 (27)
Sol Campbell – 43 (45)
Ray Parlous – 43 (45)
Mikael Silvestre – 41 (53)
Theirry Henry – 36 (83)
Kolo Toure – 36 (83)
Paul Scholes – 31 (111)
Yellow cards 2003-2004
Paul Ince – 14 (1)
Patrick Vieira – 10 (4)
Ray Parlour – 7 (25)
Ashley Cole – 5 (58)
P Neville – 5 (58)
G Neville – 5 (58)
Lauren – 5 (58)
Paul Scholes – 5 (58)
Fouls 2002-2003
Garry Flitcroft – 83 (1)
Thierry Henry – 54 (20)
Ruud van Nistelrooy – 50 (27)
Gilberto – 47 (35)
Patrick Vieira – 45 (39)
Ray Parlous – 42 (51)
Paul Scholes – 39 (63
Yellow cards 2002-2003
Ivan Campo – 13 (1)
Thierry Henry – 8 (16)
Phil Neville – 7 (20)
Martin Keown – 6 (33)
Patrick Vieira – 6 (33)
Lauren – 6 (33)
David Beckham – 5 (61)
Ashley Cole – 5 (61)
Roy Keane – 4 (87)
Paul Scholes – 4 (87)
Fouls 2001-2002
Patrick Vieira – 86 (1)
Ray Parlour – 50 (26)
Lauren – 42 (50)
Nicky Butt – 39 (65)
Ruud van Nistelrooy – 38 (71)
Dennis Bergkamp – 37 (78)
Paul Scholes – 33 (108)
Yellow cards 2001-2002
Robbie Savage – 14 (1)
Patrick Vieira – 11 (2)
Paul Scholes – 9 (5)
Lauren – 8 (12)
Ray Parlous – 7 (27)
Fouls 2000-2001
Olivier Dacourt – 84 (1)
Patrick Vieira – 65 (12)
Nicky Butt – 51 (23)
Paul Scholes – 43 (44)
Yellow cards 2000-2001
Olivier Dacourt – 13 (1)
Nicky Butt – 8 (20)
Patrick Vieira – 6 (48)
Tony Adams – 6 (48)
Wes Brown – 5 (66)
Paul Scholes – 3 (137)
Paul Scholes isn’t the dirty player Arsene Wenger makes him out to be. Given this is the manager who is quick to accuse others of making nasty fouls, even intentionally going out to hurt his players, only to “not see” his own players guilty of the same.
“There was a bit of an over-reaction with the way it was treated,” he said of what Owen Coyle described as the ‘assault’ of William Gallas on Bolton’s Mark Davies. “If it is a bad, malicious tackle I can understand that it is shown every half an hour, but the way that happened, it can happen every game.”
Wenger was asked the question and I don’t expect him to say “no comment” but you would expect him to be a bit more dignified and respectful. Agreed, Scholes is one of the best midfielders in the country, but trying to drag his name threw the mud and bring him down a peg or two by referring to a non-existent “dark side” is fairly insulting. Cesc Fabregas has a worse disciplinary record than Scholesy, does that make him a dirty player too? Did Wenger say that former captain Patrick Vieira’s approach to the game wasn’t OK or wasn’t fair? Course not.
So, if Scholes has such a dirty side, why do so many his central midfield opponents speak so highly of him? If his approach to football was unfair, then surely those who have played against him would know all about it, right? After all, they would be the ones on the end of his dirty tackles.
Zinedine Zidane – “He’s almost untouchable in what he does. I never tire of watching him play. You rarely come across the complete footballer, but Scholes is as close to it as you can get. One of my regrets is that the opportunity to play alongside him never presented itself during my career.”
Patrick Vieira – “The player in the Premiership I admire most? Easy – Scholes.”
Tony Adams – “I really rate Paul Scholes, because he hasn’t got the high profile of many of the Manchester United players, he doesn’t get too much attention, but he is one very good player. He is an intelligent player, he works hard and he scores some great goals. He is not flamboyant and is a quiet lad off the pitch but he is a tremendous asset to Manchester United and to England. He has already got my vote as player of the year.”
Cesc Fabregas – “He is the one whose level I aspire to. He is the best player in the Premier League.”
Thierry Henry – “I can’t understand why Scholes has never won the player of the year award. He should have won it long ago. Maybe it’s because he doesn’t seek the limelight like some of the other ‘stars’.”
Edgar Davids – “I’m not the best, Paul Scholes is.”
Alan Shearer – “If you ask footballers to pick out the player they most admire, so many of them will pick Paul Scholes. He can tackle, and his passing and shooting is of the highest level. He’s the most consistent and naturally gifted player we’ve had for a long, long time.”
Eidur Gudjohnsen – “I’m more an admirer of Paul Scholes than I am of Ronaldo. Ronaldo is a fantastic player, but he has 10 other great players around him every week…Scholes is one of the most complete footballers I’ve ever seen. His one-touch play is phenomenal. Whenever I have played against him, I never felt I could get close to him.”
Oddly, not a single one of the players has a bad word to say about Scholes. No mention of his dark side, his dirtiness or his unfair approach to the game.
I guess it’s too much to ask for Wenger to show the same class.
Man Utd News 24/7
Scholes doesn’t have a dark side. The way he tackles, it can happen in every game. If Wenger said it or Gallas’ tackle, I can say it for Scholes’. I expect plenty of Arsenal fans here.
Look at all the times Kevin Davies is first, lol.
this video made up ma day :::
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZzkresBOxnQ&feature=related
erm…nice stat hunting but I think you missed the point.
Wenger was trying to say that Scholes gets away with a lot, you can not prove this with stats because it is a subjective opinion.
I think you have missed the main point of this interview, which wenger was mainly using as a way of praising scholes for his footballing ability.
The thing he said about his tackling, you cant surely argue with? I’m sure wenger would also say the same about vieira, petit, song if asked, but obviously he wouldn’t mention this as they are his players, much like fergie wouldn’t mention his own players in a bad way!
Emailed to awenger@arsenal.co.uk
You are overreacting scott.scholes is great but there is a reason its called the scholes tackle.we are not saints ourselves but scholes is even taunted by the commentators for his tackling ability.
Yellow and red cards do not measure how ‘dirty’ a player is. A hand brushed on an opponent’s face earns the same penalty as snapping someone’s leg in half. Whilst I admire you having the time to wade through these stats they don’t really resolve anything in terms of who the dirtiest players are. They also don’t take into account how many games they played so you’re not comparing like with like.
someone dust protest too much…..
you can prove nothing and everything with stats, it’s all down to interpretation
the point is that you show that you know scholes is dirty by trying to move the argument away from scholes to other teams/players, they are irrelevant, stick to scholes, this is the point
scholes undoubtedly has a dark side, but if you look at wenger’s interview properly then it is actually complementing scholes on the whole, by saying he’d have him in his side it could even be interpreted as wenger acknowledging this dirty side is needed for success
the press made a mountain out of some very reasonable comments as always, when you scratch beneath the surface then it’s not really that interesting
it is fact that man u get away with more fouls then any1 ie the double footed slide tackle flecture di d on arshavin got away with it when he ddnt even when the ball . if u looked at all songs 10 yellows each one is laughable.
Not sure what this is supposed to show exactly. Yellow cards are give for different reasons. Alex Song, for example, from watching him play a lot, typically gets yellow once a game for stopping a counterattack with a foul. It may be unsportsmanlike, but it’s not dirty, and you could argue it’s part of a defensive midfielder’s job. I don’t remember a single really dangerous tackle from Alex Song, do you? Whereas Paul Scholes’ penchant for “clumsy” tackles I thought was accepted fact even for United fans.
To be fair, here at Arsenal, we seem to have a young Paul Scholes by the name of Jack Wilshere, and he’s also one to go into a challenge without thinking too much about the other guy, and I don’t mind it, as we are missing a bit of that and it speaks well of his fight. But you have to be honest about your guys. You’ve seen Scholes going into tackles like that for fifteen years or so. Are you really you sure you don’t agree with Wenger he’s got a bit of a dirty streak?
analysis based purely on stats of red/yellow cards is irrelevant IF arsenal players are generally booked more often for similar fouls than united p.ayers/if united players are generally let off bookings even if they commit murder…….
So Wenger basically says the refs let Scholes get away with far too much and you use stats based on how the refs punish players to say that’s not true?
Don’t united fans call scholes ginger ninja?…scholes is certainly underrated,even zidane praised him alot.he is a rare type of player especially in England and is a joy to watch.
Costas – “The way he tackles”
Lets be clear here, we are talking about a guy who has played at the top level in CM for nigh on 20 years. I’ve always found it incredible that he seems to get a free pass on his poor tackling, based on the theory that he’s just a poor tackler.
It simply cannot be true that a player that good does not know when he is going to get the ball or the man. No way can that be true.
I think you are reading too much into this mate. As an Arsenal fan I can see that Wenger is praising Scholes by saying what a good player he is but is also saying that there is a darker side to his game and that is his tackling. Scholes is not good at tackling, now if that is bcause he mistimes tackles or because he has a nasty streak in him only Scholes can answer that but I think that it is a fair point to make when talking about him as a player.
Very skillful player but he does have a dirty side, anyone who watches him knows this. No big deal and certainly not worth digging up all these stats which prove i dont know what?
