It has been estimated that Manchester United have 333 million supporters in over 200 countries, providing an astonishing cumulative audience of 4.2 billion television viewers watching the team in 2010-11. It would be lovely to think we’re all one big happy family but it’s probably no exaggeration to say that millions of those very fans have no idea that the name they routinely use for their favourite club irritates the hell out of untold thousands of others. This difference of opinion simmers away among certain Reds, mainly in the UK, and was recently summed up perfectly by this anonymous posting on the net:
‘Why the fuck are we called Man U, for fuck sake, it’s United you dicks.’
One RoM regular has referred to our name being ‘desecrated’ by the use of ‘Man U’ and asks, ‘How hard is it to type Man United? It’s only 5 more letters.’
People often ask me what I think so I decided to explore precisely what’s at stake, hoping to pin down why feelings run quite so high on this apparently pointless divergence within United’s far-flung phantom empire. Of course I have my own views on the subject, as I regularly point out to my wife, but I must admit I have been surprised by how elusive the whole issue turns out to be, even on seemingly obvious questions. On the other hand, as I peered into Manchester United’s past through this tiny linguistic prism it has been surprisingly pleasureable to see the sheer richness of the landscape revealed. That’s why I hope you’ll bear with me on this somewhat meandering journey along the long and winding road of United lore.
But first, let’s start with a little historical quiz. What do the following all have in common?
2-8 November 1951: England team list in ‘Sport’ magazine, naming several Manchester United players.
27 April 1952: Football results column in the ‘Sunday Pictorial’, when Matt Busby’s United defeated Arsenal 6-1 to secure the club’s first league title for 41 years.
1 February 1958: The Arsenal v Manchester United match-day programme for what turned out to be the Busby Babes’ last domestic appearance before the Munich Air Crash five days later. (United won 5-4, of course, in a pulsating match dominated by the Herculean Duncan Edwards.)
26 March 1960: The Fulham programme for the first time I saw United, when Dennis Viollet scored twice in a 5-0 win to set the United record for league goals in a season, still unbroken.
15 September 1963: ‘Sunday Mirror’ match-report scoreline when George Best made his debut in a 1-0 victory against West Bromwich Albion.
7 May 1967: ‘Sunday Mirror’ report when United beat West Ham 6-1 to clinch Matt Busby’s fifth and final league title.
Got it? The correct answer is of course that in each case the abbreviation ‘Man U’ was used, with not a peep of ‘for fuck sake’ protest from anyone.
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Man Utd News 24/7
This is an outstanding read.
Sir Giles
What a bloody brilliant insight as ever…. I hope you are well my friend.
I have always maintained that if you can or refer to United as Man U with no ill intentions or the history behind it than its fine. Most overseas supporters use the phrase Man U when addressing our club, however its also good for such fans to understand why for some of us its terrible
Most TV pundits and some ex players like Bruce for example refer to United as Man U which I am sure with no ill intention….
The whole Man U being a bad reference came about when West Brom fans started using it as a sing along to match their Munich chants. The majority of modern day fans will not know this so personally I bear no grudge if they use the term
‘The United’ is the best name ever. That needs to be brought back I think.
Never understood why the name Man U would rub people up the wrong way in any case, but I think to an extent it’s in the nature of football fans to almost seek out offence. We want to be angry, we want to carry grudges, because to a point hostility towards other teams is part and parcel of supporting your club. It’s maybe not a part of the mix that people will readily admit to, or are especially proud of, but it is what it is. So if people want to get offended by the term Man U then all power to them, there’s nothing wrong with a bit of civilised hatred for no particular reason, as long as it stays civilised.
Such an insightful article…an eye-opener for us, United fans abroad. I used to call the club ManU but lately, I either call them by their full name or Man Utd.
@Doghouse: I prefer “United” as well. Just goes perfectly with what the club stands for. In my country, the older ones just say “Manchester” (most havent heard of the noisy neighbours), and the youngsters say “ManU”, without any malice at all, mostly because they don’t know the dirty chants either…
Like someone said back in July. If rival fans make an offensive chant out of the name ‘Manchester United’ and you stop using that term. What shall you call the club then?
