It has been reported this afternoon that local lad, Zeki Fryers, has agreed a £20k per week contract with Tottenham Hotspur. Fryers had turned down the latest offer from United back in April which left Spurs as front runners to land the 19-year-old.
Earlier this week, when confirming that Paul Pogba had left the club, Sir Alex Ferguson claimed he didn’t know what was happening with the youngster.
Whilst there will be criticism levelled at him, it’s hard to argue with him leaving the club for such an incredible salary. Tom Cleverley is reportedly earning £40k a week at United, whilst Phil Jones and Chris Smalling are on £50k a week. Chances are he wasn’t going to make it at United, as much as we wanted him to, and he would have gone on to follow the likes of Phil Bardsley and Danny Simpson to being decent enough Premier League full-backs.
Man Utd News 24/7
Cunt.
Thank you Fred! For doing the honors.
Really though, if the rumors of him going behind United and Sir Alex’s back are true, then I couldn’t give a flying fuck. He’s gone the same day that it was announced that Larnell Cole will be signing a new deal with us. That says it all.
Can’t wait to see Evra play every game next season.
@Balaji
Correction. Cole was offered a new deal. In light of recent events, there are no guarantees that he will accept. Depends on what we offered.
Whats goin on? Are all these youngsters just Knobeads? Are utd mingebags for not paying them what they want? Is Fergie fucking up by not giving youth a chance? Is there major problems with the coaches at carrington??
Off topic park to QPRhttp://www.redforcerising.net/2012/07/06/man-utd-accept-5m-qpr-bid-for-park-ji-sung-currently-agreeing-personal-terms/
Cheerio.
£20K a week? Crazy money. Two thoughts: (1) – at the kind of £££, Spurs can have him. (2) If Fergie wanted him to stay, he’d have made sure he stayed. Since he’s gone, I’m not too worried that he’ll turn into the one that got away.
SB
Costas, Yup, we’ll see on that one though I’ll be surprised if things fall out.
I know we differ on this one. I personally feel that when youngsters feel they’re entitled to something they haven’t earned, they can fuck off. Yes, modern football doesn’t work that way. But that’s what I truly feel. As Scott posted on Twitter, Cleverley is on 40K a week, Smalling/Jones are on 50K. And these guys have years of top-flight football with multiple clubs in the form of loans or with United. There’s no way these people can be paid that much by United without overhauling the wage structure and screwing with other players. What would those other players feel if somebody who has done fuck all earns half of what they earn (and probably more than what they were earning at the same stage of their careers). It just doesn’t feel right at all.
Lol leaving a club like united for spurs (No disrespect to them ). But I still hope it does not happen. He played great against cedars beloved leeds
. I hope cedars doesn’t shoot me for this. 
In all seriousness, this is no great loss. This kid is just another jabroni who’ll be playing in the Championship in a couple of years.
On Park, although £5m represents a good deal for us, I feel Park could do a lot better than QPR. He must want to stay in England for some strange reason.
Anyway, thanks for everything Ji and all the best in your future endeavours.
A top Red. 
No great loss, highly doubtful he never would have made it anyway!
A blogger with some team contacts is saying that Zeki didn’t want to go, but that Sir Alex didn’t see a place for him moving forward. If this is true then best of luck to the lad. Done well if he is on 20K a week with only 3 senior games. United youth >>> Spurs.
natashaturk ™ @natashaturk
Do NOT listen to the crap about Zeki Fryers and these wage demands. It’s a million miles away from the truth and he’s gutted to be leaving.
Don’t think there is much to admire about AVB’s youth policy. Zeki will be lucky to get a game. Just sayin…
Definitely gonna have to buy a left-back then.
I guess we’ll see how good the Fry-guy is when he faces Antonio Valencia next season… Or maybe he’ll just watch eh?
So, Spurs fancy themselves some Chocolate fryers cream?
@Balaji
Well if we are going to compare wages, Tom currently is getting about 10-20k less than Scholes and Jones/Smalling are getting just as much. By the same logic, how should Scholes feel about this? I can’t look at this situation from that point of view, sorry.So what happens if Tunni asks for 20k next year when it’s his time to renegotiate? It’s not about Fryers himself. There’s a trend that’s beginning to develop and we don’t seem willing to follow the new standards that are set.
Anyway, as for the immediate future, I hope to fuck we get a left back.