I think you missed the intent of Wenger’s comments, which I took to mean the quality not quantity of Scholes’ tackles. Surely even the most dyed-in-the-wool Red Devils supporter can’t say that Scholes is even a “good” tackler. It’s not even really a slight, Bergkamp made some truly atrocious tackles in his day.
Of course wenger is right. No wonder a certain Fabregas once said that he would love to be like Scholes, or Zidane called him the ‘almost complete’ midfielder.
Your arguement is irrelevant – fouls and yellow cards are a referees interpretation of incidents and some players only need to appear on a pitch to have refs excited. You ignore playing time/games played. You miss Wengers point totally – he admires Scholes, would love to have him on his team but dislikes some of his characteristics. Hell he could probably say the same about some of his own players. Grow up and get a life and stop jumping at perceived criticism of your beloved warriors.
This is an overreaction. Bring out all the stats you want. If Gilberto makes more fouls than Scholes in a league season, doesn’t mean Scholes is a better tackler. It’s not all black and white. Scholes has come up with MANY poor tackles in his career, something all United fans are aware of, which is why even commentators and pundits call many bookable fouls as a “Typical Scholes Tackle”.
All United fans know what Wenger meant in his comments. Do yourselves a favour and focus on more important things. Scholes has nothing to prove to anyone, so neither should you. He’s a brilliant footballer, who has a tendency to make poor tackles. What’s the big deal? Get over Wenger’s comments, and thank your stars that Scholes plays for you.
Everyone knows he can’t tackle…..
Great player, but hides his dirtiness behind the “it’s not my fault, i’ve never learnt how to tackle” routine.
For anyone to suggest Cesc is actually dirtier, is a joke. Scholes would have 10 times as many red cards if he wasn’t english…
Simmo – Where does Wenger say Scholes gets away with a lot? Where does he even imply that Scholes gets away with a lot?
He said Scholes tackled unfairly. He said Scholes’ approach to the game is not OK. He said Scholes is not a fair player. He said that Scholes has a dark side to him.
Did Wenger say anything about referees, how many fouls Scholes gets away with or anything like you just claimed he did? All I see is a character assassination. Clearly he “didn’t see” Patrick Vieira in action all the time he was at Arsenal. Because if Scholes has a dark side to him, Vieira was the fucking devil!
I think you have forgotten to facor in the fact that refs are petrified of booking United players.
So your analysis doesn’t really add up to much.
Scholes – brilliant player, but you can’t deny he regularly puts in really badly-timed, two footed, lunges.
“Paul Scholes is still one of the greatest football players in England and his contribution to the success of Manchester United is absolutely huge”
If this is an ‘attempt’ at praise, I’d love to see someone sucessfully carry it out. Listen, he was asked a question and answered it. Would you prefer he refused to talk to certain parts of the media because he didnt like the way they reported what he said?
We all rate Scholes but even Utd fans I know admit that a) he can be dirty and knows what he’s doing when he leaves his mark on someone and b) that he gets away with a lot because of his persona, professionalism off field & standing in the English game. I don’t think the dig was at Scholes but at the refs & more so the media, who laugh it off “haha, Scholesy cant takle, haha” when he’s just smashed through the back of someone.
Push out all the stats you want but weve been in the top 3 of the fair play league for quite a while now and in most seasons have had a higher card:foul ratio than anyone.
just got an email reply from Wenger
he said “he didnt see them”
These are fouls booked for not commited. It would be a very different story was that the case.
@1979gooner
How come scholes a dirty player.Just because he is a hard tackler it doesnt make him a dirty player.Sorry dude but your wenger is a cry baby.If you had a scholes like player then wenger would have said he is the best tackler in the world.Your ALex song also makes some dirty tackles but that doesnt make him a dirty player.I think wenger just want to be in the spotlighty making some silly and absurd comments.Frankly speaking i respect wenger as a manager but he is a cry baby.
only problem is your not taking into account of minutes played. scholes doesn’t play as many games as some of these other guys. an theres no defending his tackling he’s renound for it! its one of the things that makes scholes, surely u know that!
scholes has got a bit of a dark side lets be honest. what i will say though is he is not a dirty player like you find in teams like bolton etc. He doesnt always go out to get someone, infact i think he hardly ever does that. what he does do however is tackle like a lemon. awfully timed tackles are his specialty but its not really dirty, it just looks bad. I really like, rate and respect him as a player. Club loyalty aside, he is a true legend in the game.
anyone else notice how dirty davies has been? OMFG what a thug!
Hi ManU fans, you’re overreacting and being hyper sensitive about Wenger’s comments. I think Arsene’s comments on ‘Dirty’ Scholes should be put into its context: A highly creative and flair and attack minded player who happens to do some dirty work A LA MACHERANO. This means that Wenger wouldn’t have used ‘dirty’ for a , say, MACHERANO because he knows well that his work is all about being bully and dirty. If you look back at Schools of the earlier part of the last decade you’ll realise that he committed some very dirty tacklers. But, Wenger acknowledged the other good, bright side of his footballing career. I agree with Wenger that he was a dirty player although I believe he eradicated that side a little bit as he gets older. One thing is sure: Schools is a legend of the premiere league and a talented player, in my opinion, the most gifted, natural and flair player England ever had.
Now I know I’ll stick for coming on here as a gooner, but I have done so for some time now! Scholes is a genius and the best player in his position England have produced in decades, and was woefully under-utilised by the national team. His passing, shooting, awareness etc are second to none, but his tackling has always been absolutely awful. His level of commitment in the challenge is no greater than a Keane, Vieira, Gerrard type midfielder, but his actual tackling technique and timing are awful and always have been, and he totally crunches several people a season. He also can be a spiteful sod if things are going wrong, though he never resorted to a RVN sly punch or stamp, and to his credit, Scholes has never feigned injury or tried to get a fellow pro sent off.
Re your statistical ‘anyalysis’ (apart from being spectacularly anal!), firstly you have been drawing comparisons to the likes of Vieira, Gilberto and Song…ball winning defensive midfielders (though paddy was a bit dirty and more than 1 dimensional), who’s primary job is to break up play, not to mention that Arsenal’s tactical naivity often leaves the likes of Song and Gilberto before him totally exposed on a regular basis. Cynical fouls, perhaps, but seldom ‘dirty’ or dangerous tackles. Song is prime example of this… he picks up a good few bookings, but like Gilberto is one of the most passive players at the club…in fact he hardly ever attempts lunging tackles.
Arsenal could do with a few more physically intimidating players at the mo. Gallas’s shocker last year was suprisingly out of character, and the occasional cesc or RVP dummy spitting out moment aside, there is barely any one who will give the opposition a ‘dig’ in the squad. Also we all know that playing for man u gets you a bye or two from refs, in the same way it was for Liverpool when they were last relevant. I think Di Canio summed up Old Trafford refereeing most eloquently….”The only way u can get a penalty at OT is unless Jaap Stam takes out a sub machine gun and shoots u in the box 18″ Not to mention Mike Riley!
Good to see Kevin Davies outed as the dirty cheating scumbag we ALL know he is. (And how did a coward like Reyes get more bookings than Alan Smith!)
Number of yellows and fouls has nothing to do with how dirty a player it mate. Get off the stats, you’re f*ckin obsessed with them.
Everyone knows SOng gets a yellow card for his 1st tackle in every game, especially if Webb is the ref. Scholes gets a lot of lee way.
And Song is more clumsy than dirty. Use observations, not stats. Same goes to Denilson, Diaby, etc. Rules are different for Arsenal than they are for the likes of Stoke, which further highlights the incompetent refereeing in this country.
Wenger didn’t say Scholes was dirty. he said he has a dark side to him. Who was the first player haggling the ref for a penalty against Fulham? Scholes.
Giggs and Scholes do this a lot, but no one ever takes notice.
United will have to pay 60k a year because of Fergie’s stance against the BBC.
It’s not hell lot of money.
Sorry for off topic.
Arsene played a mind game here to bring the refs into attention. Just the way he successfully did last season to Faletcher.
@ash – I cant remember a bad/wipeout tackle from Song, ever. As for Wenger being a cry baby, it wasnt post match or connected to an Arsenal v Utd game, so I dont see your point? Talking of sulkers, how was Fergies interview on MOTD at the weekend? Think I missed it….
AW has answered a question with his gooners hat on . Its only a few years ago he was famous for saying he never saw the incidents his players were involved in .
@1979gooner
“Someone dust protest too much”….
….this is what happens when Gooners try to quote Shakespeare. Stick to what you know, like moaning about how rough all the other teams are…..poor little Gooners.
Funny how Fergie’s refusal to talk to the Beeb just gives the impression much more strongly that his was getting Martin Edwards sponsored back-handers. Wenger is a bit of a moaner and needs to accept that other people’s pinciples are also valid, but Fergie for all his brilliance can be a spiteful bully.
This is the biggest waste of effort on your part. You’ve gone and collected all your little stats and proved precisely squat. Everyone knows man utd get an easy time from refs. Just as everyone knows scholes is a dirty player. Stats for fouls and cards thus mean precisely nothing.
