Comments on: Why Do All These Deluded Scousers Believe FSW’s Lies?

By: Liverpool F.C

Liverpool F.C — Sun, 05 Jul 2009 22:11:35 +0000

And how much do your players get paid a week in comparrison?
or am i too assume you are all accountants that are fully aware of both clubs finances?

By: Brando

Brando — Sat, 04 Jul 2009 00:31:21 +0000

@Dazjoe – The way I see your clothes buying comparison is the guy who buys the expensive shirt ( fergie) has already got a wardrobe full of cheap t shirts and jeans ( and a few nice bits) at home already. He has already built a nice clothes collection over many years. The other guy (rafa) has just been given his clothes by a dodgy frenchman ( houllier) with no dress sense. These cloths are all tatty and torn so he has to buy a load of cheap stuff or his arse will be hanging out for most of the year. He didnt really want the cheap stuff but he didnt really have any clothes at all worth wearing. After he has bought enough cheap stuff to fill his wardrobe he can then afford to spend a bit more on some smarter gear (torres).

Ive already pointed out some of the ways united generate more cash than lfc ( without having to sell your best players) . I think you will always have more money than us. But rafa has just about got to the point where he has a big enough squad and can concentrate on just adding the better players as fergie has been doing for years.
I think that is what rafa is sort of meaning when he says its hard to compete – We do have similar amounts to spend but as we strengthen you always , obviously, strengthen as well. So it seems like we are always treading water and because you already had a head start ( a better squad when rafa joined) it is very difficult to catch up. We would need significantly more money than you to be able to quickly catch and overtake you. Instead he has had to do it slow and steady, and last year he got pretty close.

on the youth issue – lfc have about 23 players with an average age under 19 ( this may have changed slightly cause we just sold a couple) . I dont think any of these have made a 1st team appearance yet but all are still young. Another six or so ,all around 20, made at least 1 appearance last year with ngog and insua getting the most time. So we have a healthy number of young players but only time will tell if they make the grade.
Youve only really had evans and one of the twins play semi regularly this year ( youngsters) and that was mainly due to the long term injuries of brown and neville ( this meant oshay had to fill in at right back but then he and rio also had time out letting them in). So i dont think its really fair to say that fergie gives youth much more of a chance ( these days) apart from in the little cups. Ok macheda came on and scored a couple of really important goals but how much of a chance would he have had this season if you still had ron and tevez ? I`d wager quite a lot that he wouldnt have played too much. This may all change now as this transfer window seems crazy but last year I dont think fergie used youth that much more than rafa until his hand was forced by injuries. Rafael played because of injuries , his brother didnt get much of a look in because evra was fit for most of the season.

You say rafa has had a mediocre transfer record but he has built an entire ,young (average age of playing squad this year was under 25) squad capable of sustaining a challenge for a net spend of £80-£100 mill (depending which figures you believe). Several big clubs are now wanting our players as well which hasnt really happened for years and will send that net spend tumbling if we do sell ( please god no).
He must have done something right.

By: ImpartialLFCFan

ImpartialLFCFan — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 14:40:55 +0000