Err, what’s that got to do with a bit of horrible history…. We get abuse of the highest order from rival fans and at the same time we dish out our fair bit….
Giles sums up the whole Man U issue perfectly
For the rest of the world where English is not native language, the term “Man U” is much easier to pronounce than the full name. Largely for this reason and also due to their lack of knowledge in any malice intention included within the abbreviated term, most fans and broadcasters in Asia simply referred the club as “Man U”.
Konichiwa Bitches! Brilliant article loved reading it will have to check out some of the old clips. Loved the boys will be boyz line. Didn’t realise your brother was a spurs fan, mine too he does the. whole Kes thing towards me. Man U offends me because of the whole Munich reference but prior to knowing that just thought it sounded shit. Over here we’re known as Manchester with our acronym during games bein MAU. ITV, BBC, SKY & ESPN take note. Take care Lads off Roppongi now.
Konichiwa Bitches? hahaha Best intro to a post I have read in ages! Great to see you posting here again NRD….. How is life in Japan treating you?
A very interesting read as usual. But doesn’t all evolution in language start with the spoken word? For example, who actually calls their mobile a mobile phone (and that’s only 3 sylables – Manchester United is 6). So when you’re talking about United, you’re gonna abreviate it somewhere along the line and with more than one United out there, Man U’s the obvious solution – it’s 4 letters and gets the point accross with no room for confusion. In the UK, people can recognise my accent, so I only need to say United, but I live abroad, so I have to say Man U – in print the same applies.
Just wanted to thank you for writing this wonderful article, it made my day!
For me it was Sky’s Soccer AM ‘ that john terry loving, chelski supporting cunt Tim Lovejoy. He would use it week in, week out on the show & it would piss me off to no end. You also have the website Football365 who use term term “ManYoo” in their headlines, but to be fair they do also use chelski, citeh, and gooners so you could say that they try to wind up everyone!!!
great article cant wait for part 2. i think im gonna call united “the united” from now on i love it lol
To me, the term ‘Man U’ is just a non Mancunian way of naming out club.
If you’re in places which have a United football team, like Newcastle, West Ham (this can sometimes be applied to the wider London area), Oxford, Hereford etc. and you say I support United, there is sometimes a little confusion. I often have to quantify that by saying I support United, Manchester United, although my Manc accent does give me away a little.
So when people say Man U, to me, it just feels like they are not from Manchester, as even City fans call us United. No problem really, I don’t mind opposition fans saying it, but I’d prefer our fans to call us United or Manchester United.
I don’t mind Man United either.
And if we were Arsenal, we’d try and force three syllables into Man U!
massive fan from ireland, there is only one united therefore there should only be one name
Over Here In Nigeria, Its commonly known as Man U and with good intentions. I used to say Man U but overtime as I’ve seen some people offended by it I’ve changed it to Man Utd. The point I dont get is some ‘fans’ who spout vitrol on United fans from other parts of the world for using that term. Just like Cedars mentioned as long as it is in good faith no problem. Remember even Steve Bruce calls it Man U too. These ‘top red’ United fans who get worked up up and turn on foreign United fans for using the term are oblivious of the fact that United is now much more than an English club, its a global Club and it will take time to educate people on this Man U stuff! Its going to be a gradual process but hopefully Everyone will get the message!
APOLOGIES but Man United doesn’t fit on a license plate
IMG_1998.JPG
Does anyone know how to add a JPEG?
Haven’t read it all. Keep up the good work, Sir Giles.
Epic article in every sense. A wonderful piece of research and a great story.
Growing up in Australia, I believe it was common to hear references to Man U and I wasn’t aware of any unsavory connotations around that term until many years later. In a way, I am not surprised to read that the term may have originated in the popular press, and especially in headlines and captions. As an ex print journalist, I well understand the difficulties that headline and caption writers face, when they are tasked with capturing the reader’s attention, and accurately summarizing a complex drama, all in 14 characters! (The person who said “it only takes another 5 letters to write ‘United’ ” has obviously never been a headline writer!)