Im an arsenal fan and im happy to admit weve had our fair share of dirty players down the years. Vieira, cesc, Luhzny. Vivas have all had their nasty streaks, but scholes is dirty and if you dont see that then you might as well not be watching football because your blind.
And even though weve had our troubles with refs, i honestly do not believe weve ever had a nasty side to us on the level of united. Fletcher, hughes, scholes, etc…fergie has brought through generation after generation of nasty bastards.
And before i get accused of being biased, i would never level that accusation at spurs or chelsea since the millenium, nor liverpool. United are a great team no doubt, but they have also been for a long while a pretty dirty team. Live with it.
Schools is a legend of the premier league, so is Paul Scholes by the way. Wengers a hypocrite, always has been, always will be.
JB has a valid point about referees. Have at look at how refs judge tackles by people like Gerrard and Terry … and Scholes. Then compare it with how they judge tackles by “foreign types”. Like it or not, Scholes has been treated most “fairly” by refs, particularly at Old Trafford.
Your criticism of Wenger’s comments seem churlish. He has taken the time to answer questions about another club’s player and has been honest in his appraisal. He has heaped praise on Scholes’ contribution to top-level football. That he also mentions the obvious … “He has a dark side” … despite the current Scholes love-in, is to Wenger’s honour.
@hooligankicker – did you know the word pedant was first coined by Shakespeare? Just a thought….
mourinho was right, that wenger is a voyeur.
A far more entertaining quote than Wenger or Shakespeare:
“In Madrid, it was easy because I lived in a hotel. The bell boy’s job was to bring me three pastries after sex. He would hand me the pastries, I would hand him the girl, and he’d return her into the night. Sex plus pastries – could it be any better?” – January 2009 – Antonio Cassano gives an insight into his days at Real Madrid.
Ferguson refused to talk about Scholes to BBC. So Wenger did it for him. I don’t see much of an issue.
,Matthew Wade says
we all know that playing for man u gets you a bye or two from refs
Yeah we got a bye or two when drogba cunt was awarded a offside goal at old trafford.
We got a bye or two when chelsea were given another illegal goal at stamford bridge.
We got a bye or two when fletcher(football genius) was awarded a red card at old trafford against your team in the champs league sf 2nd leg.
We got a bye or two when rafael was sent off unnecessarily at old trafford against bayern.
I can give 50 more incidences like this.
Accept it refs hate us more than they do.But unfortunately you guys think they favour us.If you say this as favour then you have gone mad.You guys also get fair share of luck from refs,for that matter every team gets that but i think we are the one who gets least benifited from the ref.
And mr wade for your kind information every player tackles for winning the ball and not the leg.Scholes is also a ball winning mid fielder unfortunately for you and fortunately for us he tackles hard.But that doesnt make him dirty.You need to have talent to tackle hard.Lol
Wow arse fans getting excited because they get to post on big clubs blog.
Scholes tenacity is part of what makeS him the player he is. Arsene is upset that all players hes developed (which is a fair few top players) none have been or ever will reach the level of scholes. When wenger spoutes shite like that and about fletcher being anti football, i don’t want to hear any arse fans whining again when he gets abused at OT.
You missed the point here, i dont think Paul Scholes makes a lot of fouls, what Wenger was pointing at is what everyone knows, when Scholes actually tackles its always cynical and rush, of all the things he has learned tackling is one thing he hasnt and usually he is a very dirty tackler
@SharkeySure
You see, I never understood how he gets a free pass for his poor tackling. Is he expected to get a red card in every game? People are starting to speak about him like he is Nwil Raddock for fuck sake. He is poor at tackling but that doesn’t mean that every tackle is horrendous one and it deserves a yellow. Plus, I don’t see how poor tackling = dark side. Scholes never sets out to deliberately hurt an opponent. Sorry. For me, elbowing a player at the back of the neck(lie Gerrard did last year) is a better example of that.
- In 09-10 Scholes has 11 yellow and 1 red
- In 08-09: 7 yellow and 2 red
- In 07-08: 4 yellow and 0 red
- In 06-07: 12 yellow and 2 red
- In 05-06: 5 yellow and 1 red
- In 04-05: 7 yellow and 1 red
- In 03-04: 10 yellow and 0 red
- In 02-03: 8 yellow and 0 red
- In 01-02: 15 yellow and 0 red
That’s the stats I found from espn from the last 10 years. Doesn’t exactly spell free pass does it?
*Neil Raddock* i meant.
The problem with some stats is that bias and racism doesnt come into it.
I guess we are all biased to an extent with the teams we support but I say that the refs in england are biased toward their hometown stars.
For me certain players in the EPL get away with murder – I have seen scholes with some dirty tackles and he barely gets a warning. Gerrard and Terry are others.
My opinion that these stats are skewed big time.
This is a pointless article, Scott. You are completely missing the point. Wenger was asked about Scholes. Not Viera, not Davies, not Kean. The question was about Scholes. He praised him for the great talent he has and when asked if he thought Scholes has a “darker side”, he said yes. Scholes is no saint and has made many terrible tackles in his career and you cant deny it.
As for the stats you provided; they are very mis-leading. Some players get booked for nothing fouls like hand balls, little pushes, kicking the ball away etc. some are wrongfully booked and some are not booked when they should be. So you see, your stats prove nothing.
Again, this is a pointless article. Try again when you actually have something valid to use as an argument.
tackle is a part of the game sometimes goes right sometimes wrong.about wenger his team contains the most number of rash players.from the past harry kewell,bergkamp..from present clichy .even pires who was the most significant player also in some cases was rough.mark overmars,sol campbell are few of them.
Arsenal supporters, no reason to get upset. One will never be able to convince supporters of another team that their player is dirty or that there is bias in the EPL.
Supporters are intentionally blind, regardless of what team you support.
@Costas… I guessed you meant that lardy sod! Scholes stats are despite the free pass! The man can’t tackle pure and simple! Actually in all honest, the refs have caught up with him in recent years, but tackles like that shocker on Busquets (who deserves all the pain that can find him) in the 09 CL final are worse than red cards we see every week in the EPL. If it had been Joey Barton, they’d have taken him outside and shot him there and then (which again I could live with).
@Ash…..doesn’t it occur to you that every team could run off a roll call of injustices if they wanted. Chelsea are the top team at present and therefore are getting lots of benefits from the ref. Fletcher was unlucky, but he who lives by the sword…..Rafael’s red card was harsh but technically correct. I too could come up with a list the length of your arm, noteably the linesman who cost us the 2006 champion’s league final…..
This is why i hate posts that focus on stats because they almost always, intentionally or otherwise, mistake correlation for causation as well as being really selective about what stats they choose to include.
As somebody else noted the number of fouls, yellow and red cards doesn’t necessarily prove who is the dirtiest I mean what defines dirty? surely its too abstract and subjective to be able to prove with a closed system like statistics.
Even if we assume that we could mean the stat to counter all those stats is, in the champions league nobody has been booked more times than Paul Scholes.
lastly, if paul scholes is unfair as wenger called him why does other people’s guilt make him any less guilty. I mean if you steal once a week just because some other bloke steals 3 times a week does not make you any less of a thief.
Oh and Gerrard does indeed get away with murder to a greater degree than scholes.
“I did not like some things he did on the football pitch …” – of course you didn’t, not from the other end, you sissy loser! All I can say is that Paul Scholes is a winner, unlike Wenger and his band of boyscouts. If a CMF has a little bit of aggro and is intelligent enough to use that aggro to warn off rivals without crossing limits, then my respect for him goes up manifold! When AW calls that “the dark side” – its like a small boy looking for Voldemorts under the bed! The man should have been an art curator, fondling fragile statues all day, instead of being a top flight football manager. But fact is, that all his supposed football idealism is BS – the man is just a sore loser and the world knows it. And that’s not his dark side, it plain fucking funny!
http://d.yimg.com/i/ng/sp/empics/20090829/19/610789703-soccer-barclays-premier-league-manchester-united-v-arsenal-old-trafford.jpg
Wenger has always been a cry baby.I still remember when last season we beat arsenal at old trafford ,in that match fletcher was the best player by far.wenger said after the match that fletcher is a bad tackler.He doesnt know how to tackle.So its nothing new from mr wenger.Always cries like a 3 year old boy who wants other toys to play with eventhough he has his own.
WENGER=CRY BABY
It depends what you call clever and what you call dirty,” said Wenger, who was asked whether he felt Scholes tackled unfairly. “Unfairly, of course, unfairly,” he replied. “How many times have you watched Paul Scholes? Have you seen only fair tackles from Paul Scholes? I don’t want to come out on one specifically but I can remember a few. [They are] a bit in the past, yes, but look at him playing now. He still doesn’t hide. No, I don’t [think his approach is OK]. You ask me about the quality of the player – who wouldn’t like a Paul Scholes in his team? You ask me: ‘Was he a fair player?’ I say: ‘No, I’m sorry, for me he was not a fair player.’ I just think I respect him highly as a quality player. I did not like some things he did on the football pitch and I have the right to say that. It’s not because you are older, suddenly, that you are a saint.”
I love scholesy but we must accept that our players are not saints by default and what that clown wenger said, he’s perfectly spot on…although i don’t think that scholes intends to harm anyone ( like gallas ) he is careless in his tackles
PAUL N – SPOT ON!!