@Willie – Is Chocolate Fryers Cream made by the same people that make the famous Negrito?
Cyril and Costas – Leighton Baines is on his way.
If PSG bid 100 million for Rooney, do we take the money?????
Cyril
“guess we’ll see how good the Fry-guy is when he faces Antonio Valencia next season… ”
Might be a tad harsh on the lad. Even AshleyCole (Certified BestLB™ in Hingerlund) has a torrid time v AV7
Fletch – sounds fishy, if he didn’t see a place for him then why was Fryers offered new a contract at all? I could see not seeing a place for him at 20k/week but not no place at all, that is unless a new signing is coming in at LB…
Fletch – Fair enough. Maybe he’ll get lucky and just have to play against Nani then?
JC – So that puts you squarely in the “I’m not buying it” category. Fair enough.
Cyril –
Fore me he looked decent and a bit lost when he played, no worries about him, of course he could develope but who cares anymore.
Costas, Ah, but that’s an unfair comparison mate. If Cleverley is more important to us next season than Scholes, then by far, he should be earning as much as the latter especially since Scholes is in the twilight of his career (came back from retirement no less). What gets me is that player who’ve done nothing to show that they deserve that money think they’re entitled to it? As I said, I don’t think we’ll ever agree on this one, but that’s how I feel. If Tunnicliffe demands that next season without having played a lot of first team football or proving that he deserves it, then I will say the same thing next season as well. That doesn’t mean I won’t be disappointed (in the case of Tunni not Fryers), but I will be able to make my peace with that.
The day Fergie almost quit; 3 Part exclusive in MEN
Maurice Watkins had another job to do:
– to tell Fergie’s soon-to-be-appointed successor that he was no longer needed!
http://menmedia.co.uk/manchestereveningnews/sport/football/manchester_united/s/1582799_manchester-united-special-the-day-sir-alex-ferguson-did-u-turn-over-quitting-reds
More chance of larnell cole signing the new deal than fryers. Cole is a grounded well mannered player whose main priority is to make it at united.
With UTD linked with Baines for the last 6 months perhaps the boy thought it best to look after himself. fair enough I say.
Cyril – Could be mate!
Utd sign Baines amd will have him with Evra this season,Fabio gets a year under his belt and Utd go forward with Fabio and Baines
I don’t understand the hype surrounding fryers. Looked alright in sporadic appearances. That gave no indication that he’d be a loss or an advantage in the team. He’s clearly not going to spurs for a first team place though, he’ll warming the bench a lot more and probably shipped out on loan. I agree with the club not offering exorbitant wages to unproven cunts. Fryers should be glad he’s getting a chance in the first place, clearly does not possess the mentality and patience to make it. Goodbye zeke!
Well I hope him the same as any other player that turns down a deal and heads elsewhere, ball rash, itchy fucking ball rash.
Too many good players coming through to worry about this one going.
Evening Reds, how long till the new season?
Samuel @ 18:04: “I don’t understand the hype surrounding fryers.”
He’s left-footed. Otherwise, OK but nothing more.
If the issue is keeping the left-back spot warm for Fabio for the year-after-next then I have to wonder what guarantees SAF got from Hughes that Fabio is going to get plenty of game-time ? After all, this is the same Mark Hughes the manager who didn’t play KikoTheKid when he was on loan at QPR.
I opened up this page and the very first post summed up how I feel, Cunt.
What the hell is going on with the young players? I thought he was decent which is why I’m annoyed. So did Fergie otherwise he wouldn’t have thrown him on for a debut vs leads and that at centre half when he’s a full back!
Oh well this is becoming somewhat a regular occurrence.
Shouldnt we not be asking why our younger players are wanting to leave? Money cant be the ONLY factor. Doesnt make sense???
James7t7 more money doesn’t make sense lol kidding right mate its the only thing that makes sense
@James7t7, Maybe Fryers heard that United were looking for a fullback to help Evra, and thought he will never get his chances and thought of moving to ‘Twatenham’ will have playing time !
Ha , he’s no good now cause he left utd, good luck to the lad , great move going to a team on the up .
Can’t see Fryers replacing Assout-Ekotto but he probably will be an understudy. Heard we’ve offered Larnell Cole a contract. We’ll sing his praises and if he doesn’t sign he’ll just be another one who “wasn’t all that anyway.”