Hi, I’m a LFC fan and only logged onto this website to express my disgust at Manchester United’s (potential) contract offer for Michael (Judas) Owenand why Manchester United are even considering purchasing the money grabbing, disloyal, arrogant, selfish blah, blah ‘professional’ But I found myself perusing the transfer dealings piece and would question some of the figures. Granted I am not an employee of LFC or MUFC and I presume no one else is here, however when certain media outlets post a similar figure for a transfer fee then I tend to assume that is the correct fee. However I notice that the transfers of Nani, Anderson are recorded as 13.5 and 15 here whereas most reports have them as 17 and 18. Recently The Times mentioned Hargreaves was purchased for 21 not 17. There are also questions of the Liverpool figures e.g. LFC and Mr Benitez have both mentioned the fee was 20.2, a fact (no pun) that is backed up by several newspapers but some people still believe the fee was 26.5. Are LFC lying and colluding with the Spanish journalists that also referred to the price in Euros in 2007 which amounted to 20+ish in sterling during the hazy days of Summer 2007 pre financial collapse? Anyway I find it all relative as I recall Mr Ferguson spending vast sums during the late 80s on players e.g. Ince for 1, Webb for 1.5, Phelan 0.75, Wallace for 1.3 and Pallister for 2.3 in 1989 when the transfer fee record was 2 (for Gascoigne) and when teams didn’t spend more than 1 on more than 1 player. I believe those figures are correct, I tend to have a good memory (I need it being a LFC fan!) but in 1990 Mr Ferguson finished 11th despite ‘overhauling’ the Manchester United for 4 successive seasons. So it takes time and lots of money to build a title winning team. Mr Ferguson probably spent significantly more money than Mr Dalglish so that Manchester United were able to compete with LFC, by just spending similar amounts would have corroded any chance for Manchester United to surpass Liverpool In the modern context Mr Benitez needs to spend big to overtake Manchester United because the Liverpool squad left by Mr Houllier following his ‘Reign of Terror’ required an almost complete overhaul whereas Mr Ferguson has just needed to ‘tweek’ his squad since 2004 but has spent 12+ on Rooney, Carrick, Hargreaves, Nani, Anderson, Berbatov, Valencia whilst having Van Nistelrooy, Ronaldo, Saha, Ronaldo on the books at the time. However Mr Benitez has only spent 12+ on Torres, Mascherano, Keane, Johnson and had only Cisse as a pre-arrival. So I think Mr Benitez has done a very good job so far in the transfer market in trying to keep up with Manchester United.

By: Dazjoe

Dazjoe — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 11:42:43 +0000

Brando.
Your right about Ronaldo, it is prob the first time fergie’s lost a player, either at or approaching his peak, when he wanted to keep them. The only other one was Kanchelskis, up to a point. Fergie never wanted to sell, as he’s mentioned in his autobiography, but Kanchelskis forced the issue; but he wasn’t Ronaldo class.
I appreciate Rafa has had to spend to improve/change the squad, whereas Fergie has had money for just one or two players per year, but the issue that has royally ticked us United fans off this last 12 months is the constant moaning of ‘Pool fans and players and manager of the lack of cash and the constant struggle to compete with United financially. Every time we point out the figures, i.e. that Benitez has spent as much, so the cash IS there, it’s ignored by 95% of Liverpool fans, and 100% of the media. What Rafa chooses to spent the cash on is up to him, but he could have rivaled us for the signings of Rooney, or Carrick, or Berbatov if he had wanted, instead he wanted to beef up the squad; fair enough, in his eyes it had to be done, but if 2 guys walk into a clothing store with 500 pounds, and guy number 1 buys 1 quality expensive pair of jeans, and the other buys 10 cheaper pairs of jeans and T shirts, then guy 2 can’t complain about guy 1 looking better can he? He had the same money to spend. He just spent it in a different way. Bit of a shit comparison but you get the point. However most Liverpool fans still cling the belief that your club has less money than us, that’s just not true.
You can bet very large amounts of money that if we sign, say, Fabiano, Buffon, and De Rossi for 70 million, plus of course Valencia, then we will see Liverpool fans by their thousands come out and say ‘How can we compete with that?’ Easy. As I said earlier, sell Torres then you too will have 70 mill to spend.
A look at both clubs official websites also tells you why we can spend 30 mill on 1 player instead of 6, United have 23 youth players listed as part of their first team squad( with squad numbers), at least 12 of which have appeared in the Prem for us, in contrast Liverpool have 9 youth players in their squad, just 3 (I think) of which have appeared in the Prem league, apologies if I’m wrong. Our youth system enables us to beef our squad up with talented kids, if Liverpool’s doesn’t then that is something for Benitez to seek to solve, instead of firing insults at Fergie and looking to divert attention from his, lets be honest, mediocre transfer record ( Kromkamp? Josemi? Morientes? Keane? Babel? Lucas? Deggen? Dossena?).
Anyway, respect to you for coming on our website and speaking eloquently and intelligently unlike so many other scousers who come here and embarrass themselves.