We’re all willfully biased; the best way to get an ‘objective’ point of view from a football fan is to ask him about a team that he doesn’t support; I’m a Goner – ask me about Spurs, Liverpool, Chelsea, United, I’ll tell it how i see it, and the same is true of arsenal BUT when I talk about Arsenal, I know i tend to look through rose-tinted glasses.
IMHO, United are generally a team whose players occupy that margin between ‘gamesmanship’ and filth – I can think of plenty of occasions where I’ve felt a huge sense of injustice after being beaten by United over the years, I can’t say the same when we’ve lost to Chelsea, or Liverpool (or Spurs, although of cousre, they’ve only beaten us once in the last 20 years r something; )
good point tho.
ps – for my money – Scholes has been a great player, and I totally agree with Arsene – he has a dark side, he sometimes reacts to what he perceives as being injustice meted out upon him, but given the lenght of his career and the fact that he has been under intense srutiny for being a United player for most of it, thats hardly a huge surprise – to get to the top and stay at the top for a long time, you ahve to know how to play the game, and i’m not just talking technical ability, you need to be able to ‘get away with it’ as often as possible – fellow Gooners – can’t we say the same about Bergkamp? Utter genius (IMHO a genuine world-class player, i’d say better than scholes, but see above re bias) – but lets face it, he was a dirty cnt when he knew nobody was looking – i’m rememberig a flick in the eye on bowyer at highbury, for instance, that really got the crowd going!
@Matthew Wade
I agree that he can’t tackle. Not well anyway. However, he does intrcept passes quite well. It’s not like he always has to resort to tackling. Don’t know if the refs have found him out in recent seasons. Maybe Scholes is going into mistimed challenges more often due to his age. Look guys, I understand your sceptism when it comes to stats. But, in order to say that Scholes gets a free pass despite of these stats, you must have watched a very good portion of his matches. I have and I can say that he doesn’t get a free pass too often. I could argue(since we are talking about players we have watcheda lot) that Rooney’s temper got more of a free pass in his youth than Scholes did.
Thanks for mentioning Busquets. I almost forgot to mention that tackle. That’s one time where there was bad intent. No doubt. Won’t make excuses for Paul. I’ll just echo your sentiment about Busquets. A cheat of the highest order. Mourinho can attest.
@geneside – Bergkamp was not immune to the odd shocker, I confess, but clichy, overmars, Pires?! Are you serious! Especially overmars who i don’t remember trying to make a tackle in 3 years, and Pires who was publicly described by his manager as ‘not the bravest’. Not to mention your obscure Harry Kewell reference – he went to liverpool not arsenal!
@ Paul N – true indeed. But then Scott started this one!
@Jeet….Wenger IS a bad loser. The rest of your post is nonsense. ‘Not crossing limits….’? That’s exactly the point. Nice use of the word manifold though!
Listing off stats misses the point. Scholes gets (got) away with more because he was an English international. Even commentators give him the benefit of the doubt cos he can’t tackle- very few other players get this benefit, and i include Roy Keane and Vieira in this. Aln Shearer could do no wrong either despite some despicable ‘challenges’.
Listing players nice comments about him is absolutley irrelevant also.
Yet again you take issue with comments wenger makes- he is giving an honest opinion and not the p.c. one the english media wanted. Wenger is always good for a quote or two on this site because he always enngages the media and answers questions (even when he probably shouldn’t) unlike some managers who seem to be selective about what they say and who they say it to. Can’t think of any off hand…..
just because scholes does not tackle properly he is said to have a “dark” side..now what kind of bullshit is this????tell me 1 player who has never made an ill timed tackle in his career???i won go to the extent of calling him a saint on the field because most of his tackles are pretty poor but they are usually done to break up the opposition’s play..and there is nothing wrong in it because that’s a part of his job.. i’m sure even the likes of song,cesc or any othe midfielder are told to do this by their manager..but in no means does this classify them as “dirty” players..
And mr.wenger if this is ur way of praising someone then please, in the future, do not comment on any of our players..
Good stuff, Scott. Can’t argue with the statistics.
I understand the argument coming from Arsenal fans but I personally see no reason why Wenger had to comment on his supposed ‘dark side’. Being as experienced as he is, he surely knows how the media works; he can praise him all he likes for 20 minutes but a comment like that is certainly going to be picked up by the media. If that’s his opinion, that’s his opinion. Not going to contest that – but Wenger should know his audience. Quality manager, but comments weren’t needed, frankly.
Hahaha I was wondering how long this would take to appear on my newsnow feed.
Didn’t Wenger actually praise Scholes throughout most of the interview even suggesting that he rates him as one of the greatest English players? Scholes has a dark side to his game? So what!!! We’ve had plenty at Arsenal, Keown, Viera, Bergkamp are all names that spring to mind, however all were great players for us. Most Arsenal fans I know rate Scholes highly, I think he’s an amazing player and like him even more due to the fact that keeps such a low profile.
Lads,
Fantastic Post … Nice one! Once of the best posts ive seen!
I haven’t red the posts so i dont know what people are saying, However as always im going to be honest! I dont know if i could class Scholes as having a dark side but i know he likes to let players know he is there! Scholes isn’t the Tallest of Midfielders in the world!
A majority of us have played football, When you came across your opponent early in the game you always wanted to let him know you where there! This is what i think scholes does!
When you look at his so called bad tackles, they will be late. Or he will let the attacker know he is there but will you see him go in Waste High with studs showing trying to nail the player? No!
Wenger is a complete cock when it comes to giving views on united players!
Look at the above post Wenger! You also labled Fletcher a continual Fouler!! What does them stats say!
Cesc Fabregas could run onto the pitch with a baseball bat, knock someone over the head infront of the dug out and knock them out! Wengers interview would be ” i didnt see the incident i’m going to have to review it on TV”………. we have a TV footage here …. ” it still is hard to tell what has happened from that camera angle, will need to review it later!”………… the block is a cock!
@ Ash…thanks for your contribution to the debate. A well reasoned and carefully constructed argument….thats the kin of thing I would expect from an old Chav scum head-hunter. Idiot!
@ CROoney – i agree that Scholes is invariably not out to injure people (that one on busquets aside – why do nice blokes like Eduardo, Ramsey, Hargreaves get terrible injuries and that a-hole doesn’t….better anti-god argument than Dawkins)
@Costas – agree the comparison with Rooney’s temper. I think young players do get excused more, and that’s probably fair enough if they are not endangering the welfare of fellow professionals
@gooner77
OMG – a sensible post from an arsenal fan! What ever next!
Question for you lad! Do you think Arsenal will change their style this year. There constant Style of trying to walk the ball into the net or Look for the perfect goal drives me nuts!….. I by far do not support Arsenal however some games last season i was even shouting… FFS Bloody Shoot!
i predict you will finish 4TH this year!
My top 4 are
United
Chelsea
Shitty ( i know! I know I know! Easy Lads!)
Arsenal!
@gooner77
Haven’t seen you here in quite a while. Hope you are well. I was going to mention Keown, but I didn’t want to ruffle any feathers and start another Ruud-Keown debate!
@Matthew Wade
Nah, Rooney didn’t endanger other players often. The problem was his mouth, lol.
Dark side is also harassing the ref and Giggs and Scholes do that quite a lot.
Many people fail to notice this. Look how quickly Scholes was in the refs face when Duff handled the ball. That was never a penalty in the 1st place.
Ash, you can complain about Chelsea’s goals against United last season, but Evans should’ve seen red and Chelsea should’ve had a penalty when he karate kicked Drogba. That is a foul inside the box. Djourou had one called against him even though he made no contact with the player.
The 2nd game: don’t count Drogba’s offside goal, then don’t count Macheda’s handball. Same result.
Rafael was rightly sent off. You can’t foul like that on a counter. Sheer stupidity.
Wenger was saying he’s a good player. it is a FACT that he does perform the odd ott tackle. FFS it’s even called “a paul scholes tackle” when something is named after you it usualy says a lot!! i personally think the guy deserves respect but he IS a bit dirty. and using stats to back up an argument that is largely subjective is pointless, i can argue that Man U never get as many decisions against them as they should or that teams can foul arsenal til the cows come home but we get the fouls and cards for our tackles which usually are about every 4th or 5th tackle in the game.
And by harassing, I’m not comparing it to how the Chav scum do it. But, they are always the first to complain and surround the ref.
@utd4life – he was asked a direct question, and unlike other managers, he speaks to the press. Scholes isn’t Stoke or Bolton dirty, but his breaking up tackles are certainly of a firm nature shall we say. Trevor’s assessment on this is more honest!
Also re Fletcher, before his massive improvement over the last three years, he did just kicking small creative midfielders (regardless of opposition), and obviously this was keenly felt by Wenger and his small creative midfielder breeding programme. Fletcher was like a less progressive tougher Ray Parlour, and has become a very good all-round player. I think even arsene would concede that he has become a much more rounded player, but there was one game where he just kicked our midfield off the park and didn’t get booked. Quality player now.
And for those all het up about the comments, he did previously state that Bergkamp had a darker side, but no one was interested in that
@Pat
The Evans karate kick was outside the box. United were more robbed than Chelsea in that game.