Another perspective on the usage of “Man U” may relate to the recent hoo-ha over racist language. One of the central themes of that “discussion” was an argument that people should be more tolerant and thick-skinned over “words”. As I recall, some people thought that the targets of such language were oversensitive and they did not agree those sensibilities should be taken into account. “I have the right to say it, and you do not have the right to stop me just because you are offended” was what it amounted to. I wonder if any of those people are among those who get upset at “Man U”? And if so, I wonder how they reconcile those two points of view?
As an anecdote: once, on a business trip to New Zealand, I got stuck in a hotel one night and happened to watch their equivalent of Match of the Day. I don’t remember what it was called, or the host’s name. What I will never forget, though, is that every single time he referred to United, not once did he use the term Manchester United, nor any variation of it. It was, without fail, “The Scum”. On national TV? Bastard.
NYDUDE … I don’t think you can add a jpeg. That would require the blog to have an upload feature, and I don’t see it.
Dandivine7
Cheers for the mention buddy….. As I said already most global, even some UK based United supporters refer to United as Man U…. Its fine as long as you do not know the offensive history related to it
‘Man U’ is an awful and lazy way that non-Mancunians use to describe the greatest football club on the planet. All this ‘global fan’ thing gets on my tits. We are Manchester United or simply United. Nothing more nothing less.
I’m a Mancunian Manchester United fan. Please don’t hijack my local club for your ‘global’ audience. Thanks.
What an absolutely stunning article. Honestly thank you for it. I personally did not know about the Munich abuse linkage with Man U, just didn’t like the term and knew that if it bothered some people, adding a couple more letters was hardly an effort. To be honest though even knowing that particularly sickening linkage it doesn’t make me hate “Man U” a whole lot more. It’s their ignorance and inbred-ness that comes shining through and i don’t think we should let it affect our name in any form. However i can imagine how much anger the chant must have raised for fans witnessing it first hand so completely get that side of it. So yeah as Giles called it, Hard one this.
Wow Giles. Just wow.
Great article, cant wait for the 2nd part. BUT just like people here, I’d prefer Man United or United than Man U bcause the terms has been polluted by some idiotic fans in violence manners for years.
Doghouse … I like “The United” too. Has a ring to it.
For me when I hear Man U I just hear Nick Hancock and all his piss poor, lazy Essex based ‘jokes’ on They think it’s all
Fascinating as ever. Thanks, Giles.
There’s only one United. There’s no need to add the ‘the’ or anything else.
All over the world when football-loving people refer simply to ‘United’ they mean us; they ain’t talking about Leeds or Newcastle.
I’ve just rented a crane to lift my jaw up off the floor.
great detailed article
.
.
I am one of the people that couldn’t call it ManU, and I am not even British
But that is just because it reminds me of Munich disaster.
In albania we Man Utd ‘Manchester’ and city we call city
I really appreciate the outcome of the article which helps Man Utd supporters from within Britain to accept the rest of us that are from abroad.
Great article, it was a very interesting and informative read. As a United fan from Canada, like a lot of other fans from outside Manchester, I used the term Man U quite frequently until a few years ago. Upon learning of the distaste some fans have for it, I switched to “Man United” or simply “United”. I’ve noticed that through a lot of the comments, those of us from outside the UK seem to use the term more frequently. My own theory is that it’s based on television. For many of us, we discover football, and United through television. We’re generally not football or United fans when we first start watching it. That fandom comes gradually. When we’re first learning about the game, the “Man U” shortform is frequently used by in game graphics and reporters. At least for myself, I (incorrectly) assumed this was the shortform that everyone used for the team. I suspect a similar assumption is made by other fans world wide. United fans eventually learn this term is not popular among certain groups of fans, and stop using it (at least I did). Non-United fans, never learn, and generally continue using “Man U” for the rest of their life.
robbos mullet , sorry but this blog does extend outside manchester. sorry for supporting man u outside manchester
It was so good I read it twice and I am still in confusion.More questions than answers.