Maybe Fryers realised he couldn’t compete with Evra, Baines (if he comes), Fabio when he comes back ——and Tyler Blackett who I think has the makings of a better player anyway.
Fryers won’t make it at Spurs and will be off to Brentford within 2 years – if he’s lucky.
Pogba won’t make it at Juventus and will be off to obscurity within 2 years. What a thick bastard heading to a club where racist support is a major problem.
And Morrison? Does he really think he’s going to play in the 1st team at West Ham in the Prem? Won’t get a game.
We’re better off with Tunni and Powell no doubt. They really want to play for United. I’ve supported United for over 50 years and it sickens me to see these 3 scumbags treating the club – our club not theirs – with disrespect and ingratitude. True Mancunian supporters would give anything to wear the shirt not bugger off south or out of the country.
I don’t wish any of them well. I hope they all rue the day they slithered away from the greatest club in the world.
Brendan the plank.
@Balaji
Well for one thing, who’s to say Fryers wouldn’t have settled for less than 20k at United? For example, if United offered me 15k and Spurs offered 20k, I’d take United’s offer. As long of course as I knew that Evra wouldn’t reach 60 before he made way for someone else. So it would be interesting to find out how much we did offer him.
There’s another factor into this. How are going to know if a player is worth 20k per week if we never see him in action for the first team? Fryers played a handful of games for the first team. That doesn’t mean he wasn’t good enough. Same applies to Pogba who found himself on the bench even when we played Blackburn at home and Fergie opted to play Rafa and Park together in midfield. Or when we played at the JJB and Fergie started a clearly out of form Giggs. I’ll be honest. Sometimes I wonder if these players (and Pogba in particular) didn’t play enough this season because we didn’t want them to raise their demands ahead of their contract negotiations. And that’s what worries me about the Tunnicliffe situation as we head into next season.
@Notorious
Hi mate. Yeah, if Cole doesn’t take the offer, he will be just another ungrateful brat that got his head turned by his agent. Same applies to Tunni, the Keanes, Thorpe, etc etc. Fuck them. Fuck the Academy too.
Playing for the first-team and being IN the first-team are totally different. Ben Amos has played for the first-team, but he’s not in serious contention to dethrone the two players above him through sheer talent, as of this moment.
Fergie has seen it all and if the kids aren’t ready or good enough, they will not be considered. Jones, Smalling, DDG, Macheda are all still kids, but have been given valuable playing time (not as much for Macheda due to injuries and bad luck). Pogba makes these hollywood passes in Carling Cup, is completely wide of the mark when he shoots and gets all cash happy.
I’ve never knocked any kids ability I trust the club to make the decision,if Sir Alex figures these lads aren’t worth 20k a week good enough for me and in turn these lads are primarily motivated by money then they don’t belong at Utd imo
Just a question!…
whenever we hear rumors about united being linked with next major 18 yr whizkid, they always mention transfer fee is minimum 20 million!!…When pogba was also considered one of these next big thing in europe n stuff why sell him for such a low amount?!?!?!?….
What appeals to me is we get a few mill for him Spurs get a bright lights boy and will be howling for years they have got a pup.
I find this very hard to believe. 20 grand a week? At fucking Spurs? No chance. They only pay Bale and Modric about fucking 40 grand. Levy is THE tightest cunt about when it comes to wages.
Whenever I hear Fryers interviewed he sounds thick as fuck anyway. They truly make me sick these bastards.
I am sorry but I just cannot get why some on here think we should pay them what they want. Why? What the fuck have they achieved? Fuck all. Tom and Danny bided their time and look whats happened.
Tunni will “demand ” fuck all mark my words. Red to the core.
RedRich – Belting post mate. Spot on.
How much were Tom and Danny making before this season? Just curious.
@wayne
Forgot to respond in the other thread, but you made a good point about Tevez’s wages. The whole thing got out of control when City started throwing money around left and right. Even Chelsea with Abramovich at the helm were quite sensible in what they paid in wages.
@ King Eric. – Hello mate, we shouldn’t pay them what they are asking for, thats fair enough it’s just pissing me off how we’re losing players that the club have hyped themselves somewhat. It’s not a huge loss but they all seem to be high profile and Fergie has talked about them before they were linked with moves away. You’re probably right about Tunni, but you said something similar about Morrison and look how that turned out? I’m not blaming you or nothing for that but something wrong when 2 Mancs want to trade it in for London.