The Emirates Stadium… United playing Arsenal… Paul Scholes receives the ball from the wing, picks out a famous name wearing an i’m-above-all-this look on his face,and kaboom…
Headlines.
Paul Scholes guns down Gunners boss.
@ pat
“harassing the ref”..you must be referring to ballack mate..
Any player would have been at the ref’s face if he saw the ball touch the opposing players hand..
as for the karate kick against drogba..maybe the ref didn witness the incident and he thought drogba was just acting( and lets face it he does that a lot)
Pat- Hi mate. Long time no see. How’ve you been?
That karate kick on Drogba was outside the box, first of. And that was just two players colliding, nothing more. One just happened to collide with his foot, the other with his chest.
@boogeyman
Here’s proof of the collision outside the box:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K7-RXM5sg7k
Look at the twat’s theatricks after the kick.
manutd24 said “Good stuff, Scott. Can’t argue with the statistics.”
There in lies the problem with stats, you cannot argue with them and win.
Though I am quite sure this is true, one cannot have a stat for favoritism or racism.
Its there and we all know but how do you prove it.
I would dare say that United as the darlings of the EPL (and Pool I guess) have received their share of good fortune from the refs. (I am not saying this to stir crap up, I just believe it to be true.)
All in all, this article could focused on the positive of Wenger statment which was 90% of the whole.
But we are humans after all, we always go for the negative.
Scott the red said:
“Wenger then attempted to praise our player but couldn’t do so without again questioning his character.”
No disrespect but thats a disingenuous statement to me. Wenger seems to be very sincere in what he said.
in a nutshell he is saying – “Sholes is a great player who I would love to have on my team but he tackles dirty quite often”
I’m surprised the amount of utd fans who are so up-in-arms about this… If Fergie said Bergkamp was a great player but could put in a bad tackle everyone would agree – because he did. The statistics probably don’t bear that out, because it didn’t happen very often, similar to Scholes, even Pele could stick his boot in. We can say that without it detracting from what fantastic footballers they all are/were… Not every negative comment about a player is meant as a sideswipe, Wenger has been rightly fulsome is his praise of Scholes.
@Costas…the funny thing about Keown was he wasn’t on the whole that dirty…he was just an animal in certain games. And despite all the antipathy down the years, RVN was the only regular Utd player I would say was a geniune cheating scumbag, from diving, to studs up tackles nowhere near the ball, to sly off the ball punches and kicks. To meet Scholes, beckham, giggs, even Neville would be an honour, but RVN would disgust me. Keane was a funny one. Generally hard but fair, but occasionally a total utter psychopath of genuinely scary nature. Can’t believe he didn’t get done more for the Haaland thing.
Vieira could be dirty too, but oddly many of his sending offs were for nothing offences….like when he got sent off for swearing at a ref vs chelsea, when it was later proved through lip synching that the ref lied. Sometimes was lucky not to get carded more, but there was one year he got 4 reds, and only one was for a bad tackle.
Bergkamp was generally fair, but like a milder Keane had a switch in his brain that sometimes flicked to red, and was lucky that he was such a bad tackler he couldn’t even crunch people when he wanted to.
Old timers like Dixon, Winterburn, Bould etc were definitely dirty on occasions. Dixon used to kick lumps out of Ginola…
Does anyone know where we are with Rooney’s new contract? Why is this taking so long? First we were told it would happen before the World Cup… and later than it would happen after the World Cup. Surely this should be easy to sort!
Stop the press . . . Scholes sometimes commits professional fouls when his team are out of position!!! I’m pretty sure all players commit cynical fouls from time to time; a world full of Linekers would be a pretty bland place (add salt & vinegar as desired).
Ignore the comments; it’s the usual nonsense from Wenger and his ridiculous fairytale outlook on football. Although I admire some of his qualities as a manager I think he would have been better suited to Ballet. You may as well start the argument about football being an unfair sport if you’re going to drag Scholes into an argument like this; Fabregas is equally guilty of this kind of play, never in a million years would I dream of mentioning that side of his game when talking about/admiring the guy.
@utd4life – The Karate kick was a bit much!!! De Jong’s got slightly more bad press though! Evans totally lined him up first as well.
Nice to see none of us will miss that cheating scumbag Ballack.
@Costas – Drogba was obviously practicing the fit for when he plays Othello….
Nick-Riley – its true Pele could be a dirty sod when he wanted…
@matthew wade
i definitely will agree that scholes tackles are of a firm nature but as trevor said they are usually done to let them know that he’s there else their midfield will just run riot..and his tackles are not the kind where he goes in with his studs up..
He could have instead said that “scholes is a great player who is bad at tackling” but to tell that he has a dark side is just lame..
To be fair. Scholes really cant tackle. Whether this is purposeful or not we would have to ask Paul.
Costa- Those theatrics made my brother and I laugh like idiots for hours lol.
Sam – Your post is a post of a child mate. To claim that United have always been dirty team and Sir Alex has brought through generation of nasty bastards, sounds very bitter to me, sure you’re not jealous of United’s success? Every team has had there fair share of hard players and every team needs that type of player, but that doesn’t mean United, or anyone else is a dirty team.
@Matthew Wade
There was one dark morning somewhere around June where United were linked to Ballack. I’ve never been more terrified in my life.
I admit that I don’t remember Bergkamp being a bad tackler. Didn’t watch a lot of him of course. Quality player though. It’s a shame we can’t get you guys to like RVN! Doesn’t that high challenge on Ashley Cole feel better now?
Pat – Are you an Arsenal fan? Every time your on here, you always mention Drogba, and the kick by Evans on him, sure you’re not a closet Chelsea fan?
Dixon never kicked lumps out of Giggsy, he never got that close.
fkkk u wenger no one was dirty than your fxxking viera adams dixon and keown
hi all just watching mutv our reserve team are: gary smalling wes rafa carrick ando cleveley and kiko
vs the no one know shitty kid even vs shiity team yesterday i also full of confidence come on umited!
@utd4life – I think that’s true MOST of the time, but sometimes he eyes people up and (particularly when with a sense of injustice) very consciously takes them out. Mostly its bad tackling, but sometimes…….
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W66JLyOAt7g
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vB2h1ynKLII&p=44CEA090E379F19D&playnext=1&index=23 (love the commentator!)
He never did this though…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pr2Ts5CEktA&p=B9AF30AD27385A2B&playnext=1&index=22
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xIp6cxOjKUE
And Gerrards worst tackles are worse
Many people are missing the point- Wenger was ASKED about Scholes. You don’t think he got up that morning and said to himself ‘I think I’ll give the media a few lines about Scholesy today ….just for the craic.’
Most quotes from managers come from direct questions put to them and Wenger always gives an answer when asked- he doesn’t get up and walk out, he doesn’t tell the interviewer to ‘f#@k off’ and not quote him etc.
90 % of the interview was in praise and he other 10% was stating what we all know- he’s hardly going to come out and say he was a dirty c@~t who couldn’t tackle! So he used the words ‘dark side’ big deal. Its obviously offended some Star Wars fans or something.
This is a nothing story but well done Scott – we’re all posting like mad gremlins!
@willierednut .. that made me laugh out loud. To be fair he kicked him a few times in the early to mid 90′s but by the late 90s…….
@buytheclub2012 – without pissing on your oh so eloquent chips, didn’t our reserves beat yours last week?
I think you are over reacting here. Wenger praised first and it was only after media prompting did he come out with the ‘dark’ side.
The one thing that is clear from your stats is when Kevin Davies retires the number one spot is there for the taking!
Wenger fucked up with these comments, because right away people will point to the players he’s had down the years. No ones saying Scholesy is a great tackler, but to say he has a dark side is ridiculous, he just can’t tackle very well. Of course, SAF could respond and say, that Viera was a dirty player and he should be able to tackle, being a different type of midfielder from Scholesy.
Why are we so bothered about Arsenal? All of this is a bit silly. Wenger was asked a question and responded. Scholes cant tackle. We know that. I heard that the rest of his comments were rightly complementary. Dont see the big deal, really.
@willierednut :
If Ferguson was ASKED about Vieira (and it wasn’t BBC asking) I’m sure he would say something similar but then maybe not seeing as he wanted to sign him a few years back
Matthew Wade – He did try, but Giggsy was always to quick lol. We’re all talking about dirty players and tough tackling players, but i bet we all miss those United, Arsenal games in the late 90′s, early naughties, they had everything.
@Rooney is the best :
Exactly. Thank you. Some perspective at last.
lets pick apart the wenger legacy. and his change in attitude players should and should not do the pros and cons.
wengers 97/98 double winners
many praise wenger but did anyone realise wenger inherited a group of brilliant players he never rebuilt this team, the backline was already there all wenger had to do was add pieces.
2001/2004
the team was going towards wengers squad, henry vierra etc but he always had what I call tough characters, who would be nasty and dirty. In wengers 2 league titles and 2 fa cups 98 2002. This squad was inherited, he never built the bulk of the squad. 2004 I would say was wengers overall squad and he only won 1 championship.
when it came to rebuilding arsenals squad and keep it succesful wenger has failed, many say he had not much money but he has been hyped has this find of young talent. And we have seen with chelsea and united experience players are worth far more than so called young players who have yet to do it week in week out. So wengers entire model has been imbarassed, and it shows always going with youth is not always the best option and model.
and he questions the way scholes plays the game because he can be dirty or he does not play the game fair, the irony of this piece is these nasty players is exactly what brought wenger to the dance and helped win him his 3 title and double winning teams that failed to retain the league title.