Thats Giles a United legend.He only makes you ….think.Like thats a bad thing?
In the late eighties when I started going regularly, we used to chant ‘Man U’ to the tune of Liverpool’s ‘Dalglish. And ‘come on Man U’. It was only later when England fans sang ‘Stand up if you hate ManU’ that it became so annoying.
Tom- Nick Hancock is a cunt
Fantastic article.
Ultimately I am a writer so as a writer I can take time and patience to write Manchester United. Anything less then it’s simply United, if you’re getting picky then Reds – though Red Devils sounds better – of course.
Now for the Man U generation I suggest something entirely different altogether and I’ll save you writing even less young dudes and dudettes!
19
Superb stuff. Why didn’t we keep calling ourselves “The United”? that name is so badass. Or we could call ourselves “THE U” very intimidating. lol.
Redbilly – Yeah he is and the reason for me why I don’t like to hear Man U. All the youngsters who say Man U will have been lucky enough not to have to watch his shit. Perhaps Man u needs to be reclaimed for my generation, but then again I prefer United…
A great read btw, thanks
@MarkG
I don’t come from London I don’t support Arsenal. I don’t come from Birmingham so I don’t support Villa. I’ve never even been to Scotland so Rangers arnt even an option.
No, I was born and raised in Manchester and grew up hearing romantic stories of The Babes and later the Holy Trinity from my Grandad and Dad. On hearing of the tragic Munich disaster my Grandad swore. My Dad says it was the ONLY time he ever heard his Dad swear. He said “the fucking boys” and burst into tears at the dinner table. My Dad took me to my first game. I now live in an apartment where The Stretford End is the view from my kitchen.
I attached to my club in all sorts of ways.
So for some lazy outsider fans to brand Manchester United as ‘Man U’ is an affront to all I hold dear.
It’s reminiscent of current lingual trends I hear bandied about by today’s ‘yoof’. Things such as ‘convo’ meaning ‘conversation’ and ‘what evs’ meaning ‘whatever’.
Robbo` mullet. Good post pal. Another one is “guys“ that I hear all the fucking time.
King Eric, cheers mate. Just calling a spade a spade.
And ‘hi guys’ is so fucking annoying. Especially when it’s used to address a mixed gender group. Waiters in the Trafford Centre seem to use this a lot. It makes my blood boil and his/her tip reduce by a percentage or several.
King Eric, cheers mate. Just calling a spade a spade.
And ‘hi guys’ is so fucking annoying. Especially when it’s used to address a mixed gender group. Waiters in the Trafford Centre seem to use this a lot. It makes my blood boil and his/her tip reduce by a percentage.
King Eric, cheers mate. Just calling a spade a spade.
And ‘hi guys’ is so fooking annoying. Especially when it’s used to address a mixed gender group. Waiters in the Trafford Centre seem to use this a lot. It makes my blood boil and his/her tip reduce by a percentage.
Brilliant stuff Sir Giles. Its sad to say but there are only very few people like you who have almost full knowledge about our great club.
Hope you are doing fine with your health?
Wow that’s an echo. It said it hadn’t posted. Bugger.
The brilliant writes from Giles Oakley as always. Thank you sir for the walk the memory lane series.
Thanks to Giles for another great read. The following passage is a classic. It had me rolling around in stitches, as in my mind I pictured Sir Gile’s, shaking his head in disbelief, as he typed the last three words…
‘One oddity is a report by Universal, a Pathe competitor, covering a rather embarrassing 7-1 defeat by Tottenham Hotspur in an exhibition match in the Yankee Stadium, New York, in 1952, when United were Champions. The narration is by an American who calls the fans ‘boosters’ and refers to the United players as ‘the Manchester Uniteds’. For fuck sake….’
Great stuff!
Great read, beats the Daily mirror I just read on the coach. Shitty wankfest. Just read Anderson is out til Feb, not sure if its been covered on here. I must admit I don’t find the term offensive but depends how its delivered by rival fans. So I’m in agreement with Cedars the ol Devil.