I just don’t know with any of these players anymore.
I’m waiting to hear the full facts before making any conclusions. Too much conjecture atm.
Notorious – Hey up pal. Well to be honest mate I wasn’t convinced about Morrison. His talent yes but I knew he had it in him to be a cunt. Very shocked with Fryers as like you say he is a Manc. Games fucked mate but to me I couldn’t care less. I am more concerned with the lads that HAVE signed up pro forms. Lost better players than these lot. Loved Morrison but summat is seriously amiss when he cant get more than 5 minutes for West Ham.
Oh and youth players come and go. United’s make headline news. I am happy Blackett has signed. He is a great player. Strong as an ox.
@ Costas – Admittedly I don’t watch the reserves and most of the stuff I go by is of the little I do see or what people say on here. A couple of years back after 2010 we had discussions on how Tunnicliffe, Pogba and Morrison were all going to break through together? Well that situation sorted itself didn’t it!
We’ve waited patiently to see what happens as midfield is something that has needed to be sorted for a while but we just wait which is very unlike Man United.
Fryers thing is a part of that but if Fergie doesn’t think he is good enough for the money he wants then thats fine by me. We’ll get a paltry fee know at least if he had of signed may have got a bit more by selling him. If the rumours are true that Cleverly is on £40k and Fryers wanted £20k, then if you take that the fact they both play football out of it, I can see Fryer’s point. Should have stuck it out because its Manchester United but thats football these days.
The players Pogba aside , Fergie has hyped up are Blackett, Lingard, Cole and the Keane brothers. To be honest he rarely mentions Tunni. Hey I am no oracle and do not confess to be the expert on Youth players. I just give my ten cents on the matter and how I rate them. Was never that impressed with Pogba. First year yes then he seemed to stand still. Got himself sent off in the youth cup quarter at Anfield and then Tunni ran the show. As for Morrison yes I DID rate him. Very highly. Just a tosser though.
I’ve heard good things about Blackett, had a chat with someone about it at the gig on Sunday said he was way better than Fryers. How old is he know? 17 or 18?
NRD – 18 I believe mate.
i hope pogba tears his fucking acl ligaments on both knees. i’ve done it so i know the agony.
as for fryers and morrison, well at least their departures haven’t been so dragged on and publicised so i won’t waste my hate on those 2 cunts.
@ King Eric – Fair play mate. Oracle lol. Should rename yourself King Eric the Oracle. Morrison is a cunt fully behind the club on that one heard it from a few lads as well who I know over in Ilford.
Just frustrating seeing youth hyped and not seeing them flourish in a red shirt. The positive thing is that the production line hasn’t stopped so even IF this next bunch don’t stick around in 3-4 years we’ll have the likes of (hopefully) Jack Barmby trying to break through.
Thats a huge sign of how we’ve moved forward, couldn’t say the same thing about the youth team 10 years ago even if we did win the Youth Cup in 03.
@Notorious
I am in a similar position regarding my knowledge about the Reserves. I just go by what I read in here and what I watch when the youngsters get a run out in the Carling Cup. And like you, my memory is good enough to remember MOrrison and Pogba getting a LOT of praise in here. And in the former’s case, we didn’t find out he was a troublemaker in the last 6 months. We’ve known for years. As for Pogba, we were aware of how much respect he shows his clubs when we bought him from Le Havre. There’s only one common denominator when it comes to Pogba, Morrison and Fryers the way I look at it: We didn’t make any attempts to keep them on board until they were into the last 12 months of their contract. For me it’s a moronic strategy and one that puts more power in the player and his agent’s hands. I don’t know when Cole’s deal is up, but hopefully we’ve finally shown some quick reflexes there. But with Welbeck and Tunnicliffe’s deals expiring next summer, that’s where the big test will lie.
As for Fryers, we saw very little to know how he would have turned out. And we also don’t know if he would have settled for less at United. But for me, keeping him around and saving the Baines money on a midfielder (in light of the rumors that Ando might also leave) should have been a no brainer…
Redrich 19:06- good post .
Dont know much about this player other than ive read on this site, but the last time we bought a player this young and put him on silly money, for his age was john bostock from crystal palace, think its all gone to his head, big watch. Car etc no first team action since!
if you think daniel levy would offer £20k pw to an unproven 19 year old I afraid you have been misinformed.