@ gerry gooner
mate i strongly object to the words “dark side”..what the hell does wenger mean by that??does wenger mean that scholes has an extramarital affair or did he kill someone??
i just do not like wenger’s choice of words and to think he’s nicknamed “the professor” he could have definitely come up with something more apt than “dark side”..
Wenger called Scholes dirty because the man is trying to play the psychological card just as he did with Fletch last year
Fletch was absolutely torn apart by refs last year who no matter the bullshit that they come up with are affected by outside influences during a game.
Wenger is trying to do the same to Scholes because he knows that Scholes does not have the ability to tackle so therefore increases the chances of him getting sent off if a big deal is made out of nothing.
I respect Wenger but boy is he a fucking hypocrite. His players as mentioned are bad or worse – yet either he never comments or never sees it. It is not to say that Arsenal have never been on the wrong end of some horrendous tackles – because they have been – but seriously they give as good as they get.
Again it typifies a manager trying to play all his cards to get his opponent out of the title race
Only this time this opponent is ready for it – we want that 19 and we will not bow to any pressure.
Wenger can have his dirty remarks
Chelsea can have there walkovers
City can have the tide is turning bullshit hanging over them (what’s with the new poster BTW)
Liverpool can have there year
United will just do what United do
Relentless we march – we will never stop – we fear no one but ourselves
@utd4life:
Fair enough but if thats all you’re offended by then so be it. He has a good command of the language but often his choice of words could be better.
E.g. ‘I didn’t see it’- despite what people say sometimes he doesn’t see incidents- he should say why. He didn’t see Coles tackle on Kosciencly the other week- how could he- the ball was long gone and it wa in the corner of the ground! Anyway I’m off the point….
If we are judging how clean players are based on the number of yellow and red cards they collect the Robbie Savage must be on of the cleanest players to have played.
How many times was he sent off relative to the number of times he should have been?
Nice piece of analysis but you left out a very imortant factor. You failed to compare the fouls vs the no. of games played. In my opinion this is a very important determining factor because in comparing the no. of fouls comitted by a player who played 38 games and another who played 20, if they both comitted 40 fouls, who is the dirtier player? so you see here that failing to include the number of games is misleading and forfeits the purpose of your analysis.
@willierednut – I think if anyone said Vieira had a dark side, we’d be hard pushed to argue with that one! Yeah those games late 90s to early 2000s were great…two evenly matched teams fighting for supremacy, both with great players, both able to mix it (mostly fairly!), and most importantly, we never knew who would win.
@rooney the new king – Wenger’s problem is he went down the youth route just as everyone else started spunking millions up the wall. Jesus even spurs and Villa have made massive transfer losses. Also, as he has grudgingly admitted, he let some of the older players go too soon – some he couldn’t keep (like pires, henry) and others like Vieira, Campbell, Gilberto, he let go 12 months too early.
AS for people taking offense at ‘Dark Side’…surely there is a Darth Scholes/ Ginger Palpatine t-shirt in that….
@MG for a UTd fan to bitch about mind games and influencing the press is a fantastic example of pot/kettle action…or is Fergie just misunderstood?!
Wenger just praised Scholes for his abilities.But as an opponent he cannot approve the fouls he committed.
So as Arsenal Manager ,Wenger did not care about how Scholes performed for United.
His focus was on how Arsenal players could injure if Scholes or any other midfielder for that matter commit fouls.
But sitting back and analyzing,Wenger applauds Scholes for the Work hes done for ManUtd.
Nobody should complain about Wengers comments.He had the courage to applaud opposition player.It shows Character.
All these Arsenal fans banging on about ‘missing the point’ or ‘over-reacting’ very rapidly become wearisome, and hardly worth reading. I thought Wenger’s comments deeply unfair, and the stats back that up. It’s clear that over the last decade or so Scholes has not been the worst offender by any means. Yes he sometimes mistimes tackles, sometimes he’s clumsy, sometimes he may be cynical, knowing he’s been beaten so he brings an opponent down, but then he’s been the hub of the most successful team in Britain throughout his 15-plus years at the top. He’s always been close to the action, mostly running the show, the target for opponents desperate to close him down or squeeze him out of the game.It’s hard to think of anyone else who’s been so involved at the sharp end of football, at the very height of the professional game for so long, always playing in other team’s ‘cup finals’, even when they are not actual Cup Finals. It’s inevitable that things are high-octane, high stakes, the pressure on United players being phenomenal, and unlike anything experienced by others. Can you imagine what would happen if United went without a trophy for 4 or 5 years, like Arsenal? That’s the context of Scholes’ achievements, and his reputation. I’m surprised no-one has mentioned that it was actually Jamie Redknap on Sky who started this hare running, saying in successive weeks that Scholes was deliberately going in with studs up, knowing exactly what he was doing. As an ex-pro who’s played with and against him these damning words (also couched in terms of how brilliant Scholes is, just like Wenger) carry a lot of weight, and endorse the repeated claims of commentators like Andy Gray that he’s a bad tackler. I think there’s a hidden agenda here, trying to put the spotlight on United’s most gifted midfielder, hoping refs remember ‘his darker side’ and get out the cards the first time he gets close to an opponent.. I think it’s shoddy, and Scott was right to challenge these smears before everyone think they are true. Personally, I can’t recall Scholes setting out to hurt anyone or leaving a player seriously injured. Shaken up, yes, hurt, no. And let’s not forget, he takes his fair share of battering himself, as he gets targetted.
did any idiots like redknapp and wenger realise scholes cant tackle like anderson cant score goals
@Giles Oakley – while i disagree with your opening, I agree that SKY always have their own agenda, and manipulate peoples views accordingly. I also agree that Scholes was often targetted, and some of his retribution has been entirely just, but you have to remember, that Scott started with a comparison with arsenal, who haven’t targetted an opposition player in years (even when they should) apart from when Nani was showboating and gallas didn’t like it.
@rooney the new king – what the hell happened to Anderson? a £16m attacking creative midfielder with a goal threat….good player still, but completely different to how he was 4 years ago.
@Giles Oakley
The only hidden agenda here is that two games into the season already the media are trying to give Scholesy PFA Player of the year out of charity cos he never won it when he should have done. Just like Giggs last year- wasn’t even uniteds best player let alone the best in the league and only started 12 games or something.
Nobody is denying scholes’ class (on and particularly off the field). He is a legend dark side or no dark side
off topic , kiko just scored a great goal against city – 1 all
@Matthew Wade
he’s doing well playing against city in his first match back
@gerry gooner
out of charity..lol..mate you can give that PFA player of the year award to any of your babies in your club..we seriously dont give a damn..we all know scholesy’s worth and how bloody good and valuable he is to the club..we dont need a award to tell us how good our ginger ninja is..
I wouldn’t give it to any except Fabregas mate!
He’s that good that you’ve spent about 70 million trying to replace him and he’s seen them all off!
@Matthew Wade
Not bitching at all – Since United are the masters of reverse psychology
I’m just merely pointing out that this is what Wenger is doing in my opinion.
I still can’t remember though the last time SAF went for a specific player
Manager spats have been aplenty but cannot remember at least the last number of years where SAF went after a player to stumble the opposition
Hope that makes my point clear. Funny Wenger can’t do that with Chelsea or City or Liverpool – or even his own players – what do you think?
Funny how he cannot see when his players are involved in horrendous tackles – but can when others do it.
Just an opinion – or is Wenger misunderstood?
KIKOS JUST MADE IT 1-1 AGAINST CITY RESERVES! COME ON U REDS!
GHTT… Great turn and finish from Kiko!
Good to see Ando playing again!
@ gerry gooner
who told you that we are trying to replace him???we know we cant find another player like him..the likes of xavi,iniesta,etc can be replaced but scholesy is one in a million..he’s irreplaceable!!!
@utd4life
Too true. But hes thirty f**k*n six!! Who will fill the gap. Aaron Ramsey wil do it for us when Cesc is off next year!
@gerry gooner
you dont worry about that..leave that to SAF..you just worry about how your boys can win a trophy this season since according to all the pundits this is the season when its all supposed to come together for your lot..or is it the next year??
Wenger will always be a disrespectful, blinkered cunt. He has no class.
Don’t see us having enough. depends on Cesc being 100 % with us , van persie staying injury free and Arshavin actually giving a shit. Despite our shortcomings Van Persie fully fit last year would have made a huge difference. despite you’re defensive injuries last year if Rooney had been out for as long as van persie last year you would have struggled. Agree?
If we get a keeper and Squillaci (seems a done deal) and are lucky with injuries you never know. Chelsea look strong though.
Off Topic but I see the “publicity shy” Keith Harris” is hypeing up interest in a deal he’s arranging to buy Liverpool. I know that’s his business but is it any wonder that fans on both sides of the Glazer divide don’t trust his so called Red Knights or MUST who so naively backed him.
(Maybe he meant something different by Red Knights than we all thought!!)
LU -IFIT!