We all know Man C stands for Mancinis Cunts but don’t give a shit about offending them. 
I have been very fortunate in my life to have traveled to so many countries, be it for pleasure or business and being mad about the game and specifically United, the football talk is always ever present. Whenever I was asked who I supported I just say United and everyone from Thailand, Greece or Turkey etc immediately knew I meant Manchester United…. Brilliant stuff
James21 – How are you pal? You cannot but agree with me, I am always right! And modest of course hahaha
Hi Cedars. Well thanks mate. Just on my way to OT for the usual warm beer. Wishing I’d put my thermals on, I’ve become a softy since moving South. Using mobile so havn’t been able to read all posts. Won’t be long till we pass Leeds so I’ll pass on your regards to Moses. Baaa.
James21
hahahaha, Enjoy your trip and them warm Singhas buddy, more importantly enjoy the match you softy!
Make it maaa instead of baaa! hahaha
This is a lot of info Giles! As always, much obliged. I’ll be archiving this page along with your other articles. Its important we don’t forget the Club’s history, and you’re spot on about the name MAN U. The overwhelming majority of people who use the term are not insulting the *dead*, funnily enough.
“The narration is by an American who calls the fans ‘boosters’ and refers to the United players as ‘the Manchester Uniteds’. For fuck sake.” LOL, classic.
Haven’t read all the comments but I think Dandivine7 made a top point, people have to remember (and accept) that Manchester United in 2011 is much more than an English Club. Thats the price paid for spreading the “United gospel” around the world, so a bit of common sense really goes a long way. If MAN U is used in a derogatory way, with reference to the Munich tragedy, then the response is obvious. But if some poor sod from Singh says MAN U because thats about all the English he knows, try not to string him up for a crass offence rarely made beyond these civilised isles, aye?
But failing that, Manchester United could always let the monkeys take over the zoo, and **disengage from all foreign countries where we actively seek fans and supporters**. Needless to say, the subsequent reduction in revenue would very likely destroy the Club as a powerhouse of football forever. I wonder what share of total gross revenue comes from abroad anyway? Ask me thats something local supporters should be proud of. 333 Million Manchester United followers, thats nearly 5 times the total population of the UK, and 30 odd million more than the total population of the USA. The total population of Greater Manchester ain’t even 3 million FFS, and how many Mancs support Wigan, Bolton or City? Talk about the 99% Lol, no more than 1.5 of those 333 million actually live in Manchester, and thats something every Red should be proud of. Unless (of course) your name is Alf Garnett (or summat) and you’d rather see half our global revenue to go to Liverpool, Arsenal, Chelsea and CIty.
Be proud that Manchester United is the biggest sports Club in the world, fuck me some people are never happy Lol.
French TV Canal + commentators use Man U quite often. Former French players and managers often comment for them. Marcel Desailly, David Ginola, Arsene Wenger and Gerrard Houllier amongst others.
What a great read.
Dobs- Canada, you say?!
There are plenty of folks here who use “Man U” as well. To be fair, like the majority, they don’t know why United fans may take offence. It’s just a question of educating your fellow fans.
Some really good thoughtful contributions here, so thanks all round. I hope you enjoy Part 2 which should be put up in the next few days.
Regarding fans who aren’t from Manchester or even England, I think some commonsense is called for. I don’t think it is right to blame fans (like me, for example) for not knowing why “Man U” is offensive, if they haven’t been told. A fan from overseas doesn’t have the benefit of local knowledge, tradition and history. He or she has usually come to know the club through their own media, which gives them a limited view. This was especially true in the days before the WWW. As I have posted here before, I have adored United since I was a lad of 5 or 6 in the mid 60s, even though the only source of my infatuation were some magazines and several annual “Year in Review” football books from England (which I still have, by the way). I didn’t have TV then and certainly didn’t read newspapers. I didn’t see my first match until the early 70s (on TV) and for many years, I would only see occasional matches (usually FA cup matches). As noted in my earlier post on this thread, the term “Man U” was quite common in the media that I was fed, and there was certainly nothing that would let me know it was offensive.