Of course the lad may just have the sense to see where the real football is played,
@JC
You have to offer a contract atleast equal to their current deal to then be entitled compenation on the youth players.
But I’m pretty sure you are right and it’s not that Fergie didn’t think he had a future. United’s deal was worth £1.5k a week initially which for a player who didn’t look to have anywhere near PL potential 18months ago is a good deal. I’m pretty sure there would have been clauses based on game time which would have ramped that up and if he had done a Welbeck he would have been rewarded with a better deal fairly quickly.
He made big leaps last year hence why he got game time with the injuries but the jury was still out on him and the fact he has chosen to chase the money says a lot about him and his advisors. If he really wanted to stay and had faith in his ability he would remain at utd and works hard but he has taken the easy way out
I don’t give a flying shit about these fuckin no marks but not doubt the ABUs will be conjuring up all types of shit of Utds demise. The truth is they are not good enough and haven’t got the fuckin minerals to play for Utd -too interested in chasing an extra 5k, Glad you have gone greedy bastards don’t let the door hit you on the way out. Fuckin champions next season and then what, you see these cunts are happier counting money than they are medals. Fuck right off, don’t deserve to wear the shirt.
@RedRich
Zeki I think you may be right about. Another couple of years at United and he may have ended at a Simpson/Bardsley level (or if he could have kept his improvement going maybe even a squad player at united) but Spurs don’t even have a reserve or youth team so it’s hard to see how he can really benefit.
Pogba I’m divided on. He is class and could be world class but Italian clubs don’t have the best record of giving youngsters a chance and Juve have a strong midfield which their signings are making stronger so his chances may be limited. Even if he gets loaned out will an Italian club give him the game time that he could have got by signing a new utd deal and going out on loan in England.
Morrision is a weird one, He has supposed to have knuckled down and been turning up to training but it’s as if Big Sam won’t even trust him as a sub
Good luck to the lad but in all honesty I do not give a flying fuck
@Costas
The thing with young players though is it can be hard to judge them. At that stage they can still go either way, some of the most promising players at their age can fail to kick on while those who did well but didn’t excel can kick on
Look at the start of last season Zeki 18 months ago was nothing more than average but did improve rapidly. Pogba struggled for the first half of last season in the reserves. So Zeki played himself into a position to get games when injuries hit and Pogba played himself out of starts. Morrison ofc decided it was more fun to see how often he could get suspended by the club for missing training which meant he was either suspended or simply not fit whenever he may have been called up.
If you only have a policy of negotiating early and offering long contracts you just make a rod for your back as players may simply stagnate at a level that’s not 1st team level or you may let players go who on a shorter contract you may have given another chance to, a second chance some do take
Good luck to pogba,morrison , and fryers …
Varied views on here from cunt to best of luck.
I do however wonder why United seem to be letting so many of these players go. Morison, Pogba, Fryers. All promising youngsters who it was thought were good enough to come and make it.
On the other hand I think that if SAF really wanted them to stay 99% of the time he would have got them to sign a contract.
Larnel Cole is a good example.
The problem is though that getting chances to break in to the first team other than in the League Cup are few and far between.
It does make me laugh though how some say they wouldn’t have made it or they weren’t that good anyway.
@Wakey
If you were offered x13 your current salary what would you do?
Also perhaps he thought he wasn’t really getting a look in at United and thought he would have more of a chance at Spurs.
As United fans we think these lads should be loyal to the club no matter what the circumstances. Sometimes players have to think of their own careers rather than having little or no opportunities to develop in to better players through first team experience.
@Wakey
If you were offered x13 your current salary what would you do?
Also perhaps he thought he wasn’t really getting a look in at United and thought he would have more of a chance at Spurs.
As United fans we think these lads should be loyal to the club no matter what the circumstances. Sometimes players have to think of their own careers rather than having little or no opportunities to develop in to better players through first team experience at United. Sometimes that means leaving.
I think it’s unfair of you to say he has simply chased after the money.
Why cry over this spilt milk he’s done nothing and proved nothing let him go but please let this dispel the myth of greedy no loyalty foriegners Morrison Fryers et al no different to Pogba over hyped proven nothing nobodies good riddance to bad rubbish.