@gerry gooner
you guys desperately need a good keeper and a solid centre half because that new lad,from what i saw in the liverpool game, is definitely gonna struggle this season..arsenal might win the carling cup but wenger never takes that cup seriously..he uses it to give a platform to his youngsters but they always come up a cropper..
injuries play a big part in a season so yes we would have struggled if rooney was injured to the same duration as van persie was but thankfully he wasn’t..
As for chelsea lets see what happens they meet a team who can actually defend but they are very much beatable..
Linvoy – the boy ando did very well
and what about Tom “should of had 4 ” Cleverley he’s having a super game
Any updates on the United-Citeh reserves game?
oh KIngs, come on, take a deep breath. The guy said more good than bad (though it is true) about Scholes.
Wenger has no class?! lol
Kiko Again 2-1
Think our new lad did ok. Can’t judge him yet though. I’ll start with finishing ahead of spurs (used to be guaranteed by March) and work from there! I take it that City are a serious threat in big games but maybe they won’t have enough this year. Eventually as with Chelsea the money will come good and win them the title. Fairly inevitable I think.
MACHEDAAAAAAAAAAAA AT THE DOUBLE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! COME ON MUFC!!!!!!!! WHAT A CRACKER!!!!!!!!!!!!
72 minutes gone 2-1 to united came from behind kiko gettin both- carrick was quiet anderson was very good cleverley is still on and doing very well should get a goal its well deserved – gary neville is like an adult playing against kids , amos spreads himself very well wesley was classic
point to the left point to the right cleverley just scored in the 74th
city did very well till united scored then it has been all united
Could someone explain how valencia gets so many cards o.O. Wiiierd.
watching the reserves game and all i can say is Tom Cleverly must be given a proper run out this season. The guy is ready to play, End of
GHTT… Cleverley has been excellent… His ability to get into dangerous positions is fantastic!!
And as I write this he does exactly that and finishes well. Ha… Excellent stuff!
Also GHTT what u think of Smalling? I think he’s been solid at the back tonight… Quite impressed at the way he’s read the game. Bailed Wes out a minute ago!
oh and smalling is like a wall
“Eventually as with Chelsea the money will come good and win them the title” you meant the refs will come good and hand the title to them..
My question is, why anyone takes what Wenger says seriously? That guy is pathetic, unambitious, lying cunt. This is the guy who on yearly bases lies to his own supporters and who cares about his ideology more than the club. This is the guy who said stuff like “3rd place is a trophy”, “come see me at the Emirates and you will see we will go through” we smashed them 3:1 and my favorite “It’s unacceptable for big club like Real Madrid to go 3 years without a trophy” Arse won zip in the past FIVE years and counting. The guy is a clown…and now for my rant.
I am depressed. I gave it couple of days, but the pain is still there. It really hurts to lose points in such fashion. Silly or call it whatever, doesn’t matter. Losing points like that is a sign of weak mentality. I don’t think we have one, but it was pathetic. Last year we did that to Shity 3 times and Arse and scousers lost points like that too. “Weak mentality” in my opinion. The penalty miss should not have crashed them like that. None of the players covered themselves in glory. Evans and O’Shea were bad and Vidic and Evra were responsible for the goals. Fletcher, Park and Valencia nonexistent and Berba nonscoring. Scholes was decent and scored the goal, Nani was great, but he missed the penalty and Chacharito and Giggs tried. My problem was the defense. WTF was that? We were playing Fulham, I know a decent side, but a decent and that’s it. Someone better would have destroyed us with such defending. Raphael should always start. We need to sort our RB once and for all. Nani should always start either with Valencia or Park. His creativity was really missed. Just wanted to vent some frustration. I know we always start slow and no Rooney and all the other crap, but I am still disappointed. We have a good squad, it’s good enough to win EPL and even CL, but people should already be held accountable. The youngsters already had several seasons behind them, so it’s unacceptable for Evans to have such a game against freaking Zamora and what was wrong with O’Shea and Valencia, a first time watcher might have thought that Konchelski was out RB and not Fulham’s LB. What I wonder about, is how come Valencia couldn’t use all that space. And then there was Etuhu, who was all over VDS, and Fletch was nowhere to be seen…
Anyway, it was very disappointing, but the guys know that they must do better, way better.
let me also say da silva did well on the right
Seems a pretty solid side turned up for the reserve game, wont be surprised if MO7 turned up
GHHT could you please furnish us (w/o MUTV) the matchday squad?
can someone please give me links to view the goals from the reserves game??
A tide in the City?
Is it fuck
A revolution?
Is it fuck
Time to join the party?
Is it fuck
Who the fuck are Manchester City – never fucking heard of him
380 million spent in the last three years
Won – fuck all
Will win fuck all
This town is red will stay red will forever be red
It will bleed red till kingdom come – no fucking Sheikh – no Italian no fucking millions or billions will take United apart
This club will never die
@GHTT
How was Eikrem? Read on twitter that he played well.
arijc
I have to say Kiko scored 2 and united played 2 up top but kiko was mostly a forward and Eikrem was doing all the leg work
@mg
i think you can be a poet someday……….
Orez, it was an own goal that you went ahead on afterall.
United did not give anything away, Fulham deserved the point. Lest be fair and reasonable.
Tom Cleverley video done today
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cexhcz_B_88
M.B. Diouf goal for blackburn
bit of topic but i think darren gibson should be played against the weaker teams………..
he is sooooooooo ready to play………
@ GHTT
Thanks
Cleverly was outstanding pre-season and his goal against MSL All Stars was top draw. If you haven’t seen it try to find it. That alone convinced me he’s got everything but experince.
It was that night that convinced Fergie to keep him rather than send him out on loan. (At least it was the next day that he announced it.) I also believe that was another reason why he didn’t try for Ozil.
Carling Cup – three in a row!
@geneside
Thanks for the compliment – and to all who have said it
I’ll get on the poetry once I get my books published lol : ) (honestly though you guys that have mentioned are pretty close – children’s books not quite poetry : )
Humbled – in the presence of great United fans
Can’t wait for this 19th – we have a date with destiny – here and in Greece – with Costas
Let it be…
@MG
MG !!! Everyone knows whats up when keep the words coming.
Tide in the City? Big fucking joke
@ geneside
Couldn’t Disagree with you more
Slim
Shift in the balance of power -
Apparently
Don’t know where to go with that
Probably to bed with the lights firmly switched off : )
That’s how much I give anything about it.
Off topic, but Mame Biram Diouf nets a hat-trick for Blackburn against Norwich
Diouf got a hattrick for blackburn vs norwich
@slim
i think we need a player of his position an attacking miedfielder.can really turn the game for us.also has the pace and unexpected of course.the area in which he plays has been the most worrying thing for us from the last season.so i think of all oursubs he deserves the most……..
Anyone have reserve highlights?????
I’m not a big fan of Gibson. For me he’s got neither the pace nor foot speed to be top draw. Think this will be his last year on the fringe before he goes to a bottom half club for regular football.
Wish he could give Ando his shot though!!
just about to say joel and marsy!!
mame biram is on fireeeeeeeeeeeee!!
was Bebe in United’s squad tonight?
Just saw the Reserves result. Good to hear that Ando is back.
Bebe wasn’t in the squad, he’s not ready yet, according to various reports.
Wenger what a berk!!
I dont know why people try to argue with facts and stats, it seems pointless to me.
We all know the moderator will provide the information to prove Paul is unjustly targeted.I totally agree, not that means fuck all I am just a youngster. Although I can quickly do research also
Le professor is just being himself.I see what I want to see. Hear no evil, speak plenty evil against other teams players that threaten his Arse.
Plus If read and learn any more from Giles I think I will go mad with love. lol.
It goes without saying Paul does not aim to lame any one as Costas rightly pointed out he aint no Kevin Davies its mugs like I said during the match at the Cottage that bring this on.
Weak feeders then grasp it and try to turn into something it aint.
@Rooney the new king spot on.
Any club that can put out a second string like this is strong for the future.
Amos.
Neville
Smalling
Brown
Rafael
Eikrem
Anderson
Gibson
Carrick
Macheda
Cleverley.
GHHT post you know the time 20.21 Ando did well. What did he do?
I know he is coming back from a cruciate injury and getting match fit. What did he do?
Mom in my opinion was Chris Smalling/Rafael
Just for the academics Cleverley hit the bar in the first half should have scored. It was a snip.
Hay but we all miss chances right! lol
on the other side you’re probably also one of those who thinks Aaron Ramsey is more ‘dirty’ than loverboy Ryan Shawcross.
webuyanycunt.com
webuyanycunt.com
webuyanycunt.com
any age,any wage ,any race ,any price
from £50 to a £100 mill
webuyanycunt.com
city bastards.
edscot
did you watch the match??
I applaud anyone who tries to use stats to back up opinions and impressions. But not just any stats will do, and here is where I think you fall short. First, Wenger was talking tackles, not actions that get called as fouls or penalized as yellow/red cards. So the question is bad tackles, whether called or not. That’s tougher, but the numbers might be more relevant if they compared fouls to tackles. At least then you might get a sense of how often the activity is called. If total tackles is not available, then perhaps fouls per 90 minutes played would also give more insight, or, minutes per foul – either way. In the past few years Scholes has been a part-timer, so absolute numbers are useless, except with Davies. Finally, do like-to-like — compare those who play the same position only. A
Otta hate Tiny Tears. Thats insulting and you are not answering my question.