As far as I know (though I await Mr Oakley’s second instalment), the offensive nature of the term actually stems from some obscene chants and songs etc by rival fans, which arose later.
Of course, the Internet has greatly changed the quality and quantity of information that is available to fans everywhere, so there is now less excuse for ignorance than when I was growing up and falling in love with this club. For me, on a blog like this, it comes down to a very simple approach: if a new poster comes on here and uses the term “Man U”, but is clearly a fan and clearly not attempting to be offensive, then I think it is fair to assume they are simply ignorant (through no fault of their own), and have a “quiet word”. Thereafter, though, it is reasonable to expect this fan will respect the point by not using the term.
Man U was acceptable in the 70s and sung by the Stretford End. Why is it such a problem now?
@Robbos_Mullet you really don’t have a clue
Great article…my team will be, at least in my mind, ‘United’ because there really is only one!!!
Correction and additional information:
It seems I was wrong to say that there was no live coverage of United on BBC TV between the 1948 and 1957 FA Cup Finals. There was (at least ) one other match shown live, the Charity Shield in September 1952 ,as mentioned in Iain McCartney’s useful short book, ‘Old Trafford- Theatre of Dreams’, published by Yore in 1996, repeated in his expanded and updated version,’Old Trafford -100 Years at the Theatre of Dreams’ (Empire 2010).The significance of this match is that it was the first time live pictures were beamed from Old Trafford.
In the build up to this rare live football coverage, the Radio Times announced on the front page that there would be ‘Television At the FA Charity Shield Match on Wednesday Evening’ (24 September 1952) with photos on the inside to highlight the encounter between United as 1951-52 League Champions and 1952 FA Cup Winners Newcastle United.They only showed the second half of the match, between 6 pm and 6.50 in those pre-floodlight days, but from all accounts it was a thrilling, open match with five goals occuring while the cameras were ‘live’. United won 4-2, having gone one down in the first half, with goals from Jack Rowley (2), Roger Byrne (who was later killed at Munich) and Johnnie Downie.
I have never seen footage of this match and I don’t know if it still exists.
From the same source I discovered that in 1955 the BBC filmed the whole of a league match at Old Trafford, against West Bromwich Albion on August 27th, at the beginning of what turned out to be the Busby Babes first title winning season. The film was never broadcast however because it was only part of a dummy run for a new Saturday night series, Sports Special which was launched for real on September 10th.The film was rushed to Ringway Airport to be flown down to the processing labs in London, ready for rapid hypothetical transmission from the BBC studios. United won 3-1 with goals from Eddie Lewis, Albert Scanlon and Dennis Viollet. Again, I have no idea if this invaluable film still exists, as I’ve never seen it.
Further information:
It wasn’t only the 1952 Charity Shield that was covered by the BBC between 1948 and ’57, there were also television pictures from the equivalent 1956 match, when ’55-56 League Champions United beat ’56 FA Cup Winners Manchester City 1-0 at Maine Road on Wednesday 24 October, with a single goal by Dennis Viollet. I mentioned this match in my tribute to Dave Gaskell, the youngster who made his debut as a sub on that occasion. (See Remembering Dave Gaskell…) Again, I have no idea if the recordings have survived.
I have also found another rather nice example of United being referred to as ‘the United’, this time in a fairly long article written by Duncan Edwards, published after his death in Munich in February 1958.
‘Big Dunc’ wrote about ‘Why I joined Manchester United’ for the ‘Boys Book of Soccer 1959′, which was only published some months later, for Christmas in ’58. It’s a typically generous-spirited piece, full of encouragement and good advice for aspiring young players. It’s clear how proud he was of being at United and of the way youth was given its head at the club. In a section about his own debut in 1953 he says this:
‘Four other boys in their teens had made their debuts with the United already that season – outside right John Scott, centre forward Eddie Lewis, inside forward John Doherty, and outside left David Pegg – so you can see what chances there were (for young players)’. (Article reproduced in full in ‘The Big Book of United – Goalscorers & Champions’, published by James Ward, 2011)