By: Brando

Brando — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 09:34:42 +0000

@Dazjoe – My whole point was the majority of that squad needed moving on sooner rather than later. Of course there were some players ( i did list carra and rise etc.) but it was pretty obvious that most werent good enough to mount a serious challenge. That is why rafa couldnt just add a few quality ( expensive) signings he had to spread his money around to re build the squad. ( he did hold onto to the better players)
rafa didnt decide to sell owen, he wouldnt sign a new contract and wanted out on a free so we had to get what we could before this happened. 8mill at the time I think was a bargain for real. Cisse was ok but was all speed and not much else, hardly in torres league.

this year is abit of a one off for united in my opinion. When was the last time fergie sold someone at his peak like ronaldo? I cant remember 1 player ( espech in the prem era, maybe stam?). he normally sells when the players are on the way down , ie beckham . So yes you probably arent too happy where the money came from this year because you have lost a really good player to get it. But in previous years money has been available without having to sell anybody let alone one of your stars.

I am not defending the money wasted by other lfc managers. All my comments are just trying to prove that torres and rafa arent as deluded about the money situation, since he has been in charge, as the original article states. Rafas situation was actually made worse by the managers before him. They had all spent a lot and didnt really leave rafa much to play with in terms of the players he inherited and how much cash was left for him to work with.

@knightsmith – well I expect you will have to rotate the team quite a lot to keep everyone happy

By: knightsmith

knightsmith — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 06:26:33 +0000

Re Brando:
I was only jesting, I wouldn’t pass comment on any player any team signed until they’d kicked a ball in anger. Only time will tell how he goes, same as that Spanish city, Valencia, United have signed; but God knows where we’re going to play them all!

By: Dazjoe

Dazjoe — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 01:17:29 +0000

Brando
You’ve said that you’re not disputing where the money has come from, but you cannot argue that, if, and it’s a big if, we spend 80 million this summer, and Liverpool spend, lets say, 40 million then that makes it so much harder to win the league as we have so much more money. We’ve had to lose the number one player in world football to get that money! Selling Ronaldo hardly improves a team does it? Where would you stop? If we also sold Vidic, Evra, Carrick, Anderson, Rooney and Berbatov to boost our transfer kitty to 250 million, would that make us unstoppable?
You could do the same thing, if Rafa wants big money to spend then sell Torres. Simple. I’m sure Citeh would pay up to 60 or 70 million for him, add Alonso and Mash and Arbeloa and there you go, a nice 130 mill for Rafa to play with. Yet I’m sure if Liverpool did that, and you won nothing, then your fans would cry “How can we compete, yeah sure we spent 120 million but we had to sell our stars.” Isn’t that what we’re doing?
And asking who we would have took from the players Benitez inherited? Well Dudek was a better option that Roy ‘Fucking’ Carroll, believe me! Riise was a tasty full back, Carragher a solid centre half, I think Hamman was probably just a bit better than Djemba Djemba. Kleberson, or Miller, same thing goes for Kewell and Bellion, Owen was still there, Rafa chose to sell him, we would certainly have took him, and Cisse looked handy before his bad injuries. Then of course there’s Gerrard. I think we would have took all those players off your hands for the squad at least.
All the figures prove that in the 17 years of the Prem Liverpool have spent as much as United. Yes, Benitez has spent a lot to remodel his squad but that doesn’t explain, or excuse, the money spent (wasted?) by Houlier, Evans, and Souness.

By: Brando

Brando — Thu, 02 Jul 2009 22:07:42 +0000

@knightsmith – dont get me wrong I think he is a really good player who could help lfc break down teams that park the bus. What I was trying to say is I`m glad that rafa is finally in the position where he can overpay to get a player he really wanted (instead of someone telling him he shouldnt spend that much ie. the barry saga last year or simply not having enough to bid that much). 17 mill is a bit much but as rafa said you have to pay what the selling club demands if you want to compete. No team is prepared to let their good players go cheap, united seem to be suffering from this in spades at the moment.

By: knightsmith

knightsmith — Thu, 02 Jul 2009 17:52:03 +0000

Re: Brando
” they have recently overpaid for johnstone, rafa wanted him and they paid what they had to get him ”

I’d have bought Glen Johnson if I was Rafa!

By: Brando

Brando — Thu, 02 Jul 2009 17:07:06 +0000

I take it from the general lack of replys that you now all agree that generally it is hard for lfc to compete financially with united. as I said there is no shame in having more money than lfc I just find it a bit strange none of you can really admit it.