Dimitar,
Berbatov,
One look at City and he said fuck off.
http://www.simplyreds.com/manchester-united-chants/6505-berbatov-told-city-to-fk-off.html
Ando done 20 back flips, and then preceded to do the funky chicken, the boys crazy.
He’s half a girl,
He’s half a boy,
Torres, Torres.
He looks just like a transvestite,
Torres, Torres.
He wears a frock,
He loves the c*ck,
He sells his a*se on Albert Dock,
Fer-nan-do Torres,
Carraghers bit on the side…
Na na na na na na na na na na na na na…
Fer-nan-do Torres,
Carraghers bit on the side…
Redscot
what the fuck are you on about
Thank you , See you can adress me properly Ghht, rewatch the match its on just now! get back to me when you get some humility. What did Anderson do?
It wasnae rocket science the question
I
Imagine a strikeforce of Nani, Bebe and Mame!
@Moscow is my heaven
With Papa (Bouba Diop) pulling the strings in midfield.
Redscot
I can address you what ever way i want to- im not getting sucked into your broken english bullshit – if you watched the match you would of seen andersons passing if you didnt thats not not my fucking fault
I would prefer Carrol, Davies and Nando as a strike force. But thats fantasy.
Who needs Rooney Berbatov and Owen. dump them. Utter crap
Scott mate dont know if you’d wanna use this link to write a piece but
everyone who gives a fuck heres Dioufs 3 for blackburn
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jXVWoRSBOdI&feature=player_embedded
I thought Wenger was a brilliant manager. With that lame interview, he just proved he has an idiot-side too.
It is lame to label a player like Scholes “dirty” when his side boasts among the worst disciplinary record during their more successful years.
@ GHTT. I tink i spoke perfect Engish. And you were taught at a lesson.
Be carefull of the Dark side of Scots.
I will repeat tell me what Anderson did in the Manchester Senior cup.
Twice you have insulted me, three time’s you aint seen me.
Moscow is my heaven
Have you heard much about Bebe – rumor was people where “unimpressed ” about his training with the team
No back up to that rumor and i hope its untrue
Gentlemen
Calm down dears don’t get the wires crossed
We’ve already got many non believers to do that
Stay happy stay cool – at the end please stay United
: )
@Martin Wede “Arsenal hasnt targeted an oppsition player in years” hahahahahahaha Arsenal is the saintest, the most angelic, the holiest team???? hahahahahahahahahahahhaahahhahaa
There’s a lot of myths about Wenger, and one of them is, he changed English football, through changing footballers diet. Gordon Strachan give an interview a few years ago, saying SAF was doing that sort of thing at Aberdeen. Bear in mind, that those two weren’t exactly the best of buddies.
@Moscow is my heaven
I just read a
bac my comment and I hope it isnt takin up in a rude way mate
im not running down your faith in a player nor the abilitys of the player
its just ive heard 2 things about this kid 1 “SIGNED” 2 “UNIMPRESSED” so i was looking for some positive light
RedScot – exactly scholes actions when he fouls players is not sinister its he just cant tackle, anyone who knows the game has played the game should know scholes is awful at this. lets look ar scholes at 23 he was quicked faster yet he kept fouling everyone that shows he is awful at this.
paul scholes he scores we should add to the song
paul scholes he fouls more
willierednut
Fella I know years Mate of my dads was a scout for Celtic from te 70′s till about 3 year ago
and he told me (and tells me everytime he’s had a few) that Sir Alex was legendary with the crazy stuff he’d be doing at aberdeen. they taught he was a blown in with funny ideas that they kinda took the piss out of- like a different diet per person of messuring the wrists of 14 year olds cause they can do test to see his hights at 17 etc. some taught him interesting most taught him stupid
@ Rooney the new king, I am a younger viewer mate but very enthusastic, love your posts like most of the lads on the blog.
My point was why argue with people and that follow United .
Of course your evaluation of Anderson was accurate. My views almost exactly.
Hope you get to the Wet Spam game. I am going, so if you have daughters unsatisfied partners or loose Goats or Sheep. LOCK Them up ! Even your boyfreinds.
Anderson fuck me pink its nae rocket science. 17 million squids 2 goals for United
@redscot
if anderson was played in his natural position then yes maybe he would player.better… hes a attacking player who was played in a defensive role in order to build up his talents.. even then he did quite well.. has scholes like passing at times and then oshea like passing on other occasions.. remember anderson is only 21… very young and still has 2 mature… he does look to be carryin a bit too much weight.. but as he showed he has lots of pace.. nd uses that weight to shrug of other midfielders.. we will REALLY need him this season.. as good as scholes is… he cannot be in the opposition box… and quickly get back if the other team break…. that is why we struggled and the defenders didnt do too well… fletcher cant do it on his own… we cannot play scholes for 90minutes without enough backup.. fletcher cannot do it on his own… therefore when scholes is playing.. we tend to play 2 other backup midfielders to do his tracking back for him
@Obertan the new star. I respect your point of view mate. He is carrying to much weight as you say. I am sorry I just dont get him at United. In the game last night which i watched twice on MUTV I tried to see his contribution just cant. Mistimed passes and slipping and off the pace. i do realise he is recovering from injury and errors are allowed he just looked not for United.
How can he be an attacking player mate he can hardly hit the target. His shooting is wild and careless.
I personally would give Darron more chances as witnessed last night against City that was on target a busting the net. The city player blocked it painfully. I bet.
Goodnite Reds believe.
i dont care what no one thinks WE will get our 19th this season.
Glass houses and stones spring to mind. I used to have a list of Arsenal players to have been sent off under Wenger and it reached 50 many many years ago I believe during the angelic days of Bold, Dixon, Keown, Winterburn, Vieira and Adams. Wenger had a team of thugs running around kicking the crap out of everything that moved and as soon as he lost the thugs, Arsenal are angels who only ever try to play the beautiful game but are foiled by foul means. Wenger is a two faced wrinkled old **** who I have never had an ounce of respect for.
Voila
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-522821/Arsenals-red-card-hall-shame-Arsene-Wenger.html
On Scholes….Absolute class, no doubts, everyone knows this and we could eulogise for hours about his qualities, the best footballer of his generation – Fact
Is he dirty? Not in a Vinney Jones way no…but he has a nasty streak there is no doubt…Roy Keane confirmed this as a guest on Sky Sports a couple of years back…He actually said that one of the reasons he loved playing with Scholes was because he knew that when the tackles were flying that Scholes would stand shoulder to shoulder with him dish it out if it came to it….And you have too….He is 5ft 6in playing in Centre Midfield, mainly in a 442, for the best team in the league up against big physical players whose soul intention is to kick him off the park so he has no influence. Often the opposition pack the midfield area with 3 physical players…..If he didn’t have that edge he would never had made it to the top and been so well respected.
If you are playing in centre midfield and get the reputation that you can be kicked out of the game then what does the opposition do? Look at what Bolton & Blackburn have done to the Arsenal players in recent years…..You can try that with Scholes, but you know full well that he is gonna give you one back and not think twice about it
What Man United fan wouldn’t like to see Carrick absolutely clean someone out? He has never done this and thats why sometimes he cannot stamp his authority on a game and why he is on the bench while Scholes takes centre stage
Anyone who has played a decent level of football, especially in England where the game is very physical, will tell you that in Central Midfiled you have to be able to mix it….Comes with the territory
There are many attributes that make world class central midfield player, Scholes has all those attributes, including a little nastiness – without it he would not have been the player he is!
Paul Scholes has a dark side?
I swear he must be the palest ginger ninja I have ever seen!
Paul N – It’s not just that I am referring too. I’m also referring to his other direspectful comments in the past. It’s laughable for him to have a dig at Scholes, when he’s had 50 players sent off under his leadership in such a short space of time. I stand by comment that he is a cunt and no one will tell me otherwise.
What a waste of time. Particularly the authors.
There is little point in arguing against someone is is so determined to justify their own bias.
One thing’s for sure though, the extent to which this blokes gone to (totally unscientifically) justify his argument cetainly smacks of guilty conscience.
Dark side? Sure, he’s gonna take out his lightsabre the next time he gets a tackle.
Ridiculous statement from AW, whether he meant it or not. And knowing him, it’s just another ploy. Too bad his ploy reeks of zero conscience, discrediting a player like that.
@willierednuts n David Watts, thanks. love ur comments. AW is a hypocrite; with your house on fire do u try to help your neighbor extinguish his?… haters and their prejudiced views are not welcomed!… dark side means sinister or evil motives, and nothin else… all AW wants to say is “why de drooling, despite his talent he is so flawed!”… Cesc reminds me of Scholes.. quite impulsive players dats all… de recipe for a complete midfielder.
@Scott the Red. good work, thanks! keep it up. @hater. wat do you mean by our observation and not stats? i thought stats were compiled from observation.
@some gunners. keep on defendin AW blindly n you’ll remain trophyless for a very very long time.
lol
Of course Scholesy is a bad tackler! Who cares? Hes not in the team to tackle.
This tells you all you need to know about Wenger’s approach
http://playfootballthearsenalway.wordpress.com/