Fergie set up Levy from the start. Each week’s wage for Zeke will bring a little smile.
Pogba is a mercenary, no loss whatsoever to United (bar a few pounds spent thus far)
Morrison is a tragedy. We tried to get through, but he had built his wall too well.
Young lads want to play and. SAF ain’t budging about giving “assurances”.
it’d the same thing with Pogba. Chris smelling and Jones were not integral to their sides they had a good season. they featured and showed qualities we liked. and we got them.
why wont we do the same for ours.
it’s a different kettle of fish for a youngster playing for Blackburn than one at United. the latter has stiffer competition do ofcourse he wont feature as much.
Gutted we’re losing players this way, what’s even more painful is that it’s quite a task for youngsters from our academy to break through. Evans and Danny spring to mind but who else.
it’s fucking difficult. and it wont motivate them. it’ll scare them.
sigh
onwards and upwards. at the least, I hope this means we’ll be in the market for a full back. Christ!Still got center midfield to sort out.
hey costas lets offer every reserve player 30k/wk even if they are not good enough.
A**hole
If you prove yourself you will get your reward. whats hard to get you dickheads. Seriously did you see something in Fryers? he was ordinary. maybe he knew it too. so he took the money. No hard feeling towards him. He just didn’t go the Norwood way.
Progba was acting like a dick (like costas now, such a shame) all season. he could have made it here. get your head down, work your socks off. I bet you he would have been offered a much better deal than Juve’s after this up coming season. problem was he wanted it now.
Progba is the only loss. We will more on, no problem.
Norwood left. he was a midfielder, he need mids. he was a good passer. Nobody is making a big deal. why about fryers? they were at the same level in their respective position.
We will move on you dickheads. Its clear as day. YOU HAVE TO EARN IT.
Smelling?
As I think others have mentioned, Tyler Blackett is just as quick and also taller. I wouldn’t be surprised if Fergie rates him higher than Fryers as well.
Haha, got to love the Johnny come lately at 03:27.
Fuck him. If we give in to small fries like that we are In trouble.
Good luck ji. Wished you could have stayed a bit longer. Top red
If we had the 500m we spent clearing glazer’s mess we don’t have to give a fuck about who moves to spurs.
Very true ashwin.
I think time will tell who was right. I think SAF is the best, but
if someone want to leave…i dont think he is ungreatful. Maybe someone cant play our way of football, and maybe dont like SAF s metods. Why would anyone be a dork because of that? Some players think they have more chances somewhere else…BUT maybe SAF will be right on the end…but lets not forget that he is just a human and makeing mistakes..like everyone else…
For Capello people say that he is like Hitler…for some other coach s they say that they are great because they are “soft”…and also have results…Every coach is different…and player.
I would ask myself why young players going out…and they didnt say a word against club…and fans say that they are jerks again…on one side what every they do, they are jerks…I just hope that bad players will go to other clubs…and good will stay.
About Pogba…if SAF said that he was good and wanted him in team…then he is good. You always believe to SAF…but Pogba decide to leave…and now he is not good…
just found this……….New post on Zeki Fryers;Zeki put in a letter that he wanted to leave and that he discussed offer with family and after discussion he would decline the offer. He wished them all the luck in the future and thanked them for his time there .SAF’S secretary spoke to Zeki on Uniteds behalf on first day back at training and asked Zeki what he was doing, Zeki then said he was in talks with a couple of other clubs and that he was OK. A few hours later Fergie said on MUTV they hadn’t heard from Zeki and don’t know what’s happening? He BLATANTLY LIED on MUTV! He isn’t going for 2OK so all rumours are just hearsay; But UNITED aren’t making a move to another club easy for him. He hasn’t signed for Spurs yet, they’re letting him train with them, with a view to signing him in the near future, “MY VIEW IS IF THERE ASKING £6.000.000 FOR HIM LET THE BOY DECIDE ????” AND STOP GETTING IN HIS WAY my opinion is that if you offer a kid less than his team mates and you get other offers then why not move, and by the way, Zeki was getting loaned out to leicester, hmmmm let me see, go to leicester or try to kove to Spurs, no brainer really, if your job offered you less than your work mates for doing same job and another company offered you double dont tell me you wouldnt move. Zeki is a red and didnt want to leave united. the Glaziers are the ones to blame, not